Britains Product Numbering System? (1 Viewer)

[wadepat]

Gentle Friends,

This afternoon, I began to update my Britains Inventory by adding the Delhi Durbar sets that I have recently purchased. On my inventory, I have always listed my Britains sets in numerical order without regard to what lines/ranges each set belongs. As I progressed with my chosen task, I found that I could make neither hide nor hair out of the set numbering system that is used by W. Britains. It almost seemed as if someone at the Britains headquarters had simply said, "Find an unused set number and slap it on this box!" Since my powers of numerical analysis are questionable at best, I thought I should ask someone to explain to me the numbering system that Britains uses.

Other manufacturers, for example K&C, use systems that are quite apparent. K&C uses an alpha prefix (i.e., BBA) to designate a product line, plus a sequential number for each product/set (i.e., 07, 08, etc.), and an occasional final indicator (i.e., SL) to designate a specific set status. However, the logic underlying the Britains system of determining/assigning set numbers defies my understanding. The Britains system does not seem to be totally random, yet it does not seem to be totally logical.

I think a similar question has been posted at an earlier date, but I do not remember any explanation that followed that particular posting. Can anyone provide me with an explanation regarding how Britains establishes the specific numbers assigned to each set?

I will appreciate any and all insights, including speculatory ones, that can be advanced concerning the Britains system of product numbering!

Warmest personal regards,

Pat

 

[Chuck Harris]

Gentle Friends,

This afternoon, I began to update my Britains Inventory by adding the Delhi Durbar sets that I have recently purchased. On my inventory, I have always listed my Britains sets in numerical order without regard to what lines/ranges each set belongs. As I progressed with my chosen task, I found that I could make neither hide nor hair out of the set numbering system that is used by W. Britains. It almost seemed as if someone at the Britains headquarters had simply said, "Find an unused set number and slap it on this box!" Since my powers of numerical analysis are questionable at best, I thought I should ask someone to explain to me the numbering system that Britains uses.

Other manufacturers, for example K&C, use systems that are quite apparent. K&C uses an alpha prefix (i.e., BBA) to designate a product line, plus a sequential number for each product/set (i.e., 07, 08, etc.), and an occasional final indicator (i.e., SL) to designate a specific set status. However, the logic underlying the Britains system of determining/assigning set numbers defies my understanding. The Britains system does not seem to be totally random, yet it does not seem to be totally logical.

I think a similar question has been posted at an earlier date, but I do not remember any explanation that followed that particular posting. Can anyone provide me with an explanation regarding how Britains establishes the specific numbers assigned to each set?

I will appreciate any and all insights, including speculatory ones, that can be advanced concerning the Britains system of product numbering!

Warmest personal regards,

Pat

Pat

I've wanted to ask the question you just put forth, but was just to shy to do so. Thanks for doing it for me.
Note: shy = sounding stupid

 

[Peter Reuss]

This is a very good question. If Richard has time perhaps he can answer this better than I can, but here's my stab at it.

One thing to remember is that Britains has been part of larger companies (RC2/Ertl and First Gear) and therefore 'competes' for item numbers with other things that they sell.

With that in mind, First Gear had different numbering for different lines. They started out with a lot of 00*** numbers at the beginning, but then shifted to 17*** for American Rev, Civil War, Napoleonic, and WWII. The 4***** series included most everything else.

The earlier releases began 170** and, for the most part, each year they added a number (i.e. 171**, 172**, 173**), though they didn't 100% stick to this. The numbers did get bigger over time - so in general the larger the number the more recent the release.

Now that First Gear has Britains, the numbering has stayed similar (i.e. the same series begin with 17*** and 4****), but there hasn't been as much consistency in numbering within the series. This is one thing I've talked to Richard about - it wold be nice to have more sequential numbering within the series. He explained the problem of First Gear having their own item numbers for other products which can conflict with Britains.

This is the best I can do! Maybe someone else can shed more light on it.

Pete

 

[wadepat]

Pat

I've wanted to ask the question you just put forth, but was just to shy to do so. Thanks for doing it for me.
Note: shy = sounding stupid

Chuck,

I'm glad I could be of service to you. Over the years, I think I have managed to elevate "sounding stupid" to a professional level! Now, I can sound stupid without even realizing it!

Warmest personal regards,

Pat

 

[wadepat]

This is a very good question. If Richard has time perhaps he can answer this better than I can, but here's my stab at it.

One thing to remember is that Britains has been part of larger companies (RC2/Ertl and First Gear) and therefore 'competes' for item numbers with other things that they sell.

With that in mind, First Gear had different numbering for different lines. They started out with a lot of 00*** numbers at the beginning, but then shifted to 17*** for American Rev, Civil War, Napoleonic, and WWII. The 4***** series included most everything else.

The earlier releases began 170** and, for the most part, each year they added a number (i.e. 171**, 172**, 173**), though they didn't 100% stick to this. The numbers did get bigger over time - so in general the larger the number the more recent the release.

Now that First Gear has Britains, the numbering has stayed similar (i.e. the same series begin with 17*** and 4****), but there hasn't been as much consistency in numbering within the series. This is one thing I've talked to Richard about - it wold be nice to have more sequential numbering within the series. He explained the problem of First Gear having their own item numbers for other products which can conflict with Britains.

This is the best I can do! Maybe someone else can shed more light on it.

Pete

Pete,

Thanks for the explanation. I now see some variables in the numbering system that did not occur to me. I also see the challenge it presents to the present owner of W. Britains (not to mention the challenge it presents to me for organizing my inventory in some logical way). However, for this feeble collector, it is a little like saying, "If we had some ham, we could have some ham and eggs, if we had some eggs." It kinda makes you go hmmmmm.

Can anyone explain Chaos Theory to me? An understanding of Chaos Theory may now be necessary in order for me to reorganize my Britains inventory system.

Warmest personal regards,

Pat

 

[WBritain]

Hi Pat:

I can see why you are perplexed - and its not your fault!. Pete pretty well hit the high points.

In most cases the 17*** should be for matte finish figures and the 4**** should be for gloss finish figures. There are a couple excepetions but on the whole this should hold true.

Since FG and W. Britain items go to some retailers that use the UPC system we can not effectively use alpha designators, must be numeric - again - we do sometimes use alpha designators but only for items made just for the specialty market that does not require UPC barcoding. This is where we get cornered - before FG acquired W. Britain, some 17*** and 4**** numbers had already been used for FG items. To further complicate - the UPC system allows each manufacturer only one set of five digits that is our number -then the product number follows. So this further limits the combination of numbers we can have.

Ideally we would have assigned complete bocks of numbers to each product line (that is what I wanted to do) - but due to the lack of compete blocks available it was decided that the numbers would be assigned on a first come first served basis - so they are based on when the idea was given the green light and a number issued.

I am looking at other options for 2008 and beyond and will of course try to issue blocks where possible and certainly will look at it for the future.

Hope this sheds some light (clear as mud???).

Have a great Holiday and New Year Pat - always good to see you and read your posts.

Richard

 

[wadepat]

Hi Pat:

I can see why you are perplexed - and its not your fault!. Pete pretty well hit the high points.

In most cases the 17*** should be for matte finish figures and the 4**** should be for gloss finish figures. There are a couple excepetions but on the whole this should hold true.

Since FG and W. Britain items go to some retailers that use the UPC system we can not effectively use alpha designators, must be numeric - again - we do sometimes use alpha designators but only for items made just for the specialty market that does not require UPC barcoding. This is where we get cornered - before FG acquired W. Britain, some 17*** and 4**** numbers had already been used for FG items. To further complicate - the UPC system allows each manufacturer only one set of five digits that is our number -then the product number follows. So this further limits the combination of numbers we can have.

Ideally we would have assigned complete bocks of numbers to each product line (that is what I wanted to do) - but due to the lack of compete blocks available it was decided that the numbers would be assigned on a first come first served basis - so they are based on when the idea was given the green light and a number issued.

I am looking at other options for 2008 and beyond and will of course try to issue blocks where possible and certainly will look at it for the future.

Hope this sheds some light (clear as mud???).

Have a great Holiday and New Year Pat - always good to see you and read your posts.

Richard

Richard,

You do a great job of explaining the issues involved with the Britains set numbering system. Thank you for providing a clarification of the issues. It is clear that W. Britains faces some complicated challenges in developing a numbering system that is easily understood.

Obviously, what I must do is to become more familiar with each number that is assigned to specific sets. I usually do not attempt to describe my collection to others by using set numbers, while many collectors are able to do so and be understood. A logical, uncomplicated numbering system like the one K&C has developed allows the collector to more easily remember the specific set numbers and to logically list one's collection in an inventory. Having said that about the K&C system, I will hasten to add that even that system has some confusing elements to it, but it is easier to follow and understand.

If W. Britains can face the challenge of their numbering system, then so can I. One of my New Year's Resolutions shall be: Learn to deal with the Britains system!

Thanks, again, Richard, for your insights and your excellent discussion of the variables involved with the W. Britains system of numbering! And,...

Happy Holidays and Good Health to you and yours!

Warmest personal regards,

Pat