Metal Kit Figure question (1 Viewer)

Aggie99

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I hope this is the right thread, but it says "Kit Building" so I figured it would apply.

I am about to buy a metal figure online. It is labeled as "Unpainted and Unassmebled metal hobby kit." I am not familiar with metal kits at all, and had some questions. I am hoping someone here can help me out.

1) Can I use my acryllic paints on the metal figure? I paint only plastics, and use primer and acrylic paints for them. Can I use these on metal figures for the same matte look? Or is there special paint/primer for metal figures??

2) What do you use to assemble these figures? Is it simply something like super glue? Or is it something else??

Thanks for the help. I didnt want to buy the figure without knowing what I was doing (or getting into).

I appreciate it.
 
Yes you can paint the figures with acryllics,you glue the figures together.You might want to do some minor sanding to remove mold lines.The pre-painted soldiers that you buy are basically the same.Hope this helps a little.
Mark
 
Hey, Aggie,

I'll second Mark, yes, you can use acrylics with no problems. I do use an automotive primer (Walmart's store brand), on my metal figures, but I also use it on my scale models. I use acrylics and enamels, as well as oils.

Regarding a matte finish, you can use a matte varnish or sealer. I use Testor's DullCote, again, both for metal figures and for my scale models, but there are many others on the market, some made specifically for hobbyists, and others available on the broader hardware market.

For gloss coating, if need be, I'd get a bottle of Future floor polish (now officially known as "Johnson's Kleer with Future Shine" As stupid a name as the "Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim"). It's a liquid acrylic gloss.

So, you could use a gloss paint, if the color is one that you can't find in matte, and if you don't want to try mixing your own, and then hit it with the matte sealer/varnish afterwards. Same goes in the other direction, using a matte color and hitting it with a gloss sealer. I do both.

Hope that helps!
Prost!
Brad
 
Thanks

So, I am hearing I can use the exact same paints for the metal figure. Good to know!!


But what about the glue? I figured I glue them together, but what type of glue? Super Glue??
 
Ha! I forgot about the gluing part of it. Sorry, I'm supposed to be working right now, so I'm multitasking....

For metals, one adhesive we use is cyano-acrylate or CA glue--Krazy Glue is one particluar brand, but there are brands made for the hobby industry. Heck, even my HobbyTown carries its own formula. You can find it in various formulas with different setting times, usually quick-setting, medium and long. The difference is usually a matter of seconds.

You may find, though, that you'd prefer to use a two-part epoxy. CA glue joins may tend to become brittle with age and more prone to cracking, while epoxies do not. I have finally gotten to see this in action, with Prins August figures that I cast and painted about 20 years ago. Their joints are prone to cracking, if they fall over, for example, or with a clink against something else. Pieces that I attached with epoxy do not.

That brings me to pinning the parts. You'll get a stronger joint, regardless of the adhesive, if you pin the joint. You may already use the technique with your plastic figures, though, since many plastic adhesives form a chemical weld, it's not always necessary. Pinning involves drilling holes in the mating surfaces and using a pice of wire or metal rod (or sometimes other materials) as a pin to hold the pieces together, and then applying the adhesive to the join. Pinning gives you a stronger join that can withstand stress better than a butt join (ie, two faces just butted up against one another with glue in between), and also increases the surface area to be glued (in our scales, it's the strength against stress that is more significant). A good example is pinning an arm to the shoulder. I recommend getting a pin vise and some small bits to start. If your kit comes with lugs molded onto the parts, to fit into holes, so much the better. Tradition's kits have very good, very stout lugs, for example, that almost need no glue. But even if they do, you might decide to pin the joint anyway.

Hope that helps, prost!
Brad
 
Hi!

I usual paint the parts and then glue. Then some after paint. Its much easier if you want to make the best details. Shades, chainmail etc. Good luck! And have fun! :smile2::smile2::smile2:
 
Templar,

Good point on painting before gluing. I will remember that!!



Baron,

THe pinning technique that you speak of sounds interesting and makes a lot of sense. However, I am not equip to do that as of right now. Would I have to get a special drill? Or just special...small....drill bits??

If (over-time, with just glue) the joints would start to crack...isnt that an easy fix? I mean, could I not simply re-glue the arm back on, if it were to fall off??

Finally, thanks for the glue recommendations. I see you recommend CA Glue or Epoxy...does that mean you do NOT recommend super glue??

Thanks again!

(Going from plastic to metal is more complicated that it seems...haha)
 
Hi, Aggie, I'll post my answers after each question...

...THe pinning technique that you speak of sounds interesting and makes a lot of sense. However, I am not equip to do that as of right now. Would I have to get a special drill? Or just special...small....drill bits??

My advice is to get a pin vice, which consists of a metal handle with a chuck (the part that holds the bit) at one end (some have a chuck at either end, for different ranges of bit sizes). You fix the bit in the pin vice, then drill the holes by hand. It may sound tedious, but it gives you a lot of control over the speed and pressure. You could chuck a bit into a rotary tool, eg, a Dremel, but the amount of speed and power, and the delicate nature of the bits--even milled out of steel, we're talking about thin shafts--and any pressure out of the direction of the drilling can put undue stress on the bit and break it, resulting in shrapnel. Most rotary tool manufacturers make drill press stands, which gives you more control, but it's a lot more fuss. And drilling white metal alloys, or lead, with a pin vice and a drill bit really only takes a minute or so.

If you have a local hobby shop, I'd stop in and ask about the vice and see what bits they carry. X-Acto makes a pin vice, as does Tamiya, Squadron, but you can also find them at places like Harbor Freight. As for bits, I have 3 sizes that I use all the time: .064" diameter (#52), .038" diameter (#62) and .025" diameter (#72). I think those numbers are consistent. The .064 and .038 are the ones I use most for pinning, because the corresponding diameters of brass rod or steel wire are of good diameter for pinning.

If there's not a hobby shop nearby--and that could even by HobbyTown, Hobby Lobby, craft stores like Michael's or AC Moore, or even specialty hobby stores, like a model railroad shop or radio control-check online, too. I get MicroMark's catalog, and you can order via their website, www.micromark.com. Also, try Squadron, www.squadron.com. Their store and warehouse are in Carrollton, too, don't know how far that is from where you are.

If (over-time, with just glue) the joints would start to crack...isnt that an easy fix? I mean, could I not simply re-glue the arm back on, if it were to fall off??

Sorry, when I said "crack", I meant, "broke". One of my Prins August soldiers kipped over, and his arm fell off. Granted, the lug was really just a ball that fit into a socket, so it was weak to begin with--that's where a pin would improve things, by the way. I had another one get knocked over, and his head popped off; the head had a good-sized shaft that fit into the neckhole, too. But the glue had become brittle over time. The point is, if the join breaks, it's not just gluing it back together, but you'll probably have to touch up the paint, maybe there'll be some seam work requiring putty, in short, there could be a lot of work. Even the commercially available finished figures are liable to break, as evidenced by the number of posts in our forum about repairs. So, I like to start with the strongest possible bond at the very beginning. If I could solder and not risk melting the figures, I'd use solder for more joins.

Finally, thanks for the glue recommendations. I see you recommend CA Glue or Epoxy...does that mean you do NOT recommend super glue??

Thanks again!

(Going from plastic to metal is more complicated that it seems...haha)

I wouldn't say, "Don't use superglue", it can be useful, especially for fast repairs in a pinch. A lot of guys who paint figures for shows include a tube in their travel kits, or if they didn't bring any glue, they'll use superglue as something available. But if you have the time, it's worth it to buy a glue formulated specifically for hobby use. And CA glue can be used to flow into seams or joints and fill them, too. Plus, it has the advantage of being quick-curing, so you don't have to worry about holding the piece for a long time till the glue sets. You do have to be careful not to glue your fingers together, which we've all done. Acetone dissolves CA glue, by the way, so it pays to keep a can of it on hand, for emergencies, or if you decide you need to disassemble some parts. It's the active component in nail polish remover, but I buy mine at the hardware store. For one thing, I'm a guy, so I'm not buying nail polish remover. For another, nail polish remover will tend to have scents added, and to be a more dilute strength solution, than what you'll find at the hardware store. Also, acetone can be used to clean your brushes, especially if you use enamels. I use mineral spirits for regular cleaning, then dip the brush in acetone, or even lacquer thinner (automotive supply store), when there's a build-up. Acetone can also be used to thin putty, if you use it for filling gaps (I use Squadron white); lacquer thinner can also be used to thin some putties.

Actually, moving from one material to the other isn't too complex--describing it takes a long time :D But almost all, if not all, of the supplies and tools can be used for plastic or metal. Like I said, I'm also a scale modeler, and I use all of the same tools, and most of the same paints, for a Stadden figure or for an old Monogram P-51B

This is just from my own experience, too. I like to say, for questions like these, that we'll have just about as many answers as there are painters ;)

Prost!
Brad
 
Wow guys, thanks for all the info (Especially Barron! What a post!! Thanks!)

I guess I will go on and take the leap. Who knows how this will end up...but if its any good, I will post photos at some point in the future.
 
Whether you need to pin or not really depends on the design of the kit but it's usually a good idea. It also helps to score the metal parts that will be glued together in a criss-cross pattern to give more surface area for the glue or epoxy. I don't think anyone has mentioned it yet, but you can use plain old paper clips for pinning and it helps to have the hole a just little bit bigger than the pin because it allows some wiggle room for the best fit without constantly redrilling to get the hole just right. You probably already have wire cutters in your tool box for cutting the paper clips to size.

You'll also need an exacto and/or small files for the mould lines. A little time spent cleaning up the fig will save frustration later when painting and discovering that the mould lines are really noticeable. (The rule of thumb is if you can feel the line with your fingernail, it will be visible when painted.) Dry fit everything before gluing and decide whether any parts when assembled will make it difficult to reach other areas when painting (like arms blocking the painting of the main body). If something will get in the way, assemble that part after painting and touch up the joint.

Have fun with it. :smile2:
 
I really hope these threads never go away. They are full of information that I reference and look back on. If this thread were to disappear, I would really be out of luck!
 

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