Minor repairs? (1 Viewer)

[Seanjoseph11]

Hi, I usually collect 54mm 1:32 painted figures from companies like Del Prado and K&C. I recently received NA095 twice with a snapped off plum. What is the best way to deal with this: Should I reattach the plum and how is the best way as a collector. Or do I have no choice but to keep returning the NA095 for a new one because no matter what I do any repair devalues the piece too much.

Please advice on both the harm the reapir does to the value and the best way to do this repair for a novice.

 

[The Templar]

Hi, I usually collect 54mm 1:32 painted figures from companies like Del Prado and K&C. I recently received NA095 twice with a snapped off plum. What is the best way to deal with this: Should I reattach the plum and how is the best way as a collector. Or do I have no choice but to keep returning the NA095 for a new one because no matter what I do any repair devalues the piece too much.

Please advice on both the harm the reapir does to the value and the best way to do this repair for a novice.

Hi and welcome on board!

You can´t make a repair and still save the value - sorry! In fact, you may count on a significant value drop almost regardless how "nice" you can fix it! Get a new!

If you choose to fix it - use some model clue - ex. Zap-A-Gap (http://cgi.ebay.com/1-4-Oz-Zap-A-Ga...in_0?hash=item5ad232ada0&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14) - but watch out for your fingers!

Hope this solves your problems! And keep up collecting!

 

[jazzeum]

I would return as there is no need to be stuck with a broken piece. Any repair will diminish resale value although depending on an item's rarity the loss may not be that bad.

As to how to fix it, I leave that to others more expert than me.

 

[skeeterbuck]

I would also agree to send it back as long as another is currently available.

My personal opinion is that I don't think any of the Del Prado figures are going to be that valuable in the future. I base that on the amount that are being produced and the lower quality of the painting. As to the K&C, if you buy a rare figure at a reasonable price with MINOR damage, you can have it repaired. If properly done, the repair should be invisible.

I usually like to repair my figures using solder as IMHO if done correctly will last as long as the figure itself. It's impossible to say the correct way to fix a figure without seing the damage that needs repairing.

Hope this helps, Chuck

 

[Spitfrnd]

Soldering is an art that is beyond me for such fine scale work. Crazy glue works extremely well and if applied carefully in the right proportions is invisible so long as the break is clean. If not, I would definitely send it back. There are materials that can be used to plug gaps but then you would need to touch up the paint, which is challenging for the novice.

 

[theBaron]

Or you can adopt my philosophy-I don't care about the dollar value of any given figure, only whether I enjoy it. But I don't say that, to knock you for worrying about it. And I would certainly expect a vendor to provide an undamaged good on order.

Having said that, in general, if you wanted to fix that kind of a break, cyano-acrylic glue will work (CA glue, one commercial formula is Krazy Glue, but your better off getting a formula made for modelers), but you'll improve the repair by pinning the join, if at all possible.

Pinning consists of drilling a hole in the two pieces at the point where the break occurred, and inserting a piece of wire or rod. This strengthens the joint, because it increases the gluing surface, and for our figures, the pinning material is usually stronger than the white metal alloys used to cast the figure.

Even for a piece as delicate as a plume in 54mm, where you might not be able to drill a hole in the material, I would make a notch in it, that would fit over a piece of wire or rod, because that would still be stronger than a simple butt join.

I have also tried a tip I got one time, to wrap the piece with a piece of facial tissue and soak it with CA glue. I tried that with a broken bayonet on a 54mm musket. It didn't look as nice, because the surface was still a little fuzzy.

Soldering would also work, but as Scott noted, it takes some practice to do it right. I only solder figures to bases, using pegs cast in the figures' feet, and not for anything else yet. I'm not confident enough with the technique.

Once the joint is repaired, you can touch up the paint.

As I noted above, this all occurs once you've decided whether to repair, or return the item.

Hope that helps, prost!
Brad

 

[Grognard]

I would return the item and asked for a new one or return it and ask for a refund. The plume is very difficult to fix on this one. I recently ordered NA093 and received it with a broken plume (I won't mention the retailer). I returned it and asked for a replacement which I got. Unfortunely the first and then the second replacement (yes I tried 2 times) also arrived damaged (same spot). At that point I just gave up and asked for a refund which was provided. Looks like I will never get that one... When you pay the full price, you should expect the best.

 

[Whistlinghen]

Soldering is an art that is beyond me for such fine scale work. Crazy glue works extremely well and if applied carefully in the right proportions is invisible so long as the break is clean. If not, I would definitely send it back. There are materials that can be used to plug gaps but then you would need to touch up the paint, which is challenging for the novice.

I am wary of Crazy Glue as I have read that it is more likely to promote lead bloom (a disease so terrifying it must be whispered) than some other glues. I'm currently using an ph neutral white glue (which doesn't have much strength) in conjuction with pinning for that kind of repair, although even that may also prove to be folly in the long run. I have only the barest knowledge of chemistry, but I think that almost all glues (all that I've run into) have some acid content (I wonder if that plays a part in the bonding), and the acid tends to cause the oxidation that results in lead bloom. I read on a site concerned with preserving the lead fittings on model boats that silver solder is the only real long term fix. The war against lead bloom is truly an intergenerational struggle, and in the end, the laws of physics will have their say, as entropy sets in. As for resale value, someday, my daughter will be cursing me for repainting my Britains and decreasing their resale value, so I would recommend doing whatever seems the most fun!- Emily

 

[Spitfrnd]

I have never heard of lead bloom and find nothing about it on the web by that name. Five minute two part expoxy is a step up from superglue and better for parts under stress. Both of these come in many different kinds offered in shops selling metal kit models. I do know a few figure manufacturers have recommended superglue for minor repairs.

 

[thebritfarmer]

I have never heard of lead bloom and find nothing about it on the web by that name. Five minute two part expoxy is a step up from superglue and better for parts under stress. Both of these come in many different kinds offered in shops selling metal kit models. I do know a few figure manufacturers have recommended superglue for minor repairs.

It is more commonly called lead rot I believe Bill.

 

[Spitfrnd]

It is more commonly called lead rot I believe Bill.

Ah thanks mate. I have read that was more of an issue with previous generation metal formulations used for figures and rather rare today.

 

[Whistlinghen]

I've read the same- I should have specified that I mostly work with old Britains, which I mostly buy off Ebay. Some of these actually crumble in your hands upon arrival. Cheers, Emily

P.S.Here's a site dealing with it: http://www.dt.navy.mil/cnsm/lead_01.html

 

[DMNamiot]

Hi Guys,

We had a pretty deep discussion of Lead rot a while back in the Vintage area since its mainly an issue with the "lead" figures. The newer formulas used in the metal of our current figures is susposed to be a better defense against lead rot.

I also dont like to use crazy glue and tend to go with JB Quick Weld. It is a 2 part epoxy that is moldable for a brief time before it hardens so its easier to blend on things like leg joints etc. I have not used it on a Shako Plume but I imagine it could be done if you are handy. However if the figure is still available then by all means return it and get the replacement.

Dave

 

[Spitfrnd]

....I also dont like to use crazy glue and tend to go with JB Quick Weld. It is a 2 part epoxy that is moldable for a brief time before it hardens so its easier to blend on things like leg joints etc. I have not used it on a Shako Plume but I imagine it could be done if you are handy. However if the figure is still available then by all means return it and get the replacement.

Dave

That sounds interesting. Is this the product you mean?
http://www.jbweld.net/products/jbweld.php
Are there any special challenges to mix and apply it in sufficiently small quantities that you can use it for fine repairs?

 

[skeeterbuck]

Unless you collect old toy soldiers like Britains, you don't need to be concerned with lead rot. Even back to the 60's, makers were using pewter and other white metals in thier figures.

As to sivler solder with lead, I don't think that would be possible. The melting temp for silver solder is higher than the melting temp for lead. The lead casting will melt before the solder.

When I build or repain any white metal figure, my first choice is low temp solder. I does take a little pratice but so does other parts of our hobby. I find the main areas of concern when soldering figures are...

1. Like all soldering tasks the surface must be clean
2. Use the correct solder and flux for the task. A little goes a long way.
3. Be able to control the temp of the soldering iron or torch
4. Pratice

The next time I get a figure to assemble, I'll try to remember to take some pics of what I do and the results.

Don't get me wrong, super type glues and epoxies have their uses in figure construction, but for me they are mainly for repairing a figure that has already been painted.

 

[DMNamiot]

Hi Bill,

Thats the stuff. I usually mix up a small glob(very technical term here) about the size of pea. I use a toothpick or one of the thin popsicle sticks/tongue depressors to mix the two portions together. I usually mix up slightly more then I think I will need just to be sure I have enough to mess with. The only drawback is it dries black so you will need to paint the repair once it is set. There are other clear epoxies out there that come in fairly easy to use syringes that look like they will be clear when they dry so I would recommend you shop around to see what is available and will be the easiest to use.

Dave

 

[Wraith]

I use JB Weld for some repairs (of all descriptions). I find it's not the easiest of 2 parts to use, due to a fairly thick mix, but it is the toughest / strongest I've found.

 

[theBaron]

That's interesting, I haven't ever heard of CA glue in connection with lead rot/lead bloom/lead oxide. Has anyone tracked down any sources to confirm that?

Prost!
Brad

 

[Whistlinghen]

That's interesting, I haven't ever heard of CA glue in connection with lead rot/lead bloom/lead oxide. Has anyone tracked down any sources to confirm that?

Prost!
Brad

I think this is where I read it:

http://www.arcforums.com/forums/air/index.php?showtopic=187671

The issue in this case seems to be the oxidizing lead expanding and bursting the seams of the finished models. I have no confirmation of any of this. There seems to be almost as much superstition as science on this subject (For example, I've read you SHOULD handle your figures as the oils on your skin are good for the figure and that you SHOULDN'T because of the acids on your skin are bad). Was it Winston Churchill who said something to the effect of, "If the British Empire should last a thousand years, we will fight the black dog of lead rot on the beaches...".- Cheers, Emily

 

[aujj65]

I think this is where I read it:

http://www.arcforums.com/forums/air/index.php?showtopic=187671

The issue in this case seems to be the oxidizing lead expanding and bursting the seams of the finished models. I have no confirmation of any of this. There seems to be almost as much superstition as science on this subject (For example, I've read you SHOULD handle your figures as the oils on your skin are good for the figure and that you SHOULDN'T because of the acids on your skin are bad). Was it Winston Churchill who said something to the effect of, "If the British Empire should last a thousand years, we will fight the black dog of lead rot on the beaches...".- Cheers, Emily

That’s quite interesting reading, but I believe it refers more to lead weights and not to modern white metal castings which should have a small or non existent lead content due to health and safety reasons. I hope so as I have used super glue to assemble many hundreds of figures over the years!

Jeff