What is a Master painter (1 Viewer)

[Cardigan600]

Yo Troopers, often wondered how do you class a Master painter. I mean tradesmen we know have to serve their time like say Draughtsmen. But how do you class a Master Painter in Toy or Model Soldiers, who gives them the title. We have some great painters on the forum, but are any Master painters, I mean Jeff uses a distemper brush for my stuff lol, (only kidding mate) Must tell you this one. When I was repairing the Stadden QOH Drum Horse riders plume, and wanted to paint the gold ring around the plume.
Aeroart got me thinking on this one, saying all their painting is done by Russian Master painters. So can someone explain what a Master painter is, and who gives them that title.
Bernard.

 

[skeeterbuck]

Bernard, To my knowledge, you don't go to school and get a master painting diploma. I sure companies like Aeroart have painters that learn the trade and the best painters work on the top of the line figures. They may be referred to as master painters.

If you have a chance to attend a figure show/competition and check out some of the entrants, you will quickly see what I would call master painters. Also, sometimes some of the scale modelling mags have a article about a show and will list some of the winners. Either way you can get an idea about the level of painting I am talking about. I can paint a nice glossy toy soldier figure, but the stuff these folks do is just humbling.

I'm sure if you do a internet search, you'll come up with some examples. LIke http://www.mfcashow.com/page6/grand.html

Chuck

 

[Scott]

Mike Leonard! There's a local name. Henri Lion, he once criticized my Cliff Sanderson pirates and *****es display because of sex and violence.

 

[Spitfrnd]

Mike Leonard! There's a local name. Henri Lion, he once criticized my Cliff Sanderson pirates and *****es display because of sex and violence.

I assume he meant together since just about everything in this hobby is about violence?

 

[Scott]

What I have noticed from collections posted here is that there is no major amount of gore. That's NOT a cop out as so much military subject matter can be shown w/o it. The pirates and ***** series had a figure of a pirate in the act of raping a woman. I had converted that set and a number of pirate and Sanderson fantasy figures to Napoleonic era, adding the Monarch figures of Spanish infantry. It looks a little like a Goya etching. I can see the point now but the officials hid my figures w/o telling me. (They knew me and it was a small venue)

At that time, D&D fantasy figures were big and the "Br*@sts and lizards" figures were on display at the same event.

I can laugh now. This incident my be why I was never a master painter as I didn't go to the conventions afterward. Or.. I was a good painter.

 

[theBaron]

Yo Troopers, often wondered how do you class a Master painter. I mean tradesmen we know have to serve their time like say Draughtsmen. But how do you class a Master Painter in Toy or Model Soldiers, who gives them the title. We have some great painters on the forum, but are any Master painters, I mean Jeff uses a distemper brush for my stuff lol, (only kidding mate) Must tell you this one. When I was repairing the Stadden QOH Drum Horse riders plume, and wanted to paint the gold ring around the plume.
Aeroart got me thinking on this one, saying all their painting is done by Russian Master painters. So can someone explain what a Master painter is, and who gives them that title.
Bernard.

One criterion would be recognition from an organization that promotes the hobby, such as the British Model Soldier Society or my organization, the Miniature Figure Collectors of America. We both hold annual exhibitions, with standard criteria and judging that is generally accepted in the larger community, and issue awards to modelers. Of course, much more of the content is in the connoisseur area than in the classic toy soldier style, at least in our show. I think the BMSS has more categories for classic toy soldiers.

Another criterion, absent a formal organization that represents the collecting community, is the informal communication among members of the community. That is made much easier today, of course, with the Internet and forums such as ours. But think about the example of Britain's Redcoats/Bluecoats-Britain issues a new figure, within hours, we see it on the Web, we know who the painters are, or find out shortly thereafter, and we can get a quick sampling of opinion, and record acclaim or displeasure.

That's by no means an exclusive set of criteria, but those were two things that came to mind, when I saw Bernard's thread.

Prost!
Brad

 

[The Lt.]

My humble opinion of a master painter is someone who can bring a figure or item to life with his or her painting skills no matter what i it's made and from what I've seen from time to time there's a selected number of them out there who fit the bill.

 

[Cardigan600]

Yo Troopers, many thanks for the input. I get the picture now. So its only the people who want to enter these shows, and usually have to be members that get these titles. So in theory we could have many better or as good as painters that dont bother, for their own reasons. As we know there are some class act painters on the forum, who IMHO opinion could match some of these master painters. Question for Brad do you ever find at these shows like all shows there is sometimes a inner power circle that can say swing the verdict to one of their friends, and people walk away muttering I was robbed lol. Seen this type of thing happen in dog shows etc.
Bernard.

 

[trooper]

Bernard, I used to judge at BMSS shows for many years and can assure you that there are always people who feel they wuz robbed, it goes with the territory. In my experience judging is always done by at least two, but usually three judges for each competition. An initial sweep will exclude all those entries which are obviously out of contention. Those that are left are then examined in detail and more are removed for uniform inaccuracy, missed paint, faulty alignment etc. The half dozen or so that are left are then examined in even greater detail until a common concensus is arrived at and positions awarded accordingly. I well recall one competition where a figure that was obviously of a lower painting standard took first place amidst great uproar until it was pointed out that he alone had fulfilled the criteria for that competition, all the rest should technically have been disqualified, but rather than do that the judges awarded him the first place then judged the remainder in the normal way. An unusual decision, but in my opinion the correct one.

 

[beating retreat]

Hi Guys

Ive been reading this thread with much interest and agree in part with what both Bernard and trooper have said. Quite rightly Bernard asks the question what makes a master painter, I personally think its the skills that are displayed in not only the painting but the construction and display of a figure or diorama, skills that painters like myself can only dream of achieving, the painters Im thinking of are Bill Horan, Mario Venturie, Max Longhurst, Mike Blank there are many more but just looking at their work inspires me to work harder on the figures I work on,although I would feel rather embarrased if I was in a competition and my figure was stood at the side of one of these guys figures.

As for judging Ive been to many modelling shows and have seen a lot of figures that I personally thought should do well but didnt. The question I have to ask is what makes the judges qualified to judge, especially work from guys like the ones Ive mentioned above, of course if these guys were judging (which I know they have in the past) then I can accept that, but Im not sure about all the judges in the BMSS are qualified except they have been in the "Gentlemans Club " a long time ( this is why I am not a member anymore) Trooper please dont take offence to this as I dont know your background it is not intended at you personally but at the the BMSS in general. This is just a personal view gained from my past experiences with the BMSS

Regards John

 

[trooper]

No offence taken. I quite understand your comments re the BMSS and agree with you entirely. As for my qualifications as to judging I have been in the model soldier business for 50 years this year. I started as a painter, went on to production including mould making, casting and animation then progressed on to master patterns.
I also agree with you reference Max Longhurst and the rest of the elite that you mentioned. Gentlemen all of them. Unfortunately there are also one or two "divas" who strut about convinced that they are the only true artists and resent anyone who is placed above them in competition.

 

[theBaron]

A lot of good comments, and it looks like they're falling into the two broad general areas I was talking about, the term is either a formal title awarded in competition, or it is a compliment awarded to an artist by the collecting community at large, after people have a chance to see his work.

And it looks like several of us share some of the same experiences, whether having served as judges in competitions, or as visitors at a competition or exhibition, and thinking either that we could do better, or admiring some really outstanding work

Yo Troopers, many thanks for the input. I get the picture now. So its only the people who want to enter these shows, and usually have to be members that get these titles. So in theory we could have many better or as good as painters that dont bother, for their own reasons. As we know there are some class act painters on the forum, who IMHO opinion could match some of these master painters. Question for Brad do you ever find at these shows like all shows there is sometimes a inner power circle that can say swing the verdict to one of their friends, and people walk away muttering I was robbed lol. Seen this type of thing happen in dog shows etc.
Bernard.

Bernard, to address your question--I've heard one or two people who didn't get an award, and who felt that they should have, make that sort of claim. But it really is baseless, the process is about as fair as it can be, when we consider that there are criteria, but judging is, after all, making a subjective statement about a piece of work.

Prost!
Brad

 

[kilted vampire]

Master painter in the Industry is the person who paints a prototype figure for production. Say a guy like Compton Creel. I am going to try out for such a position soon.

 

[Njja]

I would certainly say a Master Painter would start with someone like

Ken Osen and work there way down. At the very bottom would be me....

sitting with my can of spray paint and a Q-Tip to wipe off the excess!

I would assume a Master Painter would have a degree of formal training and

a tremendous amount of talent!

 

[kilted vampire]

I would certainly say a Master Painter would start with someone like

Ken Osen and work there way down. At the very bottom would be me....

sitting with my can of spray paint and a Q-Tip to wipe off the excess!

I would assume a Master Painter would have a degree of formal training and

a tremendous amount of talent!

Talent helps but I am self taught.

 

[Njja]

Talent helps but I am self taught.

........................................................................................................

Yes but I have seen your work, and you have talent!

On the other hand (as in my case) Pigs can't be taught to fly! I checked

that one with Beaufighter!