DD024 nostalgie (2 Viewers)

[JPB]

Ok, but who used this figure in which setting? Anyone? Polar Bear?

JP

 

[JPB]

Basically if I have read wikipedia correct this tank should be placed in a pacific setting !?

Or should it be elsewhere?

JP

 

[theBaron]

The M3's were used in North Africa by the US and British armies (a nod to the earlier posts in this thread ), and the Lee was also used early in the Pacific theater by the US. I think some were deployed on Guadalcanal, along with the M2 light tank, before production of the Sherman began to take off.

Not sure, offhand, if the M3 had been completely replaced in the Mediterranean theater, once North Africa was liberated and we had invaded Sicily, but I suspect that it may have been, by then.

The M3 really represented a last gasp of tank design dating back to the First World War, with its hull sponson for the heavy gun, and lighter turret. Its silhouette was a little high and slab-sided for combat against other medium or heavy tanks, or anti-tank weapons.

Prosit!
Brad

 

[binder001]

The M3's were used in North Africa by the US and British armies (a nod to the earlier posts in this thread ), and the Lee was also used early in the Pacific theater by the US. I think some were deployed on Guadalcanal, along with the M2 light tank, before production of the Sherman began to take off.

*** No sir, not Guadalcanal. That fight was managed by M2A4 and M3 light tanks ("Stuarts"). The major Pacific battle for the M3 Medium was on Kwajelein.

Not sure, offhand, if the M3 had been completely replaced in the Mediterranean theater, once North Africa was liberated and we had invaded Sicily, but I suspect that it may have been, by then.

*** Yes, the M3 Medium was completely replaced after North Africa was secured. Really only a limited number were used in Tunisia, mostly because of the several hundred Shermans that were sent to the British Eighth Army. Some of those M4A1s were repossesed from the 1st Armored Division who then took a battalion of M3 Mediums to Africa with them.

The M3 really represented a last gasp of tank design dating back to the First World War, with its hull sponson for the heavy gun, and lighter turret. Its silhouette was a little high and slab-sided for combat against other medium or heavy tanks, or anti-tank weapons.

*** Actually yes and no. The basic design was influenced by WW1 experience and Infantry preferences resulting in the M2A1 Medium. British experience in the desert showed the need for a tank gun with better HE capability. Army Ordnance knew it would take time to get a new design (which became the M4-series) into production. The US Army also had a surprising amount of French influence in tactical thinking, and I'm sure the Char B influenced the M3 Medium's design. The M3 wasn't perfect by any means but it did get a 75mm gun into action long before the M4 became available. The M3 also gave the rapidly expanding US Army a machine to train their new Armored Force.

Gary

 

[JPB]

Thanks for all this info.

So basically in the colour it was released by KC the M3 Lee was used in the pacific.

By which means did these tanks get on land? Who has pictures?

Which KC sets do you suggest to use as opponents?

JP

 

[jazzeum]

The M3 really represented a last gasp of tank design dating back to the First World War, with its hull sponson for the heavy gun, and lighter turret. Its silhouette was a little high and slab-sided for combat against other medium or heavy tanks, or anti-tank weapons.

Brad

Gary has answered this in a way but the M3 Grants were a big advantage at the time they were introduced in the Desert War. Up until then, the Commonwealth forces had nothing to effectively combat the Panzers: the Vicers, the Stuart and Matildas were ineffective against those kinds of tanks. The M3s helped level the playing field a little bit.

 

[binder001]

Thanks for all this info. So basically in the colour it was released by KC the M3 Lee was used in the pacific. By which means did these tanks get on land? Who has pictures? Which KC sets do you suggest to use as opponents? JP

Actually, the K&C paint scheme from the box, with the white stripe on the turret is correct for North Africa or stateside training. The few photos from Kwajelein show basic OD tanks with minimal markings. For reference see the recent book:

Rolling Thunder against the Rising Sun: The Combat History of U.S. Army Tank Battalions in the Pacific in WWII by Gene Eric Salecker (Hardcover - May 10, 2008)
Buy new: $34.95 $23.07 20 Used & new from $21.88

This is the listing from Amazon.com.

The book has the story and photos of M3 "Lee" Medium tanks in the Pacific. Your opponents would be the K&C Iwo Jima Japanese troops.

Gary


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[binder001]

Gary has answered this in a way but the M3 Grants were a big advantage at the time they were introduced in the Desert War. Up until then, the Commonwealth forces had nothing to effectively combat the Panzers: the Vicers, the Stuart and Matildas were ineffective against those kinds of tanks. The M3s helped level the playing field a little bit.

Not just the tanks. The 37mm and 2-pounder could have a fair chance of defeating most Axis tanks in the desert, until the arrival of later Pz III and Pz IV, and they could still be penetrated from the side.

The biggest advantage of the 75mm was its HE shell. The Germans were experts at using forward deployed AT guns, not just the famous "88" but the 5cm and 7.5cm guns. The British armor had no way to engage those guns. A 2-pounder had no HE capability and the 37mm had only a small shell. The British either had to withdraw from contact or charge the guns to get within MG range. Those tactics caused many casualties and cost tanks. With a 75mm HE weapon the tanks could sit back and shell the AT guns into submission or retreat. One of the things Monty did with Eighth Army was to reorganize the scattered artillery into a more powerful concentrated force, also making life tough for Axis defensive positions.

Gary

 

[JPB]

Actually, the K&C paint scheme from the box, with the white stripe on the turret is correct for North Africa or stateside training. The few photos from Kwajelein show basic OD tanks with minimal markings. For reference see the recent book:

Rolling Thunder against the Rising Sun: The Combat History of U.S. Army Tank Battalions in the Pacific in WWII by Gene Eric Salecker (Hardcover - May 10, 2008)
Buy new: $34.95 $23.07 20 Used & new from $21.88

This is the listing from Amazon.com.

The book has the story and photos of M3 "Lee" Medium tanks in the Pacific. Your opponents would be the K&C Iwo Jima Japanese troops.

Gary


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So I should use my repaired DD024 in an Africa setting?

 

[binder001]

Yes, that is the most historically appropriate use, but you can use it wherever it pleases you - it's YOUR model.

Gary