Hanomag Symbol ID please (1 Viewer)

ok i found another picture with the red skull, and on my book
it says : Sturm III Ausf. C 1 Battery Abt 192 (attach to the 131 infantry Div.) XIII Armee-Korps, 2. Armee Hereesgruppe (Mitte) june 1941


Hope it helps again


Serge :)
 

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The SdKfz 251/1
Is from the 14th Panzer Division.
Probably from:
Panzergrenadier Regiment 108, 7th company.


Note the extensive listing of victories was probably the total for the entire company rather than this one vehicle.


Serge:)
 
Since i dont have anything to do today, Here is another photo. Lol.

Thats the last one. Its sturmgeschutz-iii-ausf-b


Serge. ^&grin
 

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Phantom Warrior said:
The descriptions are to make the model sound good and the symbols to make them look good. The descriptions and symbols are often correct - but not always. Andy sometimes takes artistic liberties (or sometimes just makes a mistake) and there are many such examples. :) Andy is first a salesman and promoter and second an excellent graphic artist and toy maker comes in at 3rd place.

Terry
Click to expand...

Thanks, Terry, that's pretty much what I thought. I was curious whether there was a claim to undisputed accuracy, like depicting a specific soldier's vehicle, or more of a generic subject. If there were a claim on the box to represent a specific subject, that would help in searching for more info about it (and give us more ammo for discussion ;) )

Prost!
Brad
 
King Tiger II said:
i do have something close to the Stug III Ausf. B


look at both photos. maybe it will help


Serge
Click to expand...

Serge ,

The Panzer Colors series I , II & III by Bruce Culver are/is great reference material...I got them myself...
I reccommend them to anybody who doesn't own them...

Joe
 
King Tiger II said:
The SdKfz 251/1
Is from the 14th Panzer Division.
Probably from:
Panzergrenadier Regiment 108, 7th company.


Note the extensive listing of victories was probably the total for the entire company rather than this one vehicle.


Serge:)
Click to expand...

Hi Serge.

I'm curious as to what info leads you to think it Rgt 108 and the 7th Company?

Terry
 
theBaron said:
Thanks, Terry, that's pretty much what I thought. I was curious whether there was a claim to undisputed accuracy, like depicting a specific soldier's vehicle, or more of a generic subject. If there were a claim on the box to represent a specific subject, that would help in searching for more info about it (and give us more ammo for discussion ;) )

Prost!
Brad
Click to expand...

How much historical accuracy is too much?

The SdKfz 251 that K&C made is an Ausf C. The K&C description is This ubiquitous German fighting vehicle could be seen on every German battlefield from the Caucasus in Russia to Cyrenaica in Libya and all points in between. Our battle-weary, dust covered “feldgrau” (field grey) version is perfect for early to mid war battles and campaigns in Poland, France or the Soviet Union. Vehicle comes with fixed driver and detachable MG34 and antenna.

This description is genericly correct as far as SdKfz 251 goes. But Ausf. C wasn't produced until 1941, long after the Battle of France ended in May 1940. The reality is that there were some Ausf A in Poland in 1939 and some Ausf B in France in 1940 and they were all 2/3 dark Grey and 1/3 dark brown. It wasn't until later in 1940 that AFVs were to be painted one colour - dark grey. It's not difficlt to tell an Ausf A from an Ausf B from an Ausf C, but the differences are not that significant. Hardly enough to economically make 3 different versions and two paint schemes for early war Hanomags.

Terry
 
Phantom Warrior said:
they were all 2/3 dark Grey and 1/3 dark brown.
Click to expand...

That comes with a very very important caveat. The brown was visible only if one stood within a few feet of the vehicle. That from a Brit Intel pamphlet wrt sealion. So that makes it essentially meaningless at our scale
 
Hi Fellow Collectors... Thanks to everyone who did some digging for info... I've learn't more from this thread than a heap I have read in the past months...:salute::

To keep the ball rolling attached is a pick of "WS087 - Halt" Would I be right in say this Feldgendarmerie team is from the 116th Panzer Division because of the "Windhund (Greyhound) Division unit logo and as such the Feldgendarmerie Trupp (motorized) 419 was attached to that division.... ?


WS087 - Halt - 04sA.jpg

Cheers
Marc
 
Blowtorch said:
That comes with a very very important caveat. The brown was visible only if one stood within a few feet of the vehicle. That from a Brit Intel pamphlet wrt sealion. So that makes it essentially meaningless at our scale
Click to expand...

True the colurs were very hard to tell apart at any distance but I don't know if it is true that it shouldn't be on a model. The black on dark Green on some US Shermans was also very hard to see at any distance but Honour Bound made a very good model with those colours.

Terry
 
barneywomble said:
Hi Fellow Collectors... Thanks to everyone who did some digging for info... I've learn't more from this thread than a heap I have read in the past months...:salute::

To keep the ball rolling attached is a pick of "WS087 - Halt" Would I be right in say this Feldgendarmerie team is from the 116th Panzer Division because of the "Windhund (Greyhound) Division unit logo and as such the Feldgendarmerie Trupp (motorized) 419 was attached to that division.... ?


View attachment 146302

Cheers
Marc
Click to expand...

Not so fast Marc. The 116th Panzer Division started out as the 16th Infantry Division in 1935. After the Battle of France in mid-1940 it was split into the 16th Panzer Division and the 16th Motorized Infantry Division which got the name Windhund and the Greyhound emblem. It was upgraded to the 16th Panzergrenadier Division in 1943 and then upgraded to the 116th Panzer Division early in 1944. All three formations used very similar Greyhound symbols.

Terry
 
Phantom Warrior said:
Correction - I think only the last 2 formations used the greyhound symbol.

Terry
Click to expand...

Hi Terry, yes I think your right with your correction. I can only find 1 Feldgendarmerie unit attached to the 116th Panzer division which was the Trupp 419 (Motorized) althoug I can find very little about them.

cheers
Marc
 
Sorry for my mistake but its the 1st company and not the 7th company,

I confused both numbers.


Also im still looking the "S" on the Stug III.

Brb soon.

Serge. :)
 
Hi Guys,

Many thanks to Terry (Phantom Warrior) for finding out all of that fascinating unit details on the “251” and the 16th Motorized Infantry Division which later became the 16th Panzer grenadier Division before finally ending up the 116th Panzer Division.

As for the Feld gendarmerie figure…I believe the motorcyclist himself was called “Rolf” and came from Dusseldorf and once owned a dog called “Spot”…The standing “Chained Dog” went by the name of “Willi”, was a former policeman, loved to play soccer and lived with his mum ’n’ dad in Hamburg. But then again…I’m probably wrong. Anyway guys just having a little fun – many thanks for the additional info…it’s always useful!

Best wishes and happy collecting,

Andy C.​
 
King Tiger II said:
Sorry for my mistake but its the 1st company and not the 7th company,

I confused both numbers.


Also im still looking the "S" on the Stug III.

Brb soon.

Serge. :)
Click to expand...

Serge ,

Looking at my Panzer Colors III , it states as follows...numbering of assault guns included a wide variety
Of practices. Some battalions used letters to identify the batteries , or letter-number combinations to identify the battery and vehicle position...

Joe
 
The Sturm.-Abt. 192 used different coloured totenkopf (white, green, yellow and red) to identify each of the three Kompanie and HQ.. They also used serif style numbers to identify each specific Stug. In 1941, a Sturm.-Abt. had 3 Kompanie (or Batterie) of 6 Stugs each, later increased to 7 and late in the war increased to 10 or 14 Stugs. With HQ Stugs, a late war Sturm.-Abt. could have 31 or 45 Stugs.

Sturm.-Abt. 192 used serif style numbers to identify individual Stugs.

StugIII_192_1.jpg

The "S" at a 45 degree angle is for some special us. Maybe it designates the Kompanie commander.

Stug Serif.jpeg
 
Joe,


Nice find you did,

Indeed they says that they used letters to identifies the batteries.


@ Terry. Thanks for all the detailed info and really nice photo about those Stugs.

Serge. :)
 
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