How much would it cost to produce a US halftrack? (1 Viewer)

[larso]

I've said a few times that the major item missing from WW2 plastic is a US halftrack. I know good ones have been done by 21C and FOV but they're not really 'playable' in the sense the 1970s Airfix vehicles were, or BMC's Tiger 2 and Sherman of slightly more recent times.

In anycase I was wondering just how much doing a vehicle like this wouls be? Below is a picture (not a great one....) of the Airfix 251/1, with a couple of Matchbox 'SS' guys with it.



I got (again) to thinking of this when I assembled a very basic 1/100 Hanomag from ZVEZDA. Here is a picture of the components - all eight on them.



So does anyone have any idea of how much it might cost to do such a thing for a US halftrack? Surely it would be a winner? Thoughts?

 

[Plastic General]

The "PROBLEM" is that the HALF-TRACK market has been cornered by 21Cent Toys and FOV.
Anyone who tries to do it "AIRFIX style" will loose their shirt, unless they do something that has not yet been done in 1:32.

 

[larso]

It's more the exercise, than seeds of a plan. From rough memory, the people on the forum who've produced sets of figures talked about $15 - $20,000 but that included sculpting, which was probably $500 a figure? This wouldn't be as expensive in that wat but you'd need someone who could design/cut the different parts so that they fitted together properly.

 

[Plastic Fan]

For reasons mentioned above, I doubt that we'll see general production of anything like this, but it seems like a fertile ground for 3D printing. Imagine a "Flames of War" armor selection in 1/32 scale!

For example: http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:310476/#comments

 

[Plastic General]

For reasons mentioned above, I doubt that we'll see general production of anything like this, but it seems like a fertile ground for 3D printing. Imagine a "Flames of War" armor selection in 1/32 scale!

For example: http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:310476/#comments

AGREED! When the 3-D PRINTER comes of age and maturity,
its going to do to the toy soldier hobby, what NAPSTER did to the MUSIC INDUSTRY!

Plastic General

 

[Plastic Fan]

AGREED! When the 3-D PRINTER comes of age and maturity,
its going to do to the toy soldier hobby, what NAPSTER did to the MUSIC INDUSTRY!

Plastic General

Yeah, unfortunately, that may still be a ways down the road.

I wonder if something like this would be a viable project for a kickstarter initiative?

 

[Mirof]

Perhaps with any chance you could find this one on e-bay or ..


or Forces of Valor

 

[larso]

All up, I have about four? The 21C, FOV, New Ray and CTS. They're all ok (or very good) in their way, though none quite suitable for a kid to push around on the floor. That's what I'd like, something to compliment the BMC and Airfix vehicles which are really playable.

I see the BMC vehicles are $10 from Bill himself and $14 elsewhere. These seem to indicate that they can be produced for a pretty modest price.

 

[Oldallamerican]

All up, I have about four? The 21C, FOV, New Ray and CTS. They're all ok (or very good) in their way, though none quite suitable for a kid to push around on the floor. That's what I'd like, something to compliment the BMC and Airfix vehicles which are really playable.

I see the BMC vehicles are $10 from Bill himself and $14 elsewhere. These seem to indicate that they can be produced for a pretty modest price.

I believe I see what you are getting at. I have ended up with more FOV and 21st C vehicles than I first thought I would when they first came out. After all, I am really more in to 19th C and before. But I've been able to get some good buys and they are beautiful models (and I still enjoy WW2). But IMHO, the higher quality vehicles strengths as models kind of inhibits their value as toys. After all, who wants to take a $50+ model out in the dirt or roll across the floor. And there's no way I'm going to get some of my little guys out for my grandkids and let them use my expensive (and somewhat fragile) FOV tanks to arouse their interest in history and toy soldiers. But Bill McMaster's Shermans and Tigers are perfect; nice enough to impress, durable and inexpensive enough for real play.

I talked with Bill a couple years ago at the Texas Show and he said the same thing. I mentioned I hoped he would come out with some earlier German tanks. Even CTS manages to do the job - I know they are small, but they are better than the old Marx tanks we used to play with that were too small (and I'd have hated to be in their Panther when that Battleship main gun went off).

And face it; 21st C and FOV vehicles' prices will continue to rise as they become more rare and who wants to "play" with a collector's item? I believe there might be a market not only within the "hobby" but also a more general market. What small boy (and I guess more girls now) can resist an Army tank?

 

[Plastic Fan]

But IMHO, the higher quality vehicles strengths as models kind of inhibits their value as toys. After all, who wants to take a $50+ model out in the dirt or roll across the floor. And there's no way I'm going to get some of my little guys out for my grandkids and let them use my expensive (and somewhat fragile) FOV tanks to arouse their interest in history and toy soldiers. But Bill McMaster's Shermans and Tigers are perfect; nice enough to impress, durable and inexpensive enough for real play.

I think that's exactly the issue for many of us.

I talked with Bill a couple years ago at the Texas Show and he said the same thing. I mentioned I hoped he would come out with some earlier German tanks. Even CTS manages to do the job - I know they are small, but they are better than the old Marx tanks we used to play with that were too small (and I'd have hated to be in their Panther when that Battleship main gun went off).

The CTS armor (including the U.S. Halftrack) was a little small, even for the Marx/Airfix 1/32 scale figures, and now with the "new" 1/32 scale figs being produced by TSSD (and the CTS 'tweener scale) they've lost some more ground.

I doubt that CTS has much motivation to produce anything like this, since it could render their existing inventory less appealing.

And most of the modern mass-produced sets skimp on the scale of vehicles even more than the old Marx sets. I guess it's just a trope in the industry that if you're more interested in the toy aspect, you have no interest in scale, since kids can use their imagination to make up the difference.

 

[Plastic General]

This whole desire to make toys for children perhaps makes no sense.
Little kids are not the educated enthusiasts collecting & buying these items.
If someone has to risk a fortune so that you can play on the floor with the grand kids, than true 1:32 scale will not be an important issue.
CTS TANKS, will serve that purpose just fine.
If that new company SELLTOY, does what it says its going to do, "create 1:32 vehicles that have not been done yet"
than they will be successful contributing forward to our great hobby.
NOT going backwards.

Plastic General

 

[larso]

"I talked with Bill a couple years ago at the Texas Show and he said the same thing. I mentioned I hoped he would come out with some earlier German tanks."

What did he say? I think his two tanks were copies of some New Ray diecast (?) ones? So there were parts/molds already to use. They've been available for a while, so the lack of any follow up suggests they sold modestly.

Bill was a great source of help to me when I tried to get my own plastic line up a few years ago. I've always been impressed with his approach - looking to put affordable toys into the hands of kids.

 

[larso]

"The CTS armor (including the U.S. Halftrack) was a little small, even for the Marx/Airfix 1/32 scale figures, and now with the "new" 1/32 scale figs being produced by TSSD (and the CTS 'tweener scale) they've lost some more ground.

I doubt that CTS has much motivation to produce anything like this, since it could render their existing inventory less appealing."

Agreed, with a dozen vehicles in their 'Marx' scale it would be crazy to start doing them all again in 'true' 1/32. Mind you I see they advertise their new-ish Hanomag as 1/32, whereas all their others they declare to be 1/38. I guess this is meant to replace the Airfix one and they won't have to pay any royalties for it. I did read once that when they acquired the rights to the Airfix vehicles they wished they'd done their own at 1/32 so they'd all match. Oh well.

I don't mind the CTS, the size is not too bad, indeed being slightly smaller you can fit a few more into a scene. As my very modest D-day display shows -



The infantry is mainly Airfix, with a few black Matchbox for my SS. The US halftrack is the New Ray one. The AT gun TSSD's. There is a lot more that I couldn't fit in....

 

[larso]

"This whole desire to make toys for children perhaps makes no sense.
Little kids are not the educated enthusiasts collecting & buying these items.
If someone has to risk a fortune so that you can play on the floor with the grand kids, than true 1:32 scale will not be an important issue.
CTS TANKS, will serve that purpose just fine.
If that new company SELLTOY, does what it says its going to do, "create 1:32 vehicles that have not been done yet"
than they will be successful contributing forward to our great hobby.
NOT going backwards"

Making toys for kids is quite worthy but obviously there is not a great demand for WW2 amongst them. You are more targeting the fathers/grandfathers - like many of us, but again, a limited and declining market. And sure, scale is not an issue for kids, hence the ongoing practice of putting 1/72 vehicles or whatever in the play sets. But a valid point was made about fitting TSSD/Conte etc into the smaller halftracks. It doesn't work so well.

I have no intention for anyone to spend a fortune to meet the modest demand for this product. But there may well be a return if the build/production is $20,000 (for arguments sake) and you sell 5,000 - at $15 - $20 even if it takes 5 years. The sales of TSSD's Germans suggest that this would be reasonable. The upcoming movie Fury would give it all a boost too.

Anyway, time to get on the floor and make a Lego castle with my 4yo. We'll then have an adventure with a dinosaur and some of my old Airfix!

 

[Plastic Fan]

I think his two tanks were copies of some New Ray diecast (?) ones? So there were parts/molds already to use. They've been available for a while, so the lack of any follow up suggests they sold modestly.
..

Not sure about the Tiger Tank, but the Sherman and the Amtrack were part of the BMC Iwo Jima set, which was a plastic version of the King and Country Sands of Iwo Jima line. (Done with K&C's permission).

I think the New Ray diecast line came at least a year or two later.

 

[Jack]

Anyway, time to get on the floor and make a Lego castle with my 4yo. We'll then have an adventure with a dinosaur and some of my old Airfix!

Larso, we are the dinosaurs these days!

 

[larso]

"Larso, we are the dinosaurs these days!"

Indeed we are! In fact the time/opportunity for this particular idea was ten years ago. The second 'Golden Age' of plastic was in full swing and a decades worth of potential buyers were still alive!

If my own venture, Anzacs, a few years before had worked I'd have given it a crack myself. I also would've been set to surf nicely on The Lord of the Rings films too.

With those Anzacs - I'd currently be busy organising a resissue for next years Gallipoli centenary. Oh well...

 

[Jack]

"Larso, we are the dinosaurs these days!"

Indeed we are! In fact the time/opportunity for this particular idea was ten years ago. The second 'Golden Age' of plastic was in full swing and a decades worth of potential buyers were still alive!

If my own venture, Anzacs, a few years before had worked I'd have given it a crack myself. I also would've been set to surf nicely on The Lord of the Rings films too.

With those Anzacs - I'd currently be busy organising a resissue for next years Gallipoli centenary. Oh well...

You should float that idea over dinner tonight.