King & Country U.K. (1 Viewer)

[Charlie Brown]

I don't recall precisely how long it's been since JJD/UK shut down, but these closures do seem to indicate that the UK is a tough place to operate in these days.

The wider decline of the hobby has been well discussed for many years. Noticeable how the number of collectors is literally gradually dying out.

 

[graycap]

Sad news. I found K&C UK always very friendly and helpful. I hope all goes well from them in the future. There was not a hint of this at the Toy Soldier Show a couple of weeks ago.

Will certainly try ordering from Hong Kong and see how that works out in terms of comparative cost and the HMRC!

 

[Spanish soldier]

I do not understand much higher prices when sales decrease and collectors

Please, a little common sense


Francisco

 

[Peiper007]

The wider decline of the hobby has been well discussed for many years. Noticeable how the number of collectors is literally gradually dying out.

I agree with Charlie Brown, we are seeing a steady decline in our hobby, at the shows the collectors are of a certain age......... I have noticed a few things with K & C, they have priced themselves at an unstainable level [for our friends in the USA, simply look at he $ price and then calculate by 1.43 and then you get UK price for today], continue increase in price, new entrants into the market and much more choice.

 

[Peiper007]

I agree with Charlie Brown, we are seeing a steady decline in our hobby, at the shows the collectors are of a certain age......... I have noticed a few things with K & C, they have priced themselves at an unstainable level [for our friends in the USA, simply look at he $ price and then calculate by 1.43 and then you get UK price for today], continue increase in price, new entrants into the market and much more choice. means there has been a significant change in our hobby and collectors do not stick to a particular manufacturer but mix and match. I have to say there are newer manufacturers such as Thomas Gunn which I now buy as it fits with K & C and is more value.

 

[Normandy1944]

it is a loss for all of the king And country Toy Soldiers collectors. this would also affect the London show, I think. KC UK was a big stand holder there.


Harry

 

[uksubs]

I agree with Charlie Brown, we are seeing a steady decline in our hobby, at the shows the collectors are of a certain age......... I have noticed a few things with K & C, they have priced themselves at an unstainable level [for our friends in the USA, simply look at he $ price and then calculate by 1.43 and then you get UK price for today], continue increase in price, new entrants into the market and much more choice.

Well said

 

[Jack]

I wonder what percentage of their business was conducted face to face. Many people have said how nice the owners were but did many people on the Forum go into the shop? Where is Spennymoor in relation to the collector base?

 

[Peiper007]

I think we are very close to this and are too close. We see it as a hobby but K & C UK was a business, set up to make money by selling to collectors. It boils down to they are not selling enough, or you could say the reverse, we are not buying enough, so why?

Too Expensive - yes in the UK, cannot blame import due or taxes as all countries have taxes etc and in the EU they are all roughly the same. Here is an example, the new FW190 is $259 dollars in the US, that would be £181, the actual cost in the UK is £291, if changed back that would be $416, would our fellow collectors in the US buy at that price?

Other Choices - more manufacturers in direct competition. Plus there are a number of collections coming on to the market.

Less buyers - Collector are dying off, at the London show the average age is well over 50 and many retired people on a fixed income.

Quality of product - this is linked to price and other manufacturers, I think the quality of other manufacturers such as Thomas Gunn is on a par with K & C as is John Jenkins and both are at a significant lower price.
Look at the two competitive German Guns sets bought out by Thomas G and K & C.
K & C - 2 jerry cans, 1 rifle, 1 panzerfaust and 2 MGs - £30
TG - 1 LMG on stand, 2 rifles, 2 panzerfausts, 2 MP38/40, 2 Bazookas, 2 MG42s and 2 other MGs £40

Which would you buy?

I was going to put something on the forum abut two recent sets I have bought which I thought were quite poor,
BBG87 - 2 dead soldiers, firstly no weapons [as there were with the 2 dead TG set I bought], but secondly the scale, they look like children in uniform next to the other sets.
BBA83 - the faces on the 2 figures are very poor, I bought on-line [from Italy] and would not have bought if I saw them up close. one figure does not stand up unless in the position in the picture of the set.

Marketing - I put this in as the amount of places in the UK where you can see and buy toy soldiers has declined in the UK, I know of only two place which have a good selection, Magpies Evesham and London Toy Soldier Centre. There are bits in places like Treasure Bunker in Glasgow [they stopped stocking new K & C as it was too expensive], but little anywhere else. this has stopped impulse buying which can start a collection/hobby. London Toy Soldier show, the stuff out on display was very little and there was not the buzz around the stand there used to be, a few years ago you used to struggle to get near the stand.......

What they actually make - this is very subjective and is of course personal choice but there has been some quite baffling releases? Knights of the Round Table? Film tie ins, which I know some people like, but they go nowhere once you have collected the few figures in that range. ranges just tail off and there is no consistency in releases.

 

[Hadrian]

As official German K&C Dealer let me Allow to say a few Words please:
First of all it is very, very sad that Mike Neville closed K&C UK, Great loss for all collectors in the UK, For the London Tony soldier Show and For all his Friends. I Owe him a Lot, he was so helpfull, when I started my Own Toy soldier Business Hadriansvilla in 2008.
Thank you Mike (and thanks to your Family) For all your Support, hopefully you Are Personally Fine, all the best For you and your family.

I Do Not know the Reasons For the closure, but since more than 2 years all the European Dealers Suffer from a very Bad currency relationship to the USD, Next Problem is the very high Transport cost.
For example wehen I Buy from K&C HK vehicles For 1.000 USD, Fedex charges my account with 400 USD For shipping! That Means 40% on top ! As this is only the net price, there is Not to forget 4,7% Customs Duty and finally (in Germany) 19%vat. So There is not enough margin For Dealers to live from the K&C Business, if you offer your figures with about the Same price as K&C HK does it. If you offer your figures with a higher Price, you Will Not sell enough, May be you will stell nothing!
Finally the Things like K&C exclusive figures, where is no Dealer Discounter is given, Do Not help either..

As far as I know, there are three or more K&C Dealer, WHO gave up in Europe within the Last 12 months...I Personally can only survive with My business because it is only Web based (no expansive window shop) and because I have some other manufacturers with a Bit better Margins.
And Last but Not least because of my loyal Clients...

Just My thoughts

 

[Phantom Warrior]

As official German K&C Dealer let me Allow to say a few Words please:
First of all it is very, very sad that Mike Neville closed K&C UK, Great loss for all collectors in the UK, For the London Tony soldier Show and For all his Friends. I Owe him a Lot, he was so helpfull, when I started my Own Toy soldier Business Hadriansvilla in 2008.
Thank you Mike (and thanks to your Family) For all your Support, hopefully you Are Personally Fine, all the best For you and your family.

I Do Not know the Reasons For the closure, but since more than 2 years all the European Dealers Suffer from a very Bad currency relationship to the USD, Next Problem is the very high Transport cost.
For example wehen I Buy from K&C HK vehicles For 1.000 USD, Fedex charges my account with 400 USD For shipping! That Means 40% on top ! As this is only the net price, there is Not to forget 4,7% Customs Duty and finally (in Germany) 19%vat. So There is not enough margin For Dealers to live from the K&C Business, if you offer your figures with about the Same price as K&C HK does it. If you offer your figures with a higher Price, you Will Not sell enough, May be you will stell nothing!
Finally the Things like K&C exclusive figures, where is no Dealer Discounter is given, Do Not help either..

As far as I know, there are three or more K&C Dealer, WHO gave up in Europe within the Last 12 months...I Personally can only survive with My business because it is only Web based (no expansive window shop) and because I have some other manufacturers with a Bit better Margins.
And Last but Not least because of my loyal Clients...

Just My thoughts

A cottager and his wife had a Goose that laid a golden egg every day. They supposed that the Hen must contain a great lump of gold in its inside, and in order to get the gold they killed her. Having done so, they found to their surprise that the Goose differed in no respect from their other Geese. The foolish pair, thus hoping to become rich all at once, deprived themselves of the gain of which they were assured day by day

Sounds like the Goose is being choaked to death. Is the future fewer toy soldier dealers and more direct sales from the manufacturer. Or lower margins for the manufacturers. Or higher retail prices.

Terry

 

[Old Bill]

I was deeply saddened (but not at all surprised) to hear the news of King & Country UK ceasing business -The latest and heaviest blow yet to the UK’s Toy soldier community. I wish all concerned much luck in future endeavours and thank them for the sterling service they provided me with.

Why the does the UK in particular seem to be faring so badly though?
Prices yes, are a very strong cause. Strong competition between manufacturers - yes certainly, ( summed up rather nicely by my good LTSS friend Pete: "So much to collect, not enough cash, too much choice, not enough space........"
BUT there is to my mind one deep underlining factor for this situation in the UK that no one seems to have touched on:

As has been stated, visitors to the LTSS are predominately in the over 50’s and upwards age group (People who were bought up before our State began slowly eradicating, re-writing and apologising for Britain’s Military history - Indeed Britain’s history in general) they have an understanding and appreciation – indeed pride - of their Nation’s history and past achievements. All things I think, that link most Toy Soldier Collectors.

Basically, over here hardly any young people are coming through. Nothing at all here has inspired them to collect Toy Soldiers.

Last one out please turn off the lights!

“Just thinking”………

 

[Artillery_crazy]

Old Bill,
I see what you say, but in good military tradition one falls fighting....:salute::{sm4}....if everyone of us passes the interest to our sons and grandsons the hobby will not die!! I am doing my bit with my sons ... {sm4}{sm4}..get them to like collecting, set dios that they can help assemble, get them to help in taking pictures.....take them to shows and museums.....talk to them about the different soldiers and AFVs you have in your collections.....^&cool
Cheers
Artillery_Crazy

I was deeply saddened (but not at all surprised) to hear the news of King & Country UK ceasing business -The latest and heaviest blow yet to the UK’s Toy soldier community. I wish all concerned much luck in future endeavours and thank them for the sterling service they provided me with.

Why the does the UK in particular seem to be faring so badly though?
Prices yes, are a very strong cause. Strong competition between manufacturers - yes certainly, ( summed up rather nicely by my good LTSS friend Pete: "So much to collect, not enough cash, too much choice, not enough space........"
BUT there is to my mind one deep underlining factor for this situation in the UK that no one seems to have touched on:

As has been stated, visitors to the LTSS are predominately in the over 50’s and upwards age group (People who were bought up before our State began slowly eradicating, re-writing and apologising for Britain’s Military history - Indeed Britain’s history in general) they have an understanding and appreciation – indeed pride - of their Nation’s history and past achievements. All things I think, that link most Toy Soldier Collectors.

Basically, over here hardly any young people are coming through. Nothing at all here has inspired them to collect Toy Soldiers.

Last one out please turn off the lights!

“Just thinking”………

 

[Hadrian]

Old Bill,
I see what you say, but in good military tradition one falls fighting....:salute::{sm4}....if everyone of us passes the interest to our sons and grandsons the hobby will not die!! I am doing my bit with my sons ... {sm4}{sm4}..get them to like collecting, set dios that they can help assemble, get them to help in taking pictures.....take them to shows and museums.....talk to them about the different soldiers and AFVs you have in your collections.....^&cool
Cheers
Artillery_Crazy

...so do I with my son, I think this is the right way.
And I think, the problem is not, that most collectors of K&C are 50 + aged (most of the younger collectors 14 plus...have no own money and can only collect cheap plastic figures).
The main problems for the stronger, bigger collectors are: no more space, not enough money/to high prices, and regarding K&C sometimes too often repetitions (for example himmler,heydrich,hitler, Tiger,repainted crusaders, repainted WW1,repainted TRW bore some of my clients and they complain about that)

 

[Old Bill]

Old Bill,
I see what you say, but in good military tradition one falls fighting....:salute::{sm4}....if everyone of us passes the interest to our sons and grandsons the hobby will not die!! I am doing my bit with my sons ... {sm4}{sm4}..get them to like collecting, set dios that they can help assemble, get them to help in taking pictures.....take them to shows and museums.....talk to them about the different soldiers and AFVs you have in your collections.....^&cool
Cheers
Artillery_Crazy

That is most heart warming to hear! However I have one daughter - and no grand children, so no-one to pass my interest on to - you are blessed!
I can assure you that no matter how interested she is in my hobby (and she has learned an awful lot about history through this, (that she wasn't taught at school) she would never consider buying Toy Soldiers!

I still stand (and fall!) by my original post. I was referring to the continuing decline of the Toy Soldier market in the UK and how I feel it has come about through culture change.

Best wishes to you and your sons - keep the flag flying!

 

[uksubs]

I was deeply saddened (but not at all surprised) to hear the news of King & Country UK ceasing business -The latest and heaviest blow yet to the UK’s Toy soldier community. I wish all concerned much luck in future endeavours and thank them for the sterling service they provided me with.

Why the does the UK in particular seem to be faring so badly though?
Prices yes, are a very strong cause. Strong competition between manufacturers - yes certainly, ( summed up rather nicely by my good LTSS friend Pete: "So much to collect, not enough cash, too much choice, not enough space........"
BUT there is to my mind one deep underlining factor for this situation in the UK that no one seems to have touched on:

As has been stated, visitors to the LTSS are predominately in the over 50’s and upwards age group (People who were bought up before our State began slowly eradicating, re-writing and apologising for Britain’s Military history - Indeed Britain’s history in general) they have an understanding and appreciation – indeed pride - of their Nation’s history and past achievements. All things I think, that link most Toy Soldier Collectors.

Basically, over here hardly any young people are coming through. Nothing at all here has inspired them to collect Toy Soldiers.

Last one out please turn off the lights!

“Just thinking”………

To be honest at £50.00 a figure it not a cheap hobby to get into and think most young people could think of a lot better ways to spend there money on , most young kids are into Star Wars or Super heroes also which are cheap to buy

 

[PanzerAce1944]

This is sad news for our Hobby. K&C UK was a major Dealer there. We all as collector's need to band "Together" to promote the Hobby in a positive light to draw in more new collector's.
No doubt the VAT in the UK made things more expensive. Collector's here in the U.S. most times can order from an out of state dealer and avoid Tax and get Free shipping on purchases of
$100.00 or more..... a huge difference ! Wishing all the best for the Health of this Hobby !

Wayne

 

[marco55]

We here in the states holler about prices but when I see the same stuff selling for a lot more in the UK I wonder how there are any collectors left over there at all.
Mark

 

[jazzeum]

We here in the states holler about prices but when I see the same stuff selling for a lot more in the UK I wonder how there are any collectors left over there at all.
Mark

You're trying to equate our economy to theirs Mark but the cost of living is different. That is why the prices in both markets differ.

 

[uksubs]

You're trying to equate our economy to theirs Mark but the cost of living is different. That is why the prices in both markets differ.

Brad but he right , it cheaper by a mile to import your toy soldiers than buy in the UK