Recent Imperial auctions? (1 Viewer)

[Drum]

It's my understanding that the Cowes employed and trained the fellas that eventually went across the street (almost literally) and started Regal.

Prior to their departure, the "leader" of what became the Regal contingent was responsible for these two renegade series. First, this guy arranged for the purchase of a large number of specially packaged sets for an American group who alternately identified themselves as a major supplier to military PX stores and a naval/military museum to be opened in Norfolk. Va.

Based on that arrangement, the Cowes and co. busied themselves with meeting that American order and produced the Officers and Men series. This became a bitter pill for Imperial as, I believe, the order was canceled at the last minute and after a certain portion of the product had already been delivered. Imperial was never paid for the Officers and Men sets that they did deliver.

The second "scandal" was the Gordon HS sets. I am not completely sure whether both a Gordon HS1 and a Gordon HS2 were both produced. It may have only been HS2.
Anyway, this was another deal propagated by the Regal guy while still at Imperial. I believe that this fellow was getting too big for his britches at Imperial and made an arrangement, quite independent of the Cowes, to sell Gordon painted HS sets to a toy soldier dealer in West Point, NY. Cowe believes that there may be 5-6 sets or so out there like this.

Anyway, when Cowe found out that these soldiers had been made, it was the beginning row of what eventually led to the departure and creation of Regal.

Does that sound close to your understanding of the story, Rob?

D


PS: One reason I favor inclusion of both of these sets is that it is so much fun to chase these. If I don't include them, then I only need on wee piece of cardboard to complete our collection. If I do, then I can continue searching for the Carrier Deck crew and, of course, Gordon HS sets.

 

[vandilay]

Drum from the bits and bobs I know [and it is only bits and bobs ]that about sums it up , I think the O and M series was described as a bit of a disaster.

To add insult to injury They where also family friends I believe ,
and he made his initial contact with said US store on a trip to OTSN
representing Imperial that led to these HS sets and Regal.

I guess in buisness how things have changed I cant imagine manufacturers
these days sending product without being paid although doing buisness on a
local level its still fairly common to have terms of 20th of the month following completion.

But At the end of the day Imperial are still [When David is Back on his feet ] producing their fantastic figures and that is what counts [not to mention quality].

I can understand wanting to keep a couple on the wanted list as its all
part and parcel of collecting me thinks

 

[Drum]

Sitting here with my "Mum" in the office (she plays my secretary once or twice a month to keep me organized) and reading her your response and it seems you have only added fuel to her argument by mentioning the incorrect box designation.

I counter-argued that the first picture in that auction shows a brown paper box with the hand written designation of "Gordon HS2" and that should suffice, but now, thanks to you, she is even more entrenched against including the Gordon set(s) in the collection.

I guess I will have to seek those privately.

That same guy who bought the set no.4 with the picture box also bought the Gordon set. Whether he knows it or not, he has quite an elite little Imperial collection now. At least one that I envy.

Cheers,
D

 

[dkelly]

Drum and Rob,

Interesting discussion on the O&M and the HS sets. I personally think once Drum track downs the O&M deck crew (saw one on Ebay last year) and gets the insert for set 4 he will have the "complete" and "official" Imperial collection. Maybe we will even have a photo catalog one day before I die showing all those wonderful sets I imagine the unauthorized HS set is not the only oddball set of Imperial that was released over the years. In fact, my guess is that they have done special paint jobs on other sets too over the years - indeed, I'm certain people have asked for that.

Dan

 

[Drum]

I hear you, Dan, but I really doubt that last comment. In many conversations in which I have tried to pry the details about all this from David (it's hard to get NZ'ers to say a mean thing about anyone, I think) the one thing I am fairly sure of is that the Cowes have always striven for zero deviations and really tried to limit the repaints.

I highly doubt that Imperial did much in the way of "custom" jobs, other than exact remakes of their own figures, is those that we know of.

D

 

[vandilay]

Drum when I bought my odd set of lancers [originally from the same US shop] he also mentioned thier was a letter with them from imperial [which I never recieved] and from memory their was maybe one or two other similar sets listed at the time.
[to be honest I didnt realise anything was different as I hadent seen the originals] So Dan you are correct I think.

I know the town and around series figures have been painted different
colours on occasion at customers requests .
If these guys had gone to all the trouble of repainting a set as large as the HS i,m pretty sure it wouldnt have been the first time .

 

[dkelly]

Agree with Rob. I like the idea of a 50E - light blue coats - representing a certain Indian lancer unit.

 

[theBaron]

As to whether to include or exclude known copies from a collection, I would include them, as a curiosity. To me, that would be part of the interest of the subject of the collection, to have found a known copy of the legit items. And in some areas of collecting, there are out-and-out copies that are almost as valuable or sought-after as the originals they copy.

Prost!
Brad

 

[Drum]

No question on the variations in Town and Around and I forgot about the odd Lancers. I forget what he told me about those off hand, but I wrote it down in my notes so I have it somewhere.

Still and all, aside from the T&A variations, I think any variations from Imperial are the exception rather than the rule and should be considered pretty rare in the grand scheme of things.

A couple other minor examples exist in a few ACW sets, but these were mostly updates to paint color based on feedback, etc. The Union dark blue was lightened after both painters and customers had difficulty distinguishing it from black. The Butternut infantry has some color variations as well.

D