Tank Identification (1 Viewer)

[Phantom Warrior]

Fitzgibbon saw this tank at a military show in Australia. Can anyone identify what type of tank it is?

Terry

 

[Louis Badolato]

Looks kind of like a Japanese Chi Ha Tank, done up in gray, maybe to resemble a captured T26 Tank in the Spanish Civil War.

 

[waynepoo]

Fitzgibbon saw this tank at a military show in Australia. Can anyone identify what type of tank it is?

Terry

Was with Bob that day and knowing nothing about Jerry tanks I have no clue but I tell you some blokes from the bush down under can turn a old water tank into anything so it may have started life as a farm tractor or something who knows.....:wink2:
Wayne.

 

[Fitzgibbon]

Was with Bob that day and knowing nothing about Jerry tanks I have no clue but I tell you some blokes from the bush down under can turn a old water tank into anything so it may have started life as a farm tractor or something who knows.....:wink2:
Wayne.

Terry has done some digging and fact is stranger than fiction...enjoy the journey

 

[Phantom Warrior]

Well, it didn't start life as a farm tractor. It is an actual AFV that saw combat - or at least most of it did. ^&grin And it does have some features of a Chi-Ha type tank,, but many features that are not. And it has been painted German grey, but it wasn't always that colour - that's the 3rd colour it has been.

Terry

 

[Phantom Warrior]

Looks kind of like a Japanese Chi Ha Tank, done up in gray, maybe to resemble a captured T26 Tank in the Spanish Civil War.

That's a good start on figuring it out Louis.

Terry

 

[TomB]

Was with Bob that day and knowing nothing about Jerry tanks I have no clue but I tell you some blokes from the bush down under can turn a old water tank into anything so it may have started life as a farm tractor or something who knows.....:wink2:
Wayne.

Good point......there were a lot of tanks in Aust after the war ... stripped down and used as tractors ....a lot of scraps yards had turrents...guns...tracks ...you name it available....use to climb around the bits and piece's when I was a kid....I have seen a Grant made from parts from a scrap yard....I think the bit the tracks were stuck on was from a old farm,converted tractor....TomB

 

[DMNamiot]

Hi Guys,

I agree with Louis that it appears to be a Japanese Tank or possibly a variant of the Russian T70 Light tank from WWII I might be able to tell you if I could see the track better and the road wheels it looks like there are 5 road wheel with 2 support rollers but I cant say for sure. Do you have a better photo of the track?

Dave

 

[Jack]

Identification will have to occur without my help but having stood beside it, I am almost certain that you could throw rocks through the armour.

 

[Phantom Warrior]

Identification will have to occur without my help but having stood beside it, I am almost certain that you could throw rocks through the armour.

You must have quite an arm {eek3} I suppose you are a fast bowler rather than a spin bowler. ^&grin

Terry

 

[Phantom Warrior]

Hi Guys,

I agree with Louis that it appears to be a Japanese Tank or possibly a variant of the Russian T70 Light tank from WWII I might be able to tell you if I could see the track better and the road wheels it looks like there are 5 road wheel with 2 support rollers but I cant say for sure. Do you have a better photo of the track?

Dave

Fitzgibbon took the photo ^&grin (Who is the guy standing behind the tank in the photo?)


The tank does have 5 road wheels and 2 return rollers.It is difficult to see in the shadows.

Here is a T-70 - 5 rubber rimmed rollers and three (3) return rollers.

And a T-70 is pretty small compared to the one we are trying to identify.

The road wheels are close but the return rollers and the track are not.

Terry

 

[Jack]

The guy behind the tank was not with us so presumably just a random member of the public.

 

[Jack]

You must have quite an arm {eek3} I suppose you are a fast bowler rather than a spin bowler. ^&grin

Terry

Only in my dreams ...

 

[johnnybach]

Fitzgibbon saw this tank at a military show in Australia. Can anyone identify what type of tank it is?

Terry

Don't know - but by the look of the wind-sock in the background - it will never get off the ground. On second thoughts - the clue is on the turret - It's a II35.

Always a pleasure to help. jb

 

[Phantom Warrior]

That's as light as I can get the wheels

Terry

 

[Phantom Warrior]

Don't know - but by the look of the wind-sock in the background - it will never get off the ground. On second thoughts - the clue is on the turret - It's a II35.

Always a pleasure to help. jb

Brilliant. Using the windsock clue and the II35 gives us a Halifax II 35 Squadron RAF c. 1942. And it has a turret. Close but not quite

 

[theBaron]

I thought of a Chi-Ha first off, too. Following the subsequent posts, it occurs to me that you're right about the T-70 origins, or some similar, small Russian design, as the basis for the finished tank. The road wheels look the same, though the glacis has been modified and re-shaped. I'm reminded of other examples of ex-Soviet or East Bloc armor, especially from the defunct Yugoslav army, used to build convincing versions of WWII tanks. The Tigers in "Kelly's Heroes" were built on some T-## chassis, if I remember correctly, and the hull of the StuG in "Band of Brothers" was cobbled together from 2 tank hulls, to get the requisite number of road wheels (albeit of much larger diameter than on the Pzkw IV chassis).

Prost!
Brad

 

[Phantom Warrior]

I thought of a Chi-Ha first off, too. Following the subsequent posts, it occurs to me that you're right about the T-70 origins, or some similar, small Russian design, as the basis for the finished tank. The road wheels look the same, though the glacis has been modified and re-shaped. I'm reminded of other examples of ex-Soviet or East Bloc armor, especially from the defunct Yugoslav army, used to build convincing versions of WWII tanks. The Tigers in "Kelly's Heroes" were built on some T-## chassis, if I remember correctly, and the hull of the StuG in "Band of Brothers" was cobbled together from 2 tank hulls, to get the requisite number of road wheels (albeit of much larger diameter than on the Pzkw IV chassis).

Prost!
Brad

That's getting pretty close on the right track as was Louis earlier in the thread.

The original AFV is a modern style British army APC designated the FV432. It served in Afghanistan and Iraq and several years ago started being replaced by a new APC. Some of the surplus FV432's have been sold and are in private hands driving around on the backroads of England. And yes Louis, you can probably still buy one although I don't know how you will get it home. ^&grin

The hardest part of making up a tank is getting the engine, transmission, wheels and track to work together. It's much easier taking an existing AFV and building a new top section. Here is what the the FV432 actually looks like. Note the track, 5 wheels and 2 return rollers as well as the drive wheel - an exact match.

 

[Phantom Warrior]

The FV432 was modified to look like a Type 97 Chi-Ha tank by FX Illusions in Australia for the movie "The Great Raid".

http://www.fxillusions.com.au/index.html
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0326905/

The FV432 wheels and tracks have a configuration similar to a Chi-Ha tank but with 5 road wheels instead of 6 and of modern design as compared to 1930's Japanese style wheels.And the #2-3 and $4-5 wheels are paired on donkeys.

The features that give it the Chi-Ha look are the pentagon shaped upper glacis plate and peaked front deck, the riveted construction, the square gun mantlet and main gun recoil housing, and the shape of the turret but especially the round commander's hatch and cupola.

Re-enactors wanted to convert it to German for a re-enactment so the remove both Japanese MG and replacaed the bow MG with an MG34, added an umbrella antennae, painted it grey and added German style red tank numbers and presto - a captured Czech like tank converted to German use.

The upper part of the tank is made of sheet metal - not armour plate. But since Jack didn't touch the tank, I don't know how he thinks he could throw a rock through it. Although the owner did mention thay need to repair a big dent and small puncture in the turret.

Terry

 

[Phantom Warrior]

I'm reminded of other examples of ex-Soviet or East Bloc armor, especially from the defunct Yugoslav army, used to build convincing versions of WWII tanks. The Tigers in "Kelly's Heroes" were built on some T-## chassis, if I remember correctly, and the hull of the StuG in "Band of Brothers" was cobbled together from 2 tank hulls, to get the requisite number of road wheels (albeit of much larger diameter than on the Pzkw IV chassis).

Prost!
Brad

The Yugoslav Army did create Tiger tanks from Russian T-34/85s. They created 3 of them for the 1969 movie "Battle of Neretva" As with other movies, it was far easier to use a working hull, engine, transmission, tracks and wheels and just build a new superstructure out of sheet metal. The Yugoslav Tigers clearly do not have the overlapping road wheels of a Tiger but instead have 5 similar sized non-overlapping road wheels on a Christie suspension. I'm pretty sure these were the same Tiger tanks in "Kelly's Heroes" which by no coincidence was also filmed in Yugoslavia in 1970. They too have the T-34 road wheels.

The 2 Tiger tanks in "Saving Private Ryan" were similarly built out of T-34/85s and the upper part is based on measurements of the Tiger I at Bovington. They were built by Plus Film Services of England. They have the same non-overlapping 5 road wheels. The mock-up of the Tiger's upper section was proportioned to fit realistically on the T-34 chassis. One of the tanks was stored at Bovington but has been sold to Joe Fazio of San Francisco for a re-enactment at Monterey. The Tiger tanks in Band of Brothers were also built out of T-34/85s. (Very lucky the Russians made so many for WWII or the movies wouldn't have any Tigers.

As for the Stug III in Band of Brothers in the Bloody Gulch segment - it is our old friend the British FV432 which has the FV432 chassis, engine, transmission, road wheels and drive sprocket. The chassis was lengthened to fit in a 6th FV432 road wheel to make it better resemble a Stug III. Although I have recently done research on the Battle of Carentan, the Ingouf Farm and Bloody Gulch and the Panzer Regiment of the[FONT=Arial, sans-serif] 37[/FONT][SUP][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]th[/FONT][/SUP][FONT=Arial, sans-serif] SS Panzergrenadier Division (Gotz von Berlichingen – Gotz of the Iron Hand)[/FONT] were equipped with Stug IV instead of tanks. I suppose the FV432 couldn't be stretched to have 8 road wheels.

Terry