Toysoldier quality (1 Viewer)

[King & Country]

Hi Guys,
You won’t be surprised to read that I don’t agree with those who think that the peak of perfection is already passed and the hobby has “levelled out”.
I also don’t believe that any major manufacturer (K&C included) has gone backward in the last few years either.
One of the great things that has occurred is that the “new blood” which has come into the business side (and will continue to do so) helps revitalize all of us who are already in the manufacturing and marketing side of the hobby and spurs us all into making even greater efforts to design and produce a better end product for our dealers and collectors alike.
When some of us (including myself) have talked of a “Golden Age” in the hobby I believe we were and are talking about the amazing variety of choice that is and has been available to the collector for the last few years. That is a fact pure and simple!
And even in these difficult times just look at the incredible amount of new product that is still being released… For some it may, alas, be too expensive… For others it may indeed be too much to absorb at any one sitting… But for the majority it’s a sign of a strong, vibrant, competitive hobby and business that continues to grow and develop… and improve… year by year by year.
So, for me personally, I’ll keep my nose to the grindstone, my shoulder to the wheel, my arse in the air and keep beavering away! Adios for now.

Andy C. Neilson

 

[jazzeum]

Hi Guys,
You won’t be surprised to read that I don’t agree with those who think that the peak of perfection is already passed and the hobby has “levelled out”.
I also don’t believe that any major manufacturer (K&C included) has gone backward in the last few years either.
One of the great things that has occurred is that the “new blood” which has come into the business side (and will continue to do so) helps revitalize all of us who are already in the manufacturing and marketing side of the hobby and spurs us all into making even greater efforts to design and produce a better end product for our dealers and collectors alike.
When some of us (including myself) have talked of a “Golden Age” in the hobby I believe we were and are talking about the amazing variety of choice that is and has been available to the collector for the last few years. That is a fact pure and simple!
And even in these difficult times just look at the incredible amount of new product that is still being released… For some it may, alas, be too expensive… For others it may indeed be too much to absorb at any one sitting… But for the majority it’s a sign of a strong, vibrant, competitive hobby and business that continues to grow and develop… and improve… year by year by year. So, for me personally, I’ll keep my nose to the grindstone, my shoulder to the wheel, my arse in the air and keep beavering away! Adios for now.

Andy C. Neilson

Agreed. The more entrants in a business you have, the more it's an indication of the overall health.

 

[Mitch]

would have been nice if the reply had been in the relevant thread as failure to do so makes it look like a K&C focused issue which, I don't believe it was but, anyway!!! I think manufacturers and collectors etc view this differently and, thats for obvious reasons. I don't think quality and the like can be equated to new people entering the hobby or, if it was not aimed at collectors then manufacturers as recently there has only been TG who has entered this hobby. That I don't think was the thought process behind the thread below and, certainly not my thoughts on the subject.

When I came into the hobby and saw the manufacturers products that got me involved I thought they were very good. I did not know what else they had done nor, what they were like in terms of quality etc. Now, as a discerning collector I can look at a product and decide for myself if a one from a few years ago looks better than the one that is released in front of me now and new. Hell, I have even seen differences in quality on same models that have been remade recently in terms of parts being a plastic medium instead of metal from the original release and, that was within a few months of release.

there has been much chatter about what manufacturers have done to economise and, what effect this has had on detail and the like but, this subject for collectors is not about how many are buying its down to what they can see with their eyes. some will just not care, some will but, both are expressing what they see and feel in their hobby.
Mitch

 

[Cyber Field Marshall]

I have noticed the biggest quality improvements over the years with K&C have been with their vehicles/AFV's. I don't notice it quite so much with the soldiers. My older soldier releases stand up and blend in very well with the more recent soldier releases. I would take that statement as a compliment because it means K&C have been making very good toy soldiers for a long time. I acknowledge that many collectors feel with the huge price increases we should see corresponding increases in quality however a lot of those price increases have been due to input costs soaring in recent years and a weakening U.S. dollar.

 

[King Tiger II]

I agree 100% with Andy, im new in this hobby, and im very happy with the figurines the way they are releases by K&C.

It makes me laugh when i read that peoples wants more details or better sculpting because the price just got a raise.

First we are talking 1/30th scale , their must be a limit to the details we can do at this small scale, me im very happy with what the manufacturers are doing, and they just need to continue this way,finest figurines or tanks or planes you can have.

As for the raise in price , nobody like to have to pay more , but everyone need to understand that everything cost higher and higher and it applies to manufacturer too, labor and materials can have a raise maybe 2-3 times in the same year from their providers. And they have to deal with these raise for 1 whole year since K&C will put fixed price in advance to customer, but as an Entrepreneur and dealing with lots of providers and sub-contractors, im in the same boat as K&C, my customer dont like raise and me too, but its just the way life it is.

Do we need to discuss about the raise in Gas petrole that we have 20 times every year ?

My 2 cents. {sm4}

Serge

 

[Jack]

I have noticed the biggest quality improvements over the years with K&C have been with their vehicles/AFV's. I don't notice it quite so much with the soldiers. My older soldier releases stand up and blend in very well with the more recent soldier releases. I would take that statement as a compliment because it means K&C have been making very good toy soldiers for a long time. I acknowledge that many collectors feel with the huge price increases we should see corresponding increases in quality however a lot of those price increases have been due to input costs soaring in recent years and a weakening U.S. dollar.

I have stood in front of a cabinet with Larso who pointed out figures selling for 35 dollars that he paid 50 dollars for some years ago. Our dollar is strong at the moment so we have been cushioned - to a certain extent - from some of the price rises. Our turn will come, but it is great while it lasts!

 

[larso]

"I have stood in front of a cabinet with Larso who pointed out figures selling for 35 dollars that he paid 50 dollars for some years ago. Our dollar is strong at the moment so we have been cushioned - to a certain extent - from some of the price rises. Our turn will come, but it is great while it lasts!"

As I wrote elsewhere, I think we're actually in a 'Golden Age' now, but it might be more issolated to us down here and has a lot to do with our current Australian dollar. (It is double what it was worth ten years ago)

 

[Blowtorch]

I have noticed the biggest quality improvements over the years with K&C have been with their vehicles/AFV's. I don't notice it quite so much with the soldiers.

weaponry on the recent Germans & winter Russians is a whole lot more refined than I've seen in the past

 

[The Military Workshop]

Whilst TG is the youngest of the mainstrream manufacturers others such as Figarti, JJ, CS and FL were
not long before TG and only got going in the last 5/6 years.

If somebody could draw a line at say 1 JAN 2007 and note all available TS's (the Made in China kind)
compared to now the variety available would have to have increased 4-5 x. K&C alone must have
doubled their available product since 2007.

Somebody mentioned HB armour being the "peak". However I find this to be a false peak. It is no use
producing a wonderful armour range if it can only be sustained for a short period. My understanding
is there was a very high damage rate on a shipment where the armour item had moveable tracks. No
doubt a certain part of the collector base thought moveable track was a wonderful idea and miss that
kind of detail. However HB paid the price of probably trying to improve too much. After all how many
actually want to run their armour tracks across the table or floor and then at what cost ? When I was selling
Dragon kits you could buy moveable resin track links that cost more than the tank kit itself. Many of
those who require more detail need to factor in probable increases in cost and increased damage
risks that might result (ie. the more small parts and add ons the greater the risk). If the improvement
does not work out it is mainly the manufacturer that loses financially.

Brett

 

[PanzerAce1944]

I agree that the current level of Toy Soldier Quality has "not" leveled off, which means to me since I have been a K&C
Collector since 2007 quality, painting, detail, has gone from top notch to even better as the years have passed.
My very first K&C set was the WS063 WWII 4 figure boxed set. The day I opened the lid on the box of that set ignited the fire And started the collecting passion which continues on 5 years later. I think when you buy an item from a manufacturer and that initial purchase results in numerous repeated purchases year after year,that pretty much sums
It all up. Add to that the attention to sculpt, paint, etc has done nothing but striven for the better.
Can't wait to see what next year brings.....^&grin

 

[Mitch]

Brett...

I think I said IMO of course, that HB were the peak of armour production. The panthers and bergpanthers as a standard model were very good. The Tigers should have been made as a general run not, the sales process they choose to adopt. That was a mistake. As I mentioned its subjective but, they were superb. I have also said many times and, its a flaw in the hobby that these add on's such as you mentioned ''moving tracks'' and the rest like opening and closing hatches doors etc recoiling barrels!!! My god!!! are just not needed and, In my opinion tacky in some cases.

The importation of the hobby world ideas into this hobby which, derived from CS and Figarti is a poor move. This hobby for me, is completely different and should be from the model world and, the toy world. I suppose each to their own and the ''reality'' issue will raise its head from the dioramarists but, the more moving parts, the higher the cost is and, they are prone to breakages.

There is a huge distinction between the hobbies but, as always that line will be blurred by some of the collectors and manufacturers who think importing these ideas is a good move. I know one manufacturer who really set their stall out based on the quality of the 1/35th scale hobby. Striving for that level of detail is a false peak for me. I had this discussion at a model show about the use of photoetch on plastic kits and whether it actually made them look better or not. I felt it did not as once its painted and weathered unless you are touching and playing around with it etc you cannot tell its photo etch. same goes on some of our models why anyone needed a retractable barrel was something I could not understand. If you want that go and buy a cheap kids toy or, dig out the old britains deetail and corgi.

As has been shown by some of these ''realistic'' releases what happens is they either break or, the bolts and rivets are way to large and look unrealistic spoiling the model look or, never get used. I think, its down to the prices in the hobby and a need to try and possibly justify the expence with ever more add ons when its not neccessary. We know what we are buying and, what the limits are and, we are not buying, well, on the whole we are not buying, plastic kits with extra metal parts to add weight as has been done and, is done, in the 1/35th scale hobby.

But, I know others will disagree
Mitch

Whilst TG is the youngest of the mainstrream manufacturers others such as Figarti, JJ, CS and FL were
not long before TG and only got going in the last 5/6 years.

If somebody could draw a line at say 1 JAN 2007 and note all available TS's (the Made in China kind)
compared to now the variety available would have to have increased 4-5 x. K&C alone must have
doubled their available product since 2007.

Somebody mentioned HB armour being the "peak". However I find this to be a false peak. It is no use
producing a wonderful armour range if it can only be sustained for a short period. My understanding
is there was a very high damage rate on a shipment where the armour item had moveable tracks. No
doubt a certain part of the collector base thought moveable track was a wonderful idea and miss that
kind of detail. However HB paid the price of probably trying to improve too much. After all how many
actually want to run their armour tracks across the table or floor and then at what cost ? When I was selling
Dragon kits you could buy moveable resin track links that cost more than the tank kit itself. Many of
those who require more detail need to factor in probable increases in cost and increased damage
risks that might result (ie. the more small parts and add ons the greater the risk). If the improvement
does not work out it is mainly the manufacturer that loses financially.

Brett

 

[Peter Reuss]

Had HB been manufactured anywhere but Argentina I think they would have been successful with their vehicles. They happened to be in an economy not well suited for mass production and exports.

 

[Rutledge]

Hi Guys,
You won’t be surprised to read that I don’t agree with those who think that the peak of perfection is already passed and the hobby has “levelled out”.
I also don’t believe that any major manufacturer (K&C included) has gone backward in the last few years either.
One of the great things that has occurred is that the “new blood” which has come into the business side (and will continue to do so) helps revitalize all of us who are already in the manufacturing and marketing side of the hobby and spurs us all into making even greater efforts to design and produce a better end product for our dealers and collectors alike.
When some of us (including myself) have talked of a “Golden Age” in the hobby I believe we were and are talking about the amazing variety of choice that is and has been available to the collector for the last few years. That is a fact pure and simple!
And even in these difficult times just look at the incredible amount of new product that is still being released… For some it may, alas, be too expensive… For others it may indeed be too much to absorb at any one sitting… But for the majority it’s a sign of a strong, vibrant, competitive hobby and business that continues to grow and develop… and improve… year by year by year.
So, for me personally, I’ll keep my nose to the grindstone, my shoulder to the wheel, my arse in the air and keep beavering away! Adios for now.

Andy C. Neilson

Hear Hear for Capitalism! Economic creative desctruction is the commerical equivalent of naturalistic darwinism/survival of the fittest. There is no better system for improvement and advancement.

K&C is applauded for embracing their challengers as good for the overall business/market. Especially as K&C is the market leader and it stands in the cross hairs of every current and prospective competitor. By doing so they exhibit a high degree of confidence in their adaptive abilities. Basically, they are saying bring it on boys & girls, we welcome a worthy adversary as it makes us better, too. And with the realization, surely, that there are no guarantees of their continued success --- with the exception, perhaps, of their company's embedded DNA, which suggests it can overcome whatever challenges are presented by other "mere mortals".

Competition is good for everyone, even the losers, for it shows them their true talents lie elsewhere. We should all cheer the system that has made utterly non essential "luxury" items like miniature figures a thriving industry of its own. Hurray for captialism!

 

[PanzerAce1944]

Had HB been manufactured anywhere but Argentina I think they would have been successful with their vehicles. They happened to be in an economy not well suited for mass production and exports.

A very good point made about HB. Getting back to King&Country to me it is quite apparant that every move that they make is carefully thought out and planned which is what any successful company would do.

 

[Panzer ace]

I think that the quality has risen in all aspects of K&C lines. The soldiers have improved and let's not forget the packaging etc. The boxes are better and so are the foam cut outs, which in my mind has helped with less damage and shipping issues.

I know it was said in a joking manner but do not underestimate the effect gasoline has on the high costs seen in the industry as a whole. The trucks that mine the materials, the cost of everyday business and shipping all rise because of it. Economically, very few things have as much as an across the board impact as fuel costs.

Most importantly I'd do not think we have reached the pinnacle of this hobby. The day that happens is the day that the forum no longer has any threads containing complaints because everything is perfect!!!!!

 

[MarkeytMaker]

Arse in the air and beavering away, really makes me think your working hard!