Two rank firing question (1 Viewer)

[Scott]

For skirmishers definitely. In line it would be appropriate as noted below but bear in mind that the manual and the re-enactors interpretations should be taken as guides and not gospel for actual battle formations. ..................

I may be wrong on some subjects but I'm not BS'ing anyone here. Ideally this is an evidence based hobby. You'll just have to trust me that when I quoted a reenactor, I quoted one that I know has actually done the research over a 30 year period.

http://redcoat76.blogspot.com/

We have little visual documentation other than static artwork and illustrations in drill manuals to go by. You have to go by that evidence and the period written evidence that the British drilled a certain way. If you can't adapt the figures then you adapt the diorama to a possible period scenario. You may get "peer review" as well.

 

[Scott]

1808...

Two printings of "Field day". Neat! Grenadiers in Three Ranks. Look at the foot positions of the second and third ranks (standing) Second rank forward on the left foot, third rank over with the right foot.

Atkinson, John Augustus, 1775-1831 (artist)
London: Wm. Miller, 1808

 

[Spitfrnd]

I may be wrong on some subjects but I'm not BS'ing anyone here. Ideally this is an evidence based hobby. You'll just have to trust me that when I quoted a reenactor, I quoted one that I know has actually done the research over a 30 year period.

http://redcoat76.blogspot.com/

We have little visual documentation other than static artwork and illustrations in drill manuals to go by. You have to go by that evidence and the period written evidence that the British drilled a certain way. If you can't adapt the figures then you adapt the diorama to a possible period scenario. You may get "peer review" as well.

I don't think you are BS'ing anyone Scott nor should anything I said be taken that way. The point is simply that drill manuals reflect parade ground conditions that almost never occur on fields of battle. Once again, the best starting postions digenerate under the stress of repeated vollies and return fire. My point on re-eactors is simply that no matter how well researched, they cannot duplicate that stress (unless they chose to do it in certain parts of Oregon and Washington). Of course we all can do research.

As far as peer review on what diorama I might happen to share, honestly while I am pleased to exchange ideas and research, I do this for my own enjoyment and my sense of precision with respect to these matters is well tempered with the knowledge that there are many limitations on available poses that go well beyond even the strict drill manual view on this and I am comfortable with the inevitable compromises.

 

[Scott]

Thanks for your reply. I have replied to the original question with period information that I have at hand. As for reenactors interpreting the period drill, that's the best one is doing to see because, as you wrote, they are not under battle stress, yet they do occupy the same physical space with reproductions of the same sized weapons. In my own experience, when a reenactor in the second rank, standing firing, doesn't step over to the right to position his weapon between the front rank standing men, it endangers those men by muzzle or primer flash. The K& C figures don't produce such a standing firing figure with the right foot over. Their standing firing man braces on both feet rather than on his forward left foot.

One could recreate a battle line with the King and Country figures, if the diorama portrayed the unit in open order, under stress with casualties or on uneven ground.

 

[Spitfrnd]

Thanks for your reply. I have replied to the original question with period information that I have at hand. As for reenactors interpreting the period drill, that's the best one is doing to see because, as you wrote, they are not under battle stress, yet they do occupy the same physical space with reproductions of the same sized weapons. In my own experience, when a reenactor in the second rank, standing firing, doesn't step over to the right to position his weapon between the front rank standing men, it endangers those men by muzzle or primer flash. The K& C figures don't produce such a standing firing figure with the right foot over. Their standing firing man braces on both feet rather than on his forward left foot.

One could recreate a battle line with the King and Country figures, if the diorama portrayed the unit in open order, under stress with casualties or on uneven ground.

I agree with you on all of the above. I didn't mean to suggest that you could ignore the physics of the weapon. In fact in battle, men were apparently burned and too often shot by the men behind. I have read the French had this issue more than the British but likely in happened for all forces.