Any Interest in New Warbirds? (1 Viewer)

[Louis Badolato]

I think doing both would be great, but doubt both would never fly with Andy. I could see him doing wood if the demand was there, because he would just have to re-establish ties with the factories he already dealt with, and have them continue with his existing designs, without having to set his design team to designing tons of new polystone airplanes. However, the cost of wood warbirds would be high (I would bet at least $400 for a fighter, $1000 for a bigger plane), limiting demand. The demand would probably be higher for polystone planes, which would cost around $100 for a fighter, maybe $200 for a bigger plane, but then Andy would have to take the time to design all the new planes, as well as the accessories and groundcrew. I couldn't imagine him doing both, primarily because he would see one as competition for the other.

 

[Gideon]

That is a tough call. To me, it depends on which planes Andy wants to cover and from what theaters.

I think Andy should study who is producing what and possibly build around that.

One thing that Andy must consider, as should we dealers, is the weight constraints. Andy recently encountered a problem with that 3 story bomb damaged building. As with the polystone airplanes, this stuff is heavy folks. That shipping cost directly cuts into our profits due to the increase in shipping weight and cost and none of us dealers are gouging. We all tend to be within a few dollars up or down of eachother and we all seem to adhere to Andys' pricing.

In the end, I don't really think Andy should produce more planes until he can work out a way to reduce the weight. The box for the airplanes are considerably larger than the other vehicles, so this will cost more to ship weight and dimension wise.

 

[jazzeum]

A couple of points. Louis raises some good points because from a financial point of view, one detracts from the other. However, one could be geared to collectors who would be willing to pay more versus those not. For example, Toyota has the Lexus line which is obviously more expensive than the Toyota line. They're aimed at different audiences.

Secondly, regarding shipping. Won't the costs for the wooden warbirds be passed on to the customer. I mean that's not desirable but it's reality.

 

[Gideon]

Jazzeum, the costs for shipping the wood planes would be far less than the polystone versions. You would either have to pay $250-600 for a medium sized airplane or $190-300 for a polystone. It's a tough call all the way around.

 

[jazzeum]

Yes, but I can't imagine you will totally absorb the cost. You'd have to pass that onto the customer. Someone willing to pay that much is probably not going to balk too much.

 

[Shannon Reuss]

Re: Any Interest in New Warbirds? Andy's response

I chatted with Andy last night about the possibility of producing more Warbirds and his bottom line is while he would also like to see more planes produced, production is locked up for at least the next 18 months and the weight and bulk issues are definitely a factor when it comes to these types of offerings. They are too bulky for air transport and must be sent by slow boat from China and then shipped by freight to dealer distributors who then have to ship them by ground or air to the rest of the K& C dealers as will be the case with the new buildings. Another issue is demand. Even if there were 100 K&C collectors out there ready and willing to purchase every Warbird K&C came out with, what would become of the other 400-900 produced in the run? King and Country has so many other new releases already scheduled that there is just no room for limited run planes at this time, and he is leery of producing large numbers of them, so for now there are no plans for more planes. However, Andy reassures us that he "never says never," so perhaps we will see them fly again in the future.

 

[jazzeum]

I'm not a business person so it's hard to argue with some of the logic in your post Shannon about the costs of shipping. But as far as productions schedules and amount of collectors, I respectfully disagree. With wooden planes, wouldn't these be produced outside his normal lines of production, although I understand fitting them in to what he plans to sell. Secondly, about how many could he sell, couldn't he limit the amount he would produce. However, I do understand economies of scale and production costs.

As a last resort, we'll just need to beat him up on it in Chicago.

 

[Warbuff26]

People.....there is a very simple answer to all of this. Combining efforts. There are several companies out there like Models in Motion that have large productions of aircraft. Andy needs to hook-up with these companies and combine efforts. They can produce the planes while K&C produces the figures, diorama materials etc. This has the plus side of not taking valuable production time away from the K&C factories that need to be busy producing tanks, guns, vehicles and figures! It's a win-win for everyone!

 

[Shannon Reuss]

I like it! (and never thought of combining efforts before--great idea)

 

[bsager]

This is what this froum is all about. Several minds put together to come up with an answer to solve a problem. What more could you ask for!

Bill

 

[jazzeum]

I've looked at Motions Models web site and they look like they have some interesting planes. I believe Louis has one of their planes and he and I actually met them at a small otherwise worthless NJ show. However, I'm not sure combining efforts is such a hot idea. What does each get out of it? It probably benefits Andy to stop pestering him about this but where are the tie in benefits for Motion. I'm not sure most of their clientele are interested in K&C. I'm sure there's some crossover, however. Also, I believe the planes are different although I'm sure they have the capabilities of making it to spec.

Their web site is www.motionmodels.com

Interestingly, they also make some tanks, wood I presume.

 

[bsager]

I'd like to see their designs on the tanks. Were they on the site?

Bill

 

[jazzeum]

Bill,

Yes, but they don't have a lot although they could probably make things to order. I'll bet if you gave them an old K & C brochure they could make those although I don't know if Andy has a copyright on those designs. Sorry, the lawyer in me coming out.

 

[bsager]

Brad,

Does motion models list them as wooden? I just looked at a couple tanks and the detail is very good.

The name of the guy there is Joel Rosen which I wonder if he is the same Joel Rosen that did the Motion Performance Camaros in the late 60's. The company name is the same also the same motionmodels?

This was for you car guys out there. I'm also a muscle car fan

Bill

 

[jazzeum]

Bill,

I just spoke to Joel and sad to say the tanks are not made of wood; they're resin or plastic. He said it's just too expensive to do so, like $1,000. However, 99% of the planes are wooden. So forget the tanks. You're probably thinking "tanks for nothing."

 

[Louis Badolato]

I do have a motion models P47 Thunderbolt, which I showed Andy at the Symposium and which is of about the same quality as the King & Country wood warbirds were, although which Andy definitively indicated was not made in the same factories. If, as suggested, Andy could work a deal with Motion models where their wood planes were produced as King & Country products, with Andy making the ground crew & accessories, I would be thrilled. The questions becomes is this of interest to, and profitable for, both Andy and Joel? Shannon and Bill, as dealers why don't you put them together and see if you can get the ball rolling. It sure sounds like there's plenty of interest.

 

[bsager]

Brad,

What did you do with that money I gave you for comedy school?

Louis,

I will talk to Shannon and see if we can come up with an idea to get this together. I would hope there would be some difference from the Motion planes to the K&C style. If not it would just be a rebadged Motion Model.
We'll see what we can do.

Bill

 

[jazzeum]

Brad,

What did you do with that money I gave you for comedy school?

Bill, I spent it on King and Country

Seriously, this sounds like a plan, a good plan.

 

[bsager]

Brad,

I'll give it a shot. I'll call Motion and see what they have to say.

Bill

 

[Louis Badolato]

The difference between Motion Models & King & Country is two fold: (1) King & Country planes are all produced with landing gear down so they can be displayed with figures, and (2) King & Country planes are generally finished with a matt finish, while Motion Models planes have gear up and are finished glossy. Andy also chose specific markings for his planes. The information as to markings can, in large part, be provided to Motion Models by me if they are interested, so get on it, Bill!