Confederate statue stirs controversy in Virginia (1 Viewer)

[BLReed]

http://wtop.com/159/3322329/Confederate-statue-stirs-controversy



LEESBURG, Va. - A statue of a Confederate soldier that has stood in front of the historic courthouse in Loudoun County since 1908 is now being called inappropriate and a local lawyer says it should be removed.

The statue was erected to honor the war dead at a time when many Civil war veterans were still alive.

The statue shows a Confederate soldier standing guard with his rifle ready.

An inscription, carved into the stone monument, says, "In memory of the Confederate Soldiers of Loudoun County, Va. Erected May 28, 1908."

But Loudoun County, deeply divided over the war in 1861, may not have healed old wounds.

Attorney John Flannery, who often has cases in the courthouse, wants the statue moved elsewhere. He says it's intimidating to some of his clients. "It deters people. It chills them from believing they can get a fair shake in court," he says.

Flannery says he's actually had clients who are afraid they won't get justice in a courthouse after seeing the statue.

"It's a living, active courthouse, which already has challenges in terms of discrimination in terms of persons of color, and not only them."

But he will get an argument from many local folks. Local historian Gene Scheel says the statue is not a symbol, it's history.

"In 1908, a statue like this was considered to be an honor, that's history."

He says intact remnants of the past are good teaching tools.

"Practically every county that I've been to in Virginia has its Confederate memorial or monument," says Scheel, noting that Richmond has a whole row of them.

On the North King Street in front of the Loudoun Courthouse, there was mixed opinion about the statue.

"I am actually from the North and was a little bit surprised by it when I moved down here," says Annie Carlson. But adds that she can understand why that statue is there.

But Richard Gallagher, who was actually once a client of Flannery's, says he's surprised by the idea of moving the statue.

"I think its crazy. It's part of our history," he says.

Flannery thinks the statue should be at a museum or a cemetery, not the courthouse. He hasn't decided yet how to move forward with his request for moving the statue, and he says he does expect opposition

 

[nysoldiers]

I agree it should be moved to a cemetary, museum or separate war memorial in a park.

 

[Jack]

I wonder if it should be viewed differently than the recent question of the Confederate flags flying over court houses. I believe - but I am happy to be corrected - that all, many, some, a few? - were only added in the 50s and 60s as a statement about he Civil Rights Movement. The statue was placed there closer to the events that it commemorates and was, perhaps, not a (mis)use of history to perpetuate a modern political view. Could the statue remain as an historical relic important in itself rather than be seen as a spokesperson for a world far removed from both the sculptor and the Confederate soldiers it commemorates? I think removing it makes a far more overt statement about the rightness or wrongness (sounds terible but the other option was good and evil) of the cause than letting it stay as a memorial indicating an historical event. There are far greater issues concerning race, poverty, and injustice in both our countries to keep our politicians busy. Just a view from far away!

 

[lancer]

I think the statue is right where it belongs. Any attempt to move it can only be seen as another example of current day PC run amok. Why do some people always want to hide from their history? Leave it be. -- Al

 

[tdubel]

I think the statue is right where it belongs. Any attempt to move it can only be seen as another example of current day PC run amok. Why do some people always want to hide from their history? Leave it be. -- Al

AGREE 100%. What an unbelievable BS story. I am continually amazed by the ignorance to all history on display by the American Public, it is an absolute disgrace. Virginia was in the Confederacy, its a freaking statue to honor the brave who fought that were from there. How on green earth is this intimidating. Intimidating to idiots more like it.

No offense to my Yankee friends, but that is like me saying when I see a North statue that it intimidates me and how could i ever get a fair trial, does anyone see how ridiculous this becomes???

This just reinforces a number of points about the average citizen. If it was a Union troop, I guess it would be ok.

God help us all if that is the bar being set by legal minds who are supposed to be of above average intelligence.

TD

 

[Jack]

AGREE 100%. What an unbelievable BS story. I am continually amazed by the ignorance to all history on display by the American Public, it is an absolute disgrace. Virginia was in the Confederacy, its a freaking statue to honor the brave who fought that were from there. How on green earth is this intimidating. Intimidating to idiots more like it.

No offense to my Yankee friends, but that is like me saying when I see a North statue that it intimidates me and how could i ever get a fair trial, does anyone see how ridiculous this becomes???

This just reinforces a number of points about the average citizen. If it was a Union troop, I guess it would be ok.

God help us all if that is the bar being set by legal minds who are supposed to be of above average intelligence.

TD

Tom

Reading between the lines of your post and feeling for the vibe of your response, am I right in saying that you are opposed to it being moved?{sm4}{sm4}

Jack

 

[tdubel]

I wonder if it should be viewed differently than the recent question of the Confederate flags flying over court houses. I believe - but I am happy to be corrected - that all, many, some, a few? - were only added in the 50s and 60s as a statement about he Civil Rights Movement. The statue was placed there closer to the events that it commemorates and was, perhaps, not a (mis)use of history to perpetuate a modern political view. Could the statue remain as an historical relic important in itself rather than be seen as a spokesperson for a world far removed from both the sculptor and the Confederate soldiers it commemorates? I think removing it makes a far more overt statement about the rightness or wrongness (sounds terible but the other option was good and evil) of the cause than letting it stay as a memorial indicating an historical event. There are far greater issues concerning race, poverty, and injustice in both our countries to keep our politicians busy. Just a view from far away!

Jack,
One of the biggest mischaracterizations was the misuse of the Confederate Battle Flag by hate groups and the like. It has caused a dishonor and misconception about the flag. That is a disgrace too. If I fly my flags, people call me a racist, a raw deal for me. I tend to fly them anyway as it is about honoring my family who fought. I could care less that a group of ignorant racists used it as a battle cry in the 1960s. Unfortunately, a large part of the American public believes that is where the flag originated, to me that is the unbelievable part. Ignorance abounds when it comes to the Civil War in America.

TD

 

[tdubel]

Tom

Reading between the lines of your post and feeling for the vibe of your response, am I right in saying that you are opposed to it being moved?{sm4}{sm4}

Jack

Yeah, things with me are pretty straight forward. These types of PC stories are just maddening to me. I just can't fathom how people end up with these conclusions. In our America of today, I am thoroughly convinced that an ant on the ground would be offensive to a good portion of the citizens, as an American, this analogy and stories like the one in this thread is downright embarrassing. IMO

TD

 

[Jack]

Jack,
One of the biggest mischaracterizations was the misuse of the Confederate Battle Flag by hate groups and the like. It has caused a dishonor and misconception about the flag. That is a disgrace too. If I fly my flags, people call me a racist, a raw deal for me. I tend to fly them anyway as it is about honoring my family who fought. I could care less that a group of ignorant racists used it as a battle cry in the 1960s. Unfortunately, a large part of the American public believes that is where the flag originated, to me that is the unbelievable part. Ignorance abounds when it comes to the Civil War in America.

TD

Tom

Speaking as an outsider who has been to the US four times (Hawaii, LA, Mobile, Orlando, Washington, Boston, New York - I suspect not the most 'typical' of the US as a whole!) I had a view that the AWI and ACW were dominant topics in US schooling and rather more 'vaguely' were entrenched as general knowledge. I am conscious that Australia's history is not well known even in this country which makes it relatively easy for fringe groups to hijack it for their own ends.

Jack

 

[DMNamiot]

Hi Guys,

Totally agree with Tom here that this is PCism run amouk. Anyone who is intimidated by a war memorial needs to get a clue. To illustrate how idiotic this is there are tons of them over here in Germany to many wars including WWI and WWII war dead from the various towns. So should we be offended because the soldiers who died from WWII might have been Nazis? I wish folks would give this sort of revisionist pc junk a rest and mind their own business.

Dave

 

[Rob]

What a waste of time and effort, leave it be exactly where it is.

Reminds me of some years back when a European minister suggested that Britain should change the name of Waterloo Station and Trafalgar Square so as not to upset our French visitors when they arrive. I like to think the average French man and woman is big enough and level headed enough not to burst into tears at the site of a name, ' Oooh quick there's Nelson , take me home I can't take it' :rolleyes2:

Rob

 

[tdubel]

What a waste of time and effort, leave it be exactly where it is.

Reminds me of some years back when a European minister suggested that Britain should change the name of Waterloo Station and Trafalgar Square so as not to upset our French visitors when they arrive. I like to think the average French man and woman is big enough and level headed enough not to burst into tears at the site of a name, ' Oooh quick there's Nelson , take me home I can't take it' :rolleyes2:

Rob

Great post, I am literally chuckling. Could not agree more! What is it my English brothers say.....Keep Calm and Carry On, I need to practice this or stories like this will send my blood pressure soaring!

TD

 

[Rob]

What a waste of time and effort, leave it be exactly where it is.

Reminds me of some years back when a European minister suggested that Britain should change the name of Waterloo Station and Trafalgar Square so as not to upset our French visitors when they arrive. I like to think the average French man and woman is big enough and level headed enough not to burst into tears at the site of a name, ' Oooh quick there's Nelson , take me home I can't take it' :rolleyes2:

Rob

Apologies for spelling in this , have not got my reading glasses with me today! (reading glasses....here comes middle age:redface2::rolleyes2:

Rob

 

[nysoldiers]

I certainly agree that "PC" has often gotten out of hand and Southern states are entitled to have their war memorials. My argument is that it does not belong in front of a court house.
like it or not the Confederacy supported the horrendous institution of slavery. I am fully aware that judgments should be made based on the times events occurred. In fact racism still exists and I can empathize that this monument in front of a court house could be intimidating to certain minorities.
History is history, I agree, but being sensitive to the pain our history imposed on certain groups is appropriate.
I am sure a German Jew would feel intimidated if a statue of a WWII soldier was in front of a courthouse. Or a Native American if a statue of Custer was in that similar location.
Moving the statue does not eradicate the history it only shows respect for those who rightfully might be offended.
If history is to be used as a true learning experience people need to understand the perspective from all sides.

 

[Scott]

Cripes! Another dang 2nd Place trophy contraversy. If some locals want to keep the thing in front of a courthouse where all the locals come expecting impartial justice, they had better make the case that the statue of a Confederate soldier has some meaning and relevence to all of the local citizens.

 

[Scott]

Yeah, things with me are pretty straight forward. These types of PC stories are just maddening to me. I just can't fathom how people end up with these conclusions. In our America of today, I am thoroughly convinced that an ant on the ground would be offensive to a good portion of the citizens, as an American, this analogy and stories like the one in this thread is downright embarrassing. IMO

TD

Folks are sometimes surprised when told by other folks that Hey, we are actually annoyed by insults oppression and descrimination. Now that some minorities have more political and economic clout than years ago, dismissing there protests under "too much political correctness" is a mistake.


Why call something PC? What freedom of expression is being suppressed? Ethnic and sexist slurs? Old symbols of tyranny? Do we really want to die on that hill?

 

[Rob]

You'd think anyone going into court to face justice would have a bit more to worry about than a statue of a soldier outside that's been there for many many years, wouldn't you. I seriously doubt THAT many people worry about it. I'm sure the statue meant a great deal to folk when it was put up, why all of a sudden SHOULD it be moved, what's next, hey I don't like what Lincoln did lets move his statue and put it behind the Kwik e mart! :rolleyes2:

 

[jazzeum]

Based on the story and the additional research I did, it's really hard to know what the issue is. However, considered with all the other issues raised by the Southern heritage people, this one seems , at this point, minor. An issue that has garnered more controversy is the renaming of Bedford Forrest Park in Memphis.

This has really nothing to do with PC, which seems always the easy answer but really doesn't get at the reasons. The South is a changing part of the country that is an attractive place to live and is drawing different ethnic groups, as well as African Americans, who are, in a sense, returning home and now finding it a more hospitable place to live. Some of these vestiges of the post Civil War era bother some because of what they represent. However, the groups on the other side, find changing these symbols equally disturbing and governments are trying to accommodate both.

Comparing this with other countries really doesn't make a lot of sense unless you compare it to civil wars those countries have suffered because they have their own issues.

There is a burgeoning field of Civil War studies called Civil War memory and this issue fits right into that. The leading work in the field is David Blight's Race and Reunion is the seminal text. If you're interested in the Civil War, you need to read this book. How we remember a certain event can be as important as the event itself.

 

[Rob]

What you say maybe true Brad, but do those people 'returning ' to the south have the right to say to the locals ' I know your heritage, history, family sacrifice means a lot to you but that is secondary to me possibly taking offence'. The ACW almost tore the US apart, the death rate enormous and the suffering immense. I believe descendents of both sides have the right to have their memorials left alone they are after all a reminder of the suffering on both sides. I got to say that if anyone wanted to remove the Cenotaph for fear of upsetting the Germans I'd be up there with pitchfork and torch.

Rob

 

[Scott]

You'd think anyone going into court to face justice would have a bit more to worry about than a statue of a soldier outside that's been there for many many years, wouldn't you. I seriously doubt THAT many people worry about it. I'm sure the statue meant a great deal to folk when it was put up, why all of a sudden SHOULD it be moved, what's next, hey I don't like what Lincoln did lets move his statue and put it behind the Kwik e mart! :rolleyes2:

I'm guessing that some modern Southerners would be concerned whether they would get justice in a court "guarded" by the threatening/guarding statue of a soldier representing the majority race and religion and the aim to keep the majority on top.

There was contraversy about the Lincoln statue in Richmond, but as Lincoln actually did make a victory tour of Richmond, That statue is appropriate unlike the Confederate statues sent to the United States Capitol building by former Confederate states since those heroes tried to leave the United States. Just sayin'.