General McArthur (2 Viewers)

damian

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From Publishers Weekly
Reviewed by James BradyAt the heart of David Halberstam's massive and powerful new history of the Korean War is a bloody, losing battle fought in November 1950 in the snow-covered mountains of North Korea by outnumbered American GIs and Marines against the Chinese Communist Army.Halberstam's villain is not North Korea's Kim Il Sung or China's Chairman Mao or even the Soviet Union's Josef Stalin, who pulled the strings. It's the legendary general Douglas MacArthur, the aging, arrogant, politically ambitious architect of what the author calls the single greatest American military miscalculation of the war, MacArthur's decision to go all the way to the Yalu [River] because he was sure the Chinese would not come in.Much of the story is familiar. What distinguishes this version by Halberstam (who died this year in a California auto crash) is his reportorial skill, honed in Vietnam in Pulitzer-winning dispatches to the New York Times. His pounding narrative, in which GIs and generals describe their coldest winter, whisks the reader along, even though we know the ending.Most Korean War scholars agree that MacArthur's sprint to the border of great China with a Siberian winter coming on resulted in a lethal nightmare. Though focused on that mountain battle, Halberstam's book covers the entire war, from the sudden dawn attack by Kim Il Sung's Soviet-backed North Koreans against the U.S.-trained South, on June 25, 1950, to its uneasy truce in 1953. It was a smallish war but a big Cold War story: Harry Truman, Stalin and Mao, Joe McCarthy and Eisenhower, George C. Marshall and Omar Bradley, among others, stride through it. A few quibbles: there were no B-17 bombers destroyed on Wake Island the day after Pearl Harbor, as Halberstam asserts, and Halberstam gives his minor characters too much attention.At first MacArthur did well, toughing out those early months when the first GIs sent in from cushy billets in occupied Japan were overwhelmed by Kim's rugged little peasant army. MacArthur's greatest gamble led to a marvelous turning point: the invasion at Inchon in September, when he outflanked the stunned Reds. After Inchon, the general headed north and his luck ran out. His sycophants, intelligence chief Willoughby and field commander Ned Almond, refused to believe battlefield evidence indicating the Chinese Communists had quietly infiltrated North Korea and were lying in wait. The Marines fought their way out as other units disintegrated. In the end, far too late, Truman sacked MacArthur.Alive with the voices of the men who fought, Halberstam's telling is a virtuoso work of history. (Sept.)James Brady, columnist at Parade and Forbes.com, is author of several books about Korea. His latest book is Why Marines Fight (St. Martin's, Nov.).
Copyright © Reed Business Information, a division of Reed Elsevier Inc. All rights reserved.

I thought this book review would be a good way of starting off a thread about General McArthur. There have been some posts about him on a number of different threads. I wonder what people think of him.

Regards
Damian Clarke
 
I have always thought he should have been tried and imprisoned or executed for treason. He disregarded a direct order from his commander and chief, and got literally thousands of G.I.'s and Marines killed, all in a quest to recapture the glory of his victories in WWII. If anyone but a WWII hero like MacArthur had pulled a stunt like this, he would have ended up in Levenworth or in front of a firing squad. He was a disgrace to the United States military tradition. I know this is going to open a huge can of worms, but think what would happen if a general could disregard a president's orders with impunity: the illusion of democracy would be dispelled, and this country would become a nothing more than a banana republic.
 
The best comment I've ever read about MacArthur is from Eisenhower, who when asked if he knew MacArthur stated, "Yes, I studied dramatics under him for five years.":D:D:D
 
The best comment I've ever read about MacArthur is from Eisenhower, who when asked if he knew MacArthur stated, "Yes, I studied dramatics under him for five years.":D:D:D

Or likewise Mac's comment about Ike when he became Pres "He was the best chief of staff I ever had."

:D
 
I have always thought he should have been tried and imprisoned or executed for treason. He disregarded a direct order from his commander and chief, and got literally thousands of G.I.'s and Marines killed, all in a quest to recapture the glory of his victories in WWII. If anyone but a WWII hero like MacArthur had pulled a stunt like this, he would have ended up in Levenworth or in front of a firing squad. He was a disgrace to the United States military tradition. I know this is going to open a huge can of worms, but think what would happen if a general could disregard a president's orders with impunity: the illusion of democracy would be dispelled, and this country would become a nothing more than a banana republic.

Yeah, these are clearly some stinging comments- funny thing about leadership- you can be the darling of the ball one minute (Inchon) and then be the biggest SOB on the face of the earth. This was our first foray into the debacle of "limited warfare". To Mac and the rest of them, this was a concept they just didn't understand at all. Funny thing about calling him a "Disgrace to the military tradition"- with the recent passing of the USMA 200th anniversary, his speech in the 60's was regarded as one of the most popular moments in military history.

The politicians failed with Korea way before Mac ever did anything over there- 45 minutes to develop the DMZ- no thought put forth, just go along with the Soviet demands and be done with it.

Mac will probably be the most controversial figure in US Army history- his "handling" of the DC squatters during the Depression is another hornets nest.

I can think of a lot of other commanders who would probably be more deserving of a firing squad before Mac ever was......
 
Hi Guys,

I can never be considered a fan of the man but he was a stunning organizer in WWII and was with out a doubt quite brave during the fighting in WWI but by the time he hit the skids in Korea he had lost the edge and was so totally full of himself he thought he was invincible, to my friends who have been in Korea this is a stage of whats known as the SoJu Experience.:eek: SoJu (spelling) is a form of Korean White Lightning that will when consumed makes you a lot of things like invincible and invisable among other things:eek:. So perhaps he was just a little too far gone to get anything other than relieved of his command and sent packing.

Dave
 
Hi Guys,

.... this is a stage of whats known as the SoJu Experience.:eek: SoJu (spelling) is a form of Korean White Lightning that will when consumed makes you a lot of things like invincible and invisable among other things:eek:.
Dave

WHAT??? But I was invisible AND invincible when I drank Soju!!! Honest Dave- I was!!!! :D:D:D The best solution for C&C (Cover and Conceament).
 
Don't forget that "Dugout Doug" always chased the ghost of his father Arthur MacArthur who won a Medal of Honor during the Civil War.
 
USA forumites might be interested to know McArthurs HQ's in Brisbane has been preserved as a small museum here in Brisbane. Strange the City Council donated hundred's of thousands to his little museum when there is no museum here commemorating Australian military history.
Aussie WWII vets fans of McArthur as a lot of them killed in what they thought were unnecessary operations in the Pacific whilst he went on to get all the glory.
Regards
Brett Williams
 
Strange the City Council donated hundred's of thousands to his little museum when there is no museum here commemorating Australian military history.
Brett Williams

That's just a terrible terrible shame!! In all honesty, I wonder how a memorial would go here in the States with us honoring our allies who fell in battle with us- or even a commander like that. I have a feeling, unfortunately, that that would be a tough sell for anyone who planned on doing that. We do really owe a lot of our success in WW2, Korea and Nam to troops from many different nations.

But yeah, that is just awful. :(
 
Oops ! Just noticed major typing error in my previous entry. Should read Aussie WWII vets not fans of McArthur.
When I first came here in 1997 I did a lot of research into Australian military history and museums. There is a great museum in Canberra called the Australian War Memorial which is well worth a visit. However the rest of the country is seriously lacking in museums commemorating Australian military heritage.
In Brisbane there is no Government/Council museum where you can take your kids to learn about ANZAC's, Gallipoli, Kokoda, or Vietnam etc. Very surprising as Australians have always contributed a lot to WWI, WWII, Korea, Vietnam, Timor, Afghanistan and Iraq considering a small population of only 20 million.
Govts/Councils seem more interested in spending big money on aboriginal or modern art that most people can't relate to. I visited the museum of the last remaining regular Lighthorse Regiment several years ago and it was a shock to see how little they had considering one of the oldest units.
Regards
Brett
 
Oops ! Just noticed major typing error in my previous entry. Should read Aussie WWII vets not fans of McArthur.

And I'm sure there are are plenty of US vets that aren't fans of Doug ;)

When I first came here in 1997 I did a lot of research into Australian military history and museums. There is a great museum in Canberra called the Australian War Memorial which is well worth a visit. However the rest of the country is seriously lacking in museums commemorating Australian military heritage.
In Brisbane there is no Government/Council museum where you can take your kids to learn about ANZAC's, Gallipoli, Kokoda, or Vietnam etc. Very surprising as Australians have always contributed a lot to WWI, WWII, Korea, Vietnam, Timor, Afghanistan and Iraq considering a small population of only 20 million.
Govts/Councils seem more interested in spending big money on aboriginal or modern art that most people can't relate to. I visited the museum of the last remaining regular Lighthorse Regiment several years ago and it was a shock to see how little they had considering one of the oldest units.
Regards
Brett

I guess we can partly blame Political Correctness and Revisionism for this.

However, I feel there is also an Aussie Culture side to this that would be more appropriate for the "Culture - etc" thread, so I'll post something there.
 
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