How do TS companies interact - my many questions (1 Viewer)

[zulucollector]

It is me or do TS companies tend not to compete with others in certain ranges. For example you think it would be natural for K&C to recycle some of their armour and planes and produce a Spanish Civil War condor series. Does Spanish Civil War not sell well or do they think John Jenkins has already cornered the market. Why does Wbritains no longer produce WW2 items as that seems to be a large lucrative market and one of the few majors that avoid this segment. Who wants to compete with Wbritains on the AZW and War on the Nile front? Conte but that is about it albeit on a limited basis.. Why does K&C not restart their roman and Japanese lines where sales weak or do not want to compete with upstarts First legion and Figarti respectively. Is there a first mover advantage of doing a line in the toy soldier world? Do successful lines die because of creativity (nothing left to produce) or simply sales temper off over time.... Can you think of a line or a theatre of war that is not produced by a major company that is commercially feasible? I am finding that TS companies are becoming like movie studios and focusing on additions to already successful lines and less inclined on new development....

 

[Mitch]

for me a neglected area of WWII would be the Scandinavian campaign and the Italian front. JJD started the SCW and surely one would think that the two I mentioned would be more interesting to collectors and, allow manufacturers a wide range (or at least I could think of a wide range of products) of items to fit that are new and fresh

I think manufacturers now are doing what you say one only has to look at what one releases and the others seemingly follow. There are plenty of examples of this across the board
Mitch

It is me or do TS companies tend not to compete with others in certain ranges. For example you think it would be natural for K&C to recycle some of their armour and planes and produce a Spanish Civil War condor series. Does Spanish Civil War not sell well or do they think John Jenkins has already cornered the market. Why does Wbritains no longer produce WW2 items as that seems to be a large lucrative market and one of the few majors that avoid this segment. Who wants to compete with Wbritains on the AZW and War on the Nile front? Conte but that is about it albeit on a limited basis.. Why does K&C not restart their roman and Japanese lines where sales weak or do not want to compete with upstarts First legion and Figarti respectively. Is there a first mover advantage of doing a line in the toy soldier world? Do successful lines die because of creativity (nothing left to produce) or simply sales temper off over time.... Can you think of a line or a theatre of war that is not produced by a major company that is commercially feasible? I am finding that TS companies are becoming like movie studios and focusing on additions to already successful lines and less inclined on new development....

 

[REVWARBUFF]

This is a very keen observation you have. You touched on many of the thoughts that I've had as well and I am certain many others have too.

I wish I had some answers but like you, I only have questions about this. Perhaps some of the more senior collectors who have been in the hobby long enough will know. Or better yet, maybe Andy N or Ken O can respond and shed some light.

 

[theBaron]

I think it's a question that can be applied to any market and product. Companies may decide to specialize and capture a niche, or they may decide that a particular segment of a market is saturated and it's not worth the initial costs to compete against the established manufacturers.

Prost!
Brad

 

[Phantom Warrior]

I think it's a question that can be applied to any market and product. Companies may decide to specialize and capture a niche, or they may decide that a particular segment of a market is saturated and it's not worth the initial costs to compete against the established manufacturers.

Prost!
Brad

Or it may be as simple as "how many ranges can a company produce" Even big companies like K&C and WB can't produce everything. they don't have the capacity and the market isn't likely big enough to absorb all the product. K&C already gets complaints about neglected ranges. imagine if companies all produced more ranges.

Terry

 

[theBaron]

Or it may be as simple as "how many ranges can a company produce" Even big companies like K&C and WB can't produce everything. they don't have the capacity and the market isn't likely big enough to absorb all the product. K&C already gets complaints about neglected ranges. imagine if companies all produced more ranges.

Terry

Very true!

 

[trooper]

Yet again a question apparently about the whole TS market that only refers to three or four companies. Why doesn't someone take the time and interest to look at the entire market? There are dozens of companies in the world producing all types of figurines from all types of periods yet no one can be bothered to deviate from the well worn tracks that have been debated ad infinitum to the point of nausea. And don't start responding that company XYZ only produces gloss, most, if not all, companies will produce matt painted items IF ASKED. A lot of these companies were producing ranges long before the likes of WB and K&C jumped on that particular band wagon. Little Legion was, and still is, the producer of an immense line of Zulu War, Wilson Edwards was producing ALH, ATS has the largest range of Napoleonics in the entire industry. There are small one man band companies all over the world producing a massive variety of items yet no one ever mentions the little companies in South America, Czechoslovakia, Germany and Italy as well as those in the US and UK. So please can we have a more balanced view of the industry? Trooper

 

[maddadicus]

Yet again a question apparently about the whole TS market that only refers to three or four companies. Why doesn't someone take the time and interest to look at the entire market? There are dozens of companies in the world producing all types of figurines from all types of periods yet no one can be bothered to deviate from the well worn tracks that have been debated ad infinitum to the point of nausea. And don't start responding that company XYZ only produces gloss, most, if not all, companies will produce matt painted items IF ASKED. A lot of these companies were producing ranges long before the likes of WB and K&C jumped on that particular band wagon. Little Legion was, and still is, the producer of an immense line of Zulu War, Wilson Edwards was producing ALH, ATS has the largest range of Napoleonics in the entire industry. There are small one man band companies all over the world producing a massive variety of items yet no one ever mentions the little companies in South America, Czechoslovakia, Germany and Italy as well as those in the US and UK. So please can we have a more balanced view of the industry? Trooper

In all honesty, most of the cottage companies that you cite, do not promote or participate on this forum, have no working website, are more expensive than the mass produced stuff, no easy to the U.S. order process, etc. etc. Some, we only hear of ,exist from snippets of photos offered from the U.K. TS shows. This forum represents mostly main stream TS collectors and thus the fixation on the big guys' offerings. Not saying that is right, but if the small guys want to be noticed, they need to toot their horn, offer pics of their stuff and get in tune with the 20th century worldwide marketplace..Michael

 

[jazzeum]

Michael has hit the nail on the head. Better marketing is needed. If a tree falls in the forest, does anyone know.

Moreover, rightly or wrongly, most on this Forum, at least those who post, follow the big companies, not the smaller ones. You cannot change human nature. You can make your points but it shouldn't be with the expectation that you will change their mind.

Brad

 

[trooper]

In all honesty, most of the cottage companies that you cite, do not promote or participate on this forum, have no working website, are more expensive than the mass produced stuff, no easy to the U.S. order process, etc. etc. Some, we only hear of ,exist from snippets of photos offered from the U.K. TS shows. This forum represents mostly main stream TS collectors and thus the fixation on the big guys' offerings. Not saying that is right, but if the small guys want to be noticed, they need to toot their horn, offer pics of their stuff and get in tune with the 20th century worldwide marketplace..Michael

I cannot disagree with some of your points, however you are incorrect when you say that most have no working website, some do not but the majority do, and you are way off the mark when you say they are more expensive than "the mass produced stuff". If you care to examine the prices you will find the majority are half the price of the "big guys". And IMO a true TS collector is open to all ideas and is not just a blind follower of certain makes, there is a lot of good stuff out there if you only take the trouble to look and not just expect everything to be presented to you on a plate. All I ask is a little effort to see what else is available.Trooper

 

[johnnybach]

I cannot disagree with some of your points, however you are incorrect when you say that most have no working website, some do not but the majority do, and you are way off the mark when you say they are more expensive than "the mass produced stuff". If you care to examine the prices you will find the majority are half the price of the "big guys". And IMO a true TS collector is open to all ideas and is not just a blind follower of certain makes, there is a lot of good stuff out there if you only take the trouble to look and not just expect everything to be presented to you on a plate. All I ask is a little effort to see what else is available.Trooper

Well - a bit of truth from both sides of the pond here, in my opinion.

In a couple of cases - it may be true that some of "The Cottagers" don't have web-sites, or set-up for Paypal - and all of the other bits and pieces which make things easier for purchasers etcetera - which it has to be admitted, make it much easier for potential customers to view and maybe go on to purchase items. BUT - and it's a BIG BUT - one has to weigh the potential benefits of making, updating and running a web-site - and the associated costs therein, with what extra business they might generate. Very often, such suppliers are one-man-bands - and running on slim margins. It also has to be said that import/export costs - like customs, postal and import charges - means that import/export to the USA holds further obstacles for the small supplier.


On the other hand - I do agree with Trooper - that potential customers (from anywhere), may well be unaware of some of the excellent products - often at far more reasonable prices than some of the more popular marques - and who maybe are tending to often be ignored or passed by as a result.

Would it be worth it for each to have a nice web-site???? Who am I to say - these guys and gals know their businesses better than I.

However - I do agree - that it often isn't all that easy to find out just what IS out there - and - as this observation from the other side of the pond makes clear - many potential customers may be being missing out - and so may be some of the smaller British makers. Just today, for example, I was able to advise a TS enthusiast that ATS would supply figures as castings - which he was completely unaware of.


Now ATS DOES have a particularly good web presence - BUT again - it isn't immediately clear from looking at it - that figures may be purchased in Matte/Gloss/ OR unpainted castings.

Maybe Mike and Trooper, BOTH have points to make? jb

 

[VIRIATO]

I have collected both mass product and cottage product. Even when the cottage TS are not that easily available I find that part of the pleasure comes from the discovery and the hunt (provided some minimum reliability and feasibility is provided of course). A perfect example of such a fantastic cottage producer, a personal favourite of mine: Imperial Productions of NZ.
Something that I find a little annoying with some of the big players is the retirement thing, at least to my slow collecting pace^&grin...

Paulo