Inappropriate content in Caen (1 Viewer)

[Bayern]

Mitch- I don't disagree with you entirely- as I said before, I am not against the set, and if I collected that era, I would buy it. But try to understand where Ludwig is coming from. Obviously, we have a bit of a "forum fight" brewing here. There are clearly some very deep sentiments on both sides, and I think we all need to cool down, take stock of some points others have made, and let this thread lie (no exception on my part either). I'm sure the mods will be visiting shortly, and we should thank them for being willing to play the "bad guys" or the "parents" on this forum.
Respectfully,
Sandor

Sandor, you are a winning intellect...

I share your view on the moderators...

At times they make me mad too..but they do a good jod at making fair decisions...

Many are taking this out of context in some semblance of a freedom of speech violation...

Treefrog is a small forum...it is not a country or the world. Shannon and Peter run it in a good and Christian way in my view..

and as a Christian first and foremost I will end this with...

GOD BLESS ALL OF YOU..

Ludwig

 

[Mitch]

This is the second time that you have alluded to the fact that you have some of my posts at hand. Please grow up either post them or please refrain from going on about them. What qualification does one need to discuss the merits or, demerits about you disliking a certain set or, come to that matter the history of WWII.

Does this mean that unless you went through it one cannot talk about it? the dig at germany and its leader is the part I am questioning as I would like to know how you came to this conclusion

I certainly have not taken offence from your posts perhaps you could PM its seems more that you are sailing close to the rudeness aspect more than I am.

Perhaps you should PM me with the part I was asking about if you wish not to answer it on open forum????

Sandor...

I don't think the mods need to intervene and certainly don't think this is a fight in any way shape or form. I think Robs sentiments hit the nail on the head about what I was getting at I don't see the link between the two nor, from recent contact do some german posters
Mitch
Mitch

Mitch, I am going to be honest and please do not take offense. I may not have been a member of this forum for long but I have read it sice...say 2005 I think.

You tend to have negative and argumentative posts at times. I do not want this to escalate into one of them. I have plenty of examples of those on hand already. I do not think you are qualified to even make comments in this case.

I dug this out of our pile that was once our family home. It was melted on the hearth by the shear heat of the fire that burned it to the ground.

View attachment 98917View attachment 98918

...what was worse we used it for years.....because we had nothing else....

when I need to come down a peg or two....I remember those days..

Where were you when this was happening Mitch?...were you even a gleam in your Fathers eye yet....

...you already have the answers to all of your questions anyway....

Ludwig

 

[vividgraphx]

I agree with Ludwig. My family is from Germany and to this day people call us the N word...Nazis. I was born and raised in America,my parents are from the Fatherland. Because they speak German and have a strong accent when speaking English people ask them if they used to be Nazis. All the time. My grandmother voted for Hitler and always felt partly responsible for the war because of that. Of course its in no way her fault but maybe seeing a set like that would have made her feel even worse for her decisions. I would like to see soldiers throwing darts at an image maybe but urinating and deficating soldiers go to far and have no place in collections or dioramas. Stalin was more of a tyrant than Hitler yet he does not get disrespected in the world of miniatures. I don't see sets of Hiroshima survivors disrespecting an image of Truman. Just reminders of Germany's past. - Keith. Oh ya maybe that latest sculpt of the Yalta set is considered an insult to other leaders I suppose.

 

[Rob]

I agree with Ludwig. My family is from Germany and to this day people call us the N word...Nazis. I was born and raised in America,my parents are from the Fatherland. Because they speak German and have a strong accent when speaking English people ask them if they used to be Nazis. All the time. My grandmother voted for Hitler and always felt partly responsible for the war because of that. Of course its in no way her fault but maybe seeing a set like that would have made her feel even worse for her decisions. I would like to see soldiers throwing darts at an image maybe but urinating and deficating soldiers go to far and have no place in collections or dioramas. Stalin was more of a tyrant than Hitler yet he does not get disrespected in the world of miniatures. I don't see sets of Hiroshima survivors disrespecting an image of Truman. Just reminders of Germany's past. - Keith. Oh ya maybe that latest sculpt of the Yalta set is considered an insult to other leaders I suppose.

With respect no one has mentioned Germans being Nazi's at all. This needs to be kept in perspective. Its not about today's Germans, tomorrow's Germans, its about a picture of Hitler. Whilst no one here blames German people its also not the fault of others if they feel guilty, it is I'm afraid a by product of what happened. It's also not cool to dictate to people what they can and cannot buy because you don't want to be reminded, other countries suffered too and if they want a figure of a Tommy taking a leak on Hitler its fine by me. My family suffered in the Blitz, but I've never complained about a figure of Goering being released.

Rob

 

[Mitch]

perhaps, Andy could take a leaf out of the jeremy clarkson school of charm and release one of trueman being peed on by a japanese trooper one of a german peeing on Stalin etc etc and if anyone was offended then they could post their own national figure as a response!!!!
Mitch

 

[uksubs]

I've been in London all day today and have been unable to post on this thread, but I don't know where to start!

First of all as my old mum would say, if you can't say something nice don't say anything at all! Ludwig I think you are a breath of fresh air my friend, your passion for the hobby, your country and your now eliminated :wink2: football team is admirable and it is alwyas a pleasure to converse with you here.

But.....we have to disagree my friend.

We are surely not saying are we that any insult against Hitler is an insult against Germany? Nobody with more than eleven brain cells blames the current genertion of Germans for what went on, it would be absurd. You are are an intelligent person Ludwig, you're not really saying ' Ok, I know he was the architect of the Holocaust, his ' foreign policy' brought nothing but misery, slavery and death from the skies to millions of people......but he was our leader so don't insult him!!{eek3}{eek3} It makes no sense at all mate. When that piece of filth crawled out of the toilet he was created in he not only enslaved large parts of Europe (not my part , thank God for the RAF) but brought upon Germany its greatest misery in its History. The day we are not allowed to insult this....depraved, perverted, obscenity of a human being will not only be a dark day indeed but a true insult to the millions of people of the allied and German nations that lost their lives eradicating the plague he spread round Europe.

As for your Obama remark its not worthy of you my friend. If President Obama decided on a policy of murdering all Jewish people and invading Canada and Mexico to make living space for American people, do you not honestly think we here would be hurling insults at him, I think you know they are not alike in any way at all.

Finally I'll mention the actual figure. I will be buying this and putting it in my dio. So as not to offend anyone I will do the following. Before the posts containing the pictures I will post another post that warns readers that the following thread contains the figure and if they are offended by it please read no further, this way anyone who does not like the figure will not be offended whilst we who do can enjoy it without upsetting others, that sound fair mate?

As always its good to talk with you Ludwig, just because we disagree on something doesn't mean we don't get along, just ask my missus{eek3}^&grin:wink2:

If you're reading this darling....didn't mean it!!!^&grin

Rob

{bravo}}
Brillant post Rob

 

[Blowtorch]

I posted a dio with the new "In der fuhrer's face" set. One forum member got upset about Adolf being peed on. The rest is history. I did have about a 3 minute good
laugh to myself. You had to see it.

I saw it, I just could figure out what the problem was. I thought it must have either provoked a deluge of tasteless remarks or a new level of political correctness wrt the moderators had been reached at the forum which we should be made aware of.

When I come here, I generally take off my logic & thinking cap. I learned that last year on the history forum...it's just not worth it. I figure, there are a bunch of old timers in this hobby who are set in there ways & all the mods want to do here is keep the peace, so be it. Just let it go. What I find funny is that Hitler has always been fair game to poke an eye at and now TF has defended him! {sm4} Now that's a first!!

Ludwig's point like many other's I don't understand, though I won't argue with as per above. Hitler, Germany & Germans are not unique to invasions, breaking treaties & genocide, and I get why they were ticked off after WW1. I get why, probably more than most, WW2 had to happen. And to call Adolf a monster is a bit too easy for society, as it implies the rest of us are not. If I were a German I would be upset not so much at him getting Germany in war, as it was a powderkeg & tensions were high...but the crazy (traitorous) way he ended it. He realized the war was lost by 1943 & yet was determined to drag everyone down with him due to his ego & selfishness, which he did completely.

He took the the most advanced country on earth known for nothing more than progress, and made it synonymous with 'the bad guys', evil, and turned an accent into representing war instead of science & philosophy like it used to, and let it's cities get burnt to the ground.

 

[Bayern]

Don't worry a bit! I think its important that we learn to think the way others do, because ultimately, a lack of willingness to understand and collectively solve problems between peoples and nations is what leads to wars such as WWI, and thus WWII. Thank you again for your post- let me see if I can put it in another way below:
Anyone who has been to Germany, or has a German acquaintance who they have discussed WWII with, knows that WWII is an extremely sensitive subject. Germany is a rightfully proud nation- as a group of history nuts, we all know of its long and wonderful history, from fighting the Romans, to being the cradle of the Reformation. Then there was WWII- a horrible man led a nation of willing and unwilling people to commit some of the worst crimes in history. Imagine your family- a long a proud history perhaps- and then some criminal who killed 15 people in a bank robbery. While you may have no sympathy for him whatsoever, a toy toy soldier set depicting someone peeing on his portrait might hit a nerve, or make you uncomfortable. It was hard for me to understand why people were offended by this set, but now I do. It's not really about the insult to Hitler, but about the insult to Germany, and I think we can understand how this makes Germans feel.
-Sandor

Sandor,

I swore I would not answer back on this thread again when I left it with God Bless but I could not help but to log in for you.

You are an admirable young intellect my young friend. I hope you are using it to change this world of ours...and...I hope to meet you someday.

I was looking at how many hits this thread has and how few the latest displays have. Perhaps we could look at PA's latest two instead.

Ludwig

 

[Jack]

I do not agree with the removal of the picture, but it is a privately owned forum and the owners have every right to delete material as they see fit. In my home its my rules and the forum is no different.

One question I would like to ask is this - Is it offensive because it is, by its very nature, offensive or does it take a complaint for it to become offensive? I think that if it is unacceptable content the member's complaint only sped the process up. I assume it would have been removed once a moderator saw it, with or without the added impetus of a complaint.

One further thing - Rob, surely as an Englishman, you understand that the valour of the RAF and its allies saved the UK in the short to mid term, but there was one greater player in the mix. As always, it was the RN which kept GB good, great and free!{sm4}

 

[jager7080]

I do not agree with the removal of the picture, but it is a privately owned forum and the owners have every right to delete material as they see fit. In my home its my rules and the forum is no different.

One question I would like to ask is this - Is it offensive because it is, by its very nature, offensive or does it take a complaint for it to become offensive? I think that if it is unacceptable content the member's complaint only sped the process up. I assume it would have been removed once a moderator saw it, with or without the added impetus of a complaint.

One further thing - Rob, surely as an Englishman, you understand that the valour of the RAF and its allies saved the UK in the short to mid term, but there was one greater player in the mix. As always, it was the RN which kept GB good, great and free!{sm4}

Jack ,

Just to throw my two cents into the pot...That is a good question , kind of like if a tree falls in the forest & nobody is there , does it make a sound ? Is something offensive if nobody complains about it ?
I didn't see the picture in question , just got an idea in my mind of what it was...I geuss the real question that should be being asked is to what standard we want to hold as a forum or toy soldier community...Forget about arguing whether Hitler or Stalin or Churchill is getting dumped on by whatever soldier...I like this forum for the historical conversation & knowledgable insight the members bring...The modeling skill or pieces collectors have or want to share...All i know if i had company @ my home & was showing somebody this site whom had no knowledge of toy soldiers , i believe that if that person was to see a pic such as that the immediate thought would be the toy soldier community is nothing but sophmoric guys...that would be the impression...

 

[PanzerAce1944]

Greetings Gents, Well as the one who posted the dio yesterday I thought I would give my 2 cents worth. As it is quite apparant by my own avatar and user name,
I have a strong liking for WWII German armaments and equipment. Have always been keen to Tiger tanks, the legendary 88mm, the design of the uniforms, etc.
The appearance of the LAH in a parade setting always seemed eye catching and amazing. That's where the appeal ends at the visual effects of the parades, as their ideals
were the evil forces that they were.I am myself a WWII European Theater history buff.......not a nazi................................
This being said I think WWII Germans are some of the most collected items to date.I have all of the individual Adolf figures released since 2007, based upon the impact he had on the world back then and even to this day. None of this means I worship him and his ideals.I also have American troops,Tanks, RAF aircraft, figures of
Montgomery,Churchill,Rommel, Eisenhower, Russian Tanks and troops abound as 8 out of every 10 German troops back then went up against the Russians.
All of this part of 20th century history.Now getting to the meat of the matter !!!!
When the "In Der Fuhrer's Face" set was first shown in dispatches my first reaction was simply........brilliant ! A realistic depiction of actions that occured I'm sure quite often by all sides. I ordered the set in question along with another Tommie figure and the CAEN sign for my pending little dio. By the way these new British troops are
well done ! Getting back to the root of the matter I knew I had to have this set. To me this set is thinking outside of the box,while being quite realistic to be frank !
I recieved the above mentioned items yesterday and went right to work on a little dio to post these to the forum.The dio setting was a cobblestone road with a CS Dutch
building as a back drop, the peeing Tommy and picture frame on the ground and another Tommy urging him on to hurry and finish his playfullness.
As we know Ludwig took offense to the dio picture and told me openly he did not like it at all. I at that point myself contacted one of the mods and told him to have a look
and let him make the decision on it. I did quite frankly get a chuckle out of the whole thing, but respect Ludwigs concerns over the matter . Their decision to pull it was
based upon a younger person viewing the thread more than anything else, as far as I know. Sorry for any hassle caused to those involved but to me.....................
The "In Der Fuhrer's Face" is a classic release. Glad I bought it. To me being a new release it deserved the right to be shown just as any other new item .Just another snap shot of History !!!!! Cheers Friends

 

[thebritfarmer]

I think those that wanted to have their say have now done so. Therefore I have now closed the thread.