Mounted Egyptian Cavalry Band c.1900 (2 Viewers)

[johnnybach]

I am beginning the assembly of a Mounted Egyptian Cavalry Band - made up from some castings from Dorset Soldiers - although these are not stock items - so will need some converting and adaptation to fit. To remind what I am trying to achieve - see the forllowing pics below.

This next one was provided by my good friend Trooper - and showed the colours of the uniform. Note the hand-tinted photo - which shows the plastron of the tunic as off-white to buff colour. Note also the blue putees have been coloured brown - and look like boots in this picture.

Another illustration found recently, shows further detail of the tunic - such as belt and epaulettes.

I bagan by assembling two horses - drum-horse and bombardon player's horse. Horses were drilled and pinned to a good solid fabricated base. Note that I began painting the drum-horse and drums - as well as the drummer. The bombardon is a tricky instrument to fit/paint - so I always like to paint the figure before fitting the instrument on - as it is tricky to do the detail later. Note that some modification of each figure will be necessary - as the cap lines of the british lancer are moulded in. Scalpel and file remove them.

Next pic shows the drummer now fixed to the horse ( pinned and epoxy resin glueD - forever!). Note that the drums have been partly painted to a colour advised by a friend of mine in Los Angeles - who is very keen on this period. The centre circle is red with white moon and star - as Egypt was part of the Ottoman Empire at this time (c.1900). The green background and yellow edge and detail are highly likely - as green has great significance and reverence in the Muslim faith. The half-shabraque was coloured similarly - as an educated guess.

I'll stop here - as photobucket is playing up - and I have had this dumped twice already - so will come back with more later. johnnybach

 

[GICOP]

Now this IS going to turn into one of my favourite threads jb, I just know it {bravo}}

Cheers

Martyn

 

[johnnybach]

I hope you can see from this pic - some more detail. Note that the bombardon player is still not fixed to an unpainted horse - but the pin allows me to place him there for pieces to set or dry. Arms needed a bit of tweaking to put them and instrument together on the body. Hope you can now see why I pre-paint the plastron/buttons before assembling. Note the milliput filler in joints - which will need touching in with paint. generally pleased with the effect so far - but early days yet. I always start with the most difficult instruments to fit, paint and assemble - so the rest should be easier. More later - photobucket is still playing up! Maybe best to do one pic at a time! jb

 

[johnnybach]

Drums now fitted to the horse. It would probably have been better to paint the putees /boots/spurs first - but I really wanted to see how they looked, as I had to re-drill the holes to accept them with this figure - as they weren't sitting right. I also need to do a lot of detail finishing with this piece - though everything is assembled and all of the main things have been completed. Base to do as well.

The bombardon figure has all the hard bits done now - so just the detail painting for him - and of course, his horse. Hope you can see from thids angle, how the instrument coils around the figure. Note also the double stripe down each leg - paint one thick white stripe - then paint a thin blue one down the centre.

Anyway - made a start with this little project - which is running alongside some vehicles that I'm undertaking. More on them later. jb

 

[Obee]

jb,

wow, another mounted band coming our way, I'll be eagerly watching thier progress of the coming month to see your handiwork transform them.

Looks like a very colourful set coming our way,

well done,

John

 

[johnnybach]

Cheers John and Martyn - To the best of my knowledge, nobody has ever made these as a band before. I had the idea for it when I was repairing an old Britains hollowcast Cavalry figure - and wondered if they ever had a mounted band. Poking around the web, I found the picture - and then got hooked. Just about my favourite TS subject is a band - and a mounted one is best of all.

I have bought ten figures - each with a different instrument - to start this one off. As you know, real bands often have multiples of instruments in them - so when I have finished this first ten - I'll have a closer look at that first photo again, and decide on how many I'll eventually end up with - as Giles will never run out of the castings that I have used to make these up. Glad you both like 'em so far. jb

Here's another (somewhat diagramatic) pic I found - which helped me decide to have a go at them.

Egyptian Cavalry Bandsman Uniform

 

[johnnybach]

Thought I would show how things progress and develop with this pic. Left to right are four Musicians at different stages of development.

Kettle-drummer is most developed - and I have decided to add a bit of texture to the Sand-coloured base ( well - we are in Egypt!). I have scraped back the first coat of paint ( a mix of Humbrol 103 and 94) and glued on some rocks and pebbles (lentils). Another coat or two - and he will be almost ready for a coat of varnish - to seal in the paintwork.

Next up - is my Bombardon player, whose horse has had a second coat of white ( easy to do these white horses - though I prefer Ivory paint - Gloss 41). He needs cuffs and puttees/boots painted too. Incidentally - the plastron is also a mix of Ivory (41) and Buff (103)- so that belts etcetera show up better.

Third along is a trombonist in front of his unpainted horse, who has been pinned and glued to a newly fabricated base. (A thin alloy sheeting that I buy as offcuts from an engineering firm in my locality in the UK).'ve been fettling both to remove "flash" from the castings and fill in any hollows etc with milliput.

The last figure will be a Tuba player - and I thought I would include him to show how they are before much work has been undertaken. jb

 

[Napoleon1er]

Yessssssssssssss! I have been waiting for you to make this one!
Thanks,
Sandor

 

[thebritfarmer]

Brilliant JB, will look forward to watching this thread.

 

[Tinsoldier]

Very interesting. I Like it.

I was wondering why the belt across the figure. Ammunition pouch or Music pouch?
In the postcard image I am not sure how many have them.

A Rose lancer with modified head, putees would make a good start.

I assume that the officer would be in boots. Maybe a sword?

 

[johnnybach]

Hi Sandor and Scott - glad you are liking what you've seen so far - keep popping in to see how they develop - I'm as interested as you!

Hi Tinsoldier. The postcard picture of the dismounted band has been hand tinted - as many old cards often were. As you may see, the original tinter has tried to show boots on the marching musicians by overtinting their putees in brown. The plastron also appears as yellow, instead of white or light buff, and this tinting may have obliterated the cross-belt in the photo (if worn dismounted?). The diagramatic illustration by SR07 also shows this cross-belt in white.

As my band is going to be a TS version of the Mounted Band - I prefer to go with the picture of them mounted as my main guide. You can most clearly see the cross-belt on the rider of the drum horse. Why they wore it would be conjecture on my part - though a pouch at the rear adapted to take music cards would clearly be an option for a cavalry band. I have three other British Mounted Bands from around the turn of the Century - and all of those have cross-belts and rear pouches too. As the lancer-style uniform of the Egyptian Band is very close in appearance to British Bands of the time - I guess they adopted that belt and pouch as well.

I am using and adapting a British Lancer figures and horses from Dorset Soldiers for my band - and, as usual am trying for a Toy Soldier version in the style of early Best Britains in Gloss. I am however NOT striving for for absolute realism, as that's not what I like - though I could arguably get closer to reality by using another supplier of castings - as you suggest. I am just far more comfortable using Dorset castings - as I have used them many times before with good results - for what I'm after - Glossy Toy Soldiers.

I have used other Forums to gather information about this band - and the general consensus has been that the Band probably wore blue tunics and trousers with an off-white plastron and dark blue puttees - though longer boots MAY have been an option for "best dress" No-one has come up with a picture of them in proper long boots though - so I am going for putees - just overpainted onto the legs of my riders. If this looks too "naff" - I may overpaint them as boots later - but for now, I think they will look okay the way I first intended.

The band looks to be around thirty strong in the picture - though no Officer is visible. Yes - there probably was an Officer in charge - though he possibly may not have played any part in parades. (He may be the figure on the left of the picture seen almost in silhouette riding in the opposit direction with his back to the camera - and could be dressed as you suggest - who knows?). I have only been able to find these two pictures - and no Officer is clearly show taking part in either.

As mentioned earlier, I'm making up ten figures to begin with - each with a different instrument that was around at the time. If they turn out as well as I think they might - I will probably increase this number later to approximate the number in the photo. (You can clearly see at least one bombardon and two trombones in the front rank). [ My choice of instruments is: Kettledrums, Bassoon, Bombardon, Clarinet, Cornet, Euphonium, Sax, Tenor-Horn,Tuba, Trombone]. There looks to be six or seven ranks of four abreast in the pictured band - so 24 - or more likely, 28 figures were playing. I don't intend to make one up as an Officer though - it's just the Band as seen in the picture that I'm after. IF these turn out as intended, I will work out details for a Band using additional instruments as above - and Giles at Dorset will be in for an additional order for some 18 more figures - as we arranged when I collected these. Indeed, we had quite a fun day working out various options with castings on the floor of his shop - as the desk was too small to hold them all!

Anyway, cheers for now, I've rattled on too long - glad you like them so far too - johnnybach

 

[johnnybach]

And here's my first pass at the Kettledrummer figure, which I finished off this morning. (four views below). I will be working on the other instruments you've seen earlier - so will post as they are completed. Quite pleased with a colourful figure for these. I've taken a few liberties with some colours (e.g green shabraque) - but looks nice enough like this, I think.

 

[DMNamiot]

Wow Johnny that is a really nice looking Drummer! I am really looking forward to the finished band because I think you can never have enough mounted bands! So how about a camel mounted band from the wilds of India?{sm4}

Dave

 

[johnnybach]

Is this the one you mean Dave?

I have had a look at photos like these before - and given them a passing thought. I do know a man who has a suitable camel, and he might be persuaded to come up with a seated figure, something like that - but there are 36 of 'em here!!! It would need a huge amount of work to model and paint all of that - and 36 times! Don't know that I would be good enough - or have the perseverance to do that one.

Does look a stunning sight though - doesn't it? Maybe I'll have a go at one or two of them - one day - but that's a big maybe.

Glad you approve of my Egyptian Cavalry Kettledrummer - so far. I think they might turn out okay - and encouraged to go on with them for now. It's always the same with a mounted TS band - the more you do - the better they seem to look. Cheers for now - jb

 

[DMNamiot]

Holy COW!!!! Thats Brilliant! I can only wish someone would make a band like this for the 1903 Durbar. Now 36 pieces would be extreme so I would say that 12 is far more realistic, would you?{sm4}

Thanks for sharing that one and as to you skill you should not sell your self short you are very skilled at making and painting these bands and other wonderful items you have shared with us over the past few months

Dave

 

[johnnybach]

Here's another close-up shot of the Sousaphone player Dave. They are the Indian Border Security Force Band. VERY spectacular - and would be great to have a go at. I have thought about doing just that one figure before - but always had second thoughts - because of the amount of time it would take to model first - and then paint (which shouldn't take that long).

If one of the manufacturers would do them as castings - well - that's a different prospect. Problem is - how many would they sell? You can imagine what a painted version of the full band would cost you - and that's why the big-boys don't make 'em any more!

And no - 12 wouldn't be enough for me. IF I was to do a band - it would be the full 7 ranks of five figures - plus the leader out front which is 36.

Nice of you to think I'm an okay dabbler! Cheers - jb

 

[blaster]

Hello Johnnybach,

nice to see you having fun with yr Egyptian band and yes, it does look very promising.

You've got to do the Border Security Force Band. You just have to. I know you...


Rgds Victor

 

[johnnybach]

The idea of trying to make up the Camel mounted Sousaphone player has been festering in the background with me for around 18 months-or-so. I could begin with a lookalike Britains Camel - but would then need to source the rider (this one - below) - and then use a ton or-so of milliput and probably fine wire to get those strands.

I think what I'm saying is - Never say Never. After one is done - they usually get quicker - but that lot would be a VERY long term project indeed. I'v e done a count of the instruments - which looks like this.

2 Sousaphones, - 8 Euphoniums, - 5 Saxaphones, 10 Trumpets, - 8 Clarinets, - 2 Bass Drums. These - and the arms are also easy to source - but would probably need some alteration to make them fit to a body of a rider.

The two major problems are therefore, the sheer amount of modelling time to decorate the Camel - and possibly the seated figure's uniform.

NB: Glad you're enjoying the Egyptian band - jb

I'll think about just the one Sousaphone player - and have a word with Giles at Dorset in november. So that's a maybe - for one figure. jb

 

[johnnybach]

But back to the day-job! Bert the Bombardon Busker - is now fit to join Danny the drummer. They are set in front of a few of the other horses - which are at different stages of development. You may note how some of the tack (leatherwork) on the horses is being added - made from thin strips of milliput. This is so that they compare better with the picture I began with - where the "Y" piece shows clearly on the chest of each horse. As my castings didn't have this piece of equipment - I am adding it to each horse.

Must remember to clean the lens next time - La Commandante borrowed the camera - and doubtless left a print on it!!!:redface2:

(Well.....it's her camera, actually!:)

Working on the Trombonist and Tuba players next.

 

[Tinsoldier]

I like your interest in what you do.

Just finished a figure that will be the Egiptian musician. I will utilize (eye right) instruments. 24 to 36 minimum.

Working on the horse.

I am looking at a figure of Napoleon on a camel that I have. Thge camel may be the start of the mounted Security Border Police band.
It did have the necessary trapping on it, but some milliput is nercessary.


Of note: there were only threes military mounted bands in Canada.

The RCMP had one in 1870-83 era. Same musicians in either pill box or home service. Did not last.
Next was the Canadian Mounted Rifles based in Brandon, Manatoba with a Pipe Band.
The last was the GGHG band in Toronto. Disbanded because of the musicians union. Long story, but only three years.