No clue/respect for our nations past........ (1 Viewer)

Hi Guys,

This is an interesting topic. I for one have seen kids doing just what was described by George in the first post and on thru the thread and yes it usually angers me. But on the note of parents controlling their kids aside from my 3 year old my kids know what the deal is and its because whenever we go to a site like Normandy or The Little Big Horn I always prep the kids with a lot of details on what happened there either through movies or documentaries so they have an understanding of the significance of the site in question. When we recently went to Bastogne I took the time to explain the battle and the role of various units in the defense of the area. Then I took them out to the sites to show them what the terrain looked like and what it was like for the soldiers who fought in those woods. My son (9) was really struck by the darkness in the woods which was something and by the damp and cold which was also in effect due to a very cold and windy rain front in the area. So if you can package it right the history becomes interesting to the kids. By the way we are going back in early December for the big re-enactment and I hope to find some snow on the ground so my son can get a little more of an understanding of what the conditions were like.

So Sandor do take the time when you have kids to teach them about history and remember that it needs to be made interesting to them or its just a bunch of dates and names that they could care less about because no one in the schools is willing to take the time to make it interesting.

But as Rob said there is no understanding the lack of respect many people have these days the jerk who decided it was better to make a statement about not being forced to do the right thing has no idea what it means to be respectful of the sacrifices made by his ancestors for him to be able to walk around and act the way he does. He might sing a different tune if he knew anyone who was in the war. Also I cant comment on what I would have done to the little git in the cemetary because it would get me infracted...{sm2}

Dave
 
We let my son bring his bike and took my daughter to "Land O' Little Horses" back in 04 after we visited the Penn. monuments associated with their ancestor on mom's side. I had shown the kids Gettysburg and we sent out to the 20th Maine monument.

My Pictures0010.jpgMy Pictures0014.jpgMy Pictures0032.jpg
 
Places like these are our sacred grounds. Beyond religion and politics, they are holy to our country. If you want to let your kids run loose and climb over stuff, there's always state and amusement parks nearby.
 
Places like these are our sacred grounds. Beyond religion and politics, they are holy to our country. If you want to let your kids run loose and climb over stuff, there's always state and amusement parks nearby.

Couldn't agree more with this; these national parks are to me sacred places, a place to reflect and pay tribute to the thousands of men who died there, to walk on that ground they walked, fought and died on chokes me up, not going to lie about it and to see people acting like clowns jerks a knot you know where for me.

I wouldn't act like that in a church, at a wake or funeral, or at a cemetary, same goes for a battlefield.
 
Couldn't agree more with this; these national parks are to me sacred places, a place to reflect and pay tribute to the thousands of men who died there, to walk on that ground they walked, fought and died on chokes me up, not going to lie about it and to see people acting like clowns jerks a knot you know where for me.

I wouldn't act like that in a church, at a wake or funeral, or at a cemetary, same goes for a battlefield.

How about the Boy Scouts at the 1913 reunion at Gettysburg?

boy-scouts.jpg
 
How about the Boy Scouts at the 1913 reunion at Gettysburg?

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You always have to be the contrarian don't you Scott; if it's up, to you it's down, if it's black, to you it's white, if wreaths are being put on tombstones, you question if all of those soldiers are Christians.

Like I've told you in the past, move to Cambridge, they'd welcome you with open arms there...............
 
Round up the disrespectful ruffians and ship them off to the western front trenchs ................ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, they probably did, never mind.{sm2}

Now the boyscouts can go to France and play silly games over THIER graves{sm4}:(:({sm2}
 
I think we have a bad case of "Hey you kids, get off my lawn" here. A few cases of bad behavior vs. some historical photos I've posted of folks having fun at the Gettysburg reunions and posing on the monuments 100 years ago. The Boy Scouts were there in 1913 to help the veterans get around and do first aid.

Gettysburg-Scouts-Scouts-Boy.jpg
 
You always have to be the contrarian don't you Scott; if it's up, to you it's down, if it's black, to you it's white, if wreaths are being put on tombstones, you question if all of those soldiers are Christians.

Like I've told you in the past, move to Cambridge, they'd welcome you with open arms there...............

Well I'm close enough to Cambridge to have had Harvard trained surgeons put my daughter's heart valve back together last fall.

I'll also be challenging the desecration of Union soldier's graves if that comes up again this Season. Give the $$ or your time to help live veterans.
 
I'll also be challenging the desecration of Union soldier's graves if that comes up again this Season. Give the $$ or your time to help live veterans.

Seriously Scott?

Putting a wreath on a grave is desecration according to you?

Tell you what; head down there the weekend Stan Clarke, all of those volunteers and the deceased soldiers family get together for that act and tell them you consider what they are doing desecration.

If we never hear from you again, we'll know how that turned out.

You are something else.
 
As I said guys I think many people died to allow some parents to have the right to allow their kids to climb on statues.
I fail to see why we are all getting so hot under the collars about how things are going to the dogs etc etc.
We do not want to live in some dreary stuffy totalitarian state where you are forced to behave in a certain way. Certainly the men who paid teh ultimate sacirifce did not want to either.
Democracy is about consensus not about forcing people to behave in certain ways.
Our hobby will come across as stuffy, dour and boring one if we all go around being Mother Grundies and fun police.
I also have pictures of me climbing on a few canon when I was 7 years old. Not because I wanted to disrespect sacrifice but because I thought teh canon were cool and I wanted one day to be involved with the military in some way. We all feel that there is some plot not to teach history at school. That is history as we understand it so in 1879 a British army was defeated at Islandwana blah blah blah. However other parts of history are equally valid and important like small pox was eradicated or how people left teh rural areas to move to various cities etc. Social history is important. Some people are also eft out of traditional history books. It is only recently that Islandwana has been talked about as a great Zulu Victory rather than a British disaster. After all the Zulus were fighting for their own country and way of life.
I am gald the west is democractic I would hate to have to remember the great leaders birthday and carry his little red book/green book in my pocket all the time in case the thought police decided I did not look right.
 
They are putting Christmas trappings (borrowed from ancient pagan trappings) on the graves of men who's religion may or may not agreed with this custom. If the graves are men of the 11th Corps, many of whom were German free thinkers, that would be wrong. Flags for patriotism or flowers for life are far more appropriate. I wouldn't put US flags on Confederate graves and I wouldn't put one brand of Christian decoration on graves of men who's religion I don't know just because it's pretty.

I have seen photos of this new custom done at Arlington National Cemetery where non Christian graves are left undecorated. That kind of breaks up the idea of Americans united that US Flags and flowers on all graves would accentuate.
 
They are putting Christmas trappings (borrowed from ancient pagan trappings) on the graves of men who's religion may or may not agreed with this custom. If the graves are men of the 11th Corps, many of whom were German free thinkers, that would be wrong. Flags for patriotism or flowers for life are far more appropriate. I wouldn't put US flags on Confederate graves and I wouldn't put one brand of Christian decoration on graves of men who's religion I don't know just because it's pretty.

I have seen photos of this new custom done at Arlington National Cemetery where non Christian graves are left undecorated. That kind of breaks up the idea of Americans united that US Flags and flowers on all graves would accentuate.

They are not Christmas wreaths, they are holiday wreaths; big difference.

Like I said Scott, since it bothers you so much, go down there this year and let those folks know how you feel.

Please do so.

I'm begging you to.
 
I have tried to show though photos of my own family that we care that these places are sacred and special even to our own family and try to tell our kids why. They are parks and they are open to the public so society takes the risk that a carload of cranky kids shows up once in a while.
 
As I said guys I think many people died to allow some parents to have the right to allow their kids to climb on statues.

No, those soldiers did not die so parents could treat unit markers and memorials like amusement park rides for their kids.

It comes down to common sense and respect, two things people seem to lack today as our society is based on me, myself and I for many people, hooray for me and @#$% everyone else....................
 
"Holiday wreaths?" Are you sure that these dead Union soldiers were Winter Solstice worshipers? Druids? Followers of Mithra? I'm betting that some of these 19th century men had a number of conservative Christian beliefs and would have resented such "Holiday" decorations and the presumption by even well meaning folks to include them in their own beliefs.

If you can't debate without personal insults and implied threats about what someone else would do to me then don't post your outrage and not expect to challenged on it. You know from my recent posts with photos, on the subject of battlefields and monuments that I make a point of taking my family, who are descended from a Civil War soldier, to see them. We just got back from the USMC Museum in Quantico and the sunset parade at the Iwo Jima memorial back in August. I just didn't see wide spread disrespect at these places.
 
Excellent post Dave, you are educating your kids in a way that encourages respect and tribute.Whilst I can see where Damian is coming from on this, I think as
George says part of the problem these days ( in society in general not just War remembrance) is the modern attitude of ' I can so I will and to hell with everyone else '

Rob



Hi Guys,

This is an interesting topic. I for one have seen kids doing just what was described by George in the first post and on thru the thread and yes it usually angers me. But on the note of parents controlling their kids aside from my 3 year old my kids know what the deal is and its because whenever we go to a site like Normandy or The Little Big Horn I always prep the kids with a lot of details on what happened there either through movies or documentaries so they have an understanding of the significance of the site in question. When we recently went to Bastogne I took the time to explain the battle and the role of various units in the defense of the area. Then I took them out to the sites to show them what the terrain looked like and what it was like for the soldiers who fought in those woods. My son (9) was really struck by the darkness in the woods which was something and by the damp and cold which was also in effect due to a very cold and windy rain front in the area. So if you can package it right the history becomes interesting to the kids. By the way we are going back in early December for the big re-enactment and I hope to find some snow on the ground so my son can get a little more of an understanding of what the conditions were like.

So Sandor do take the time when you have kids to teach them about history and remember that it needs to be made interesting to them or its just a bunch of dates and names that they could care less about because no one in the schools is willing to take the time to make it interesting.

But as Rob said there is no understanding the lack of respect many people have these days the jerk who decided it was better to make a statement about not being forced to do the right thing has no idea what it means to be respectful of the sacrifices made by his ancestors for him to be able to walk around and act the way he does. He might sing a different tune if he knew anyone who was in the war. Also I cant comment on what I would have done to the little git in the cemetary because it would get me infracted...{sm2}

Dave
 
No, those soldiers did not die so parents could treat unit markers and memorials like amusement park rides for their kids.

It comes down to common sense and respect, two things people seem to lack today as our society is based on me, myself and I for many people, hooray for me and @#$% everyone else....................


Have to disagree with your sentiments there big guy.
Thye fought for us to have normal boring lives, free from threat and co-ercion. So we can pursue all those good things in life.
Wandering around a park like facility on a weekend eating ice cream and enjoying one self without fear of physical violence is part of a normal borning life.
I just don't see widepsread disrespect in all this. Just folk being folk. Maybe a little bit over the top at times but that is ok.
 

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