"Refugees on the Road" (1 Viewer)

[Louis Badolato]

Funny you mention this because I actually have.

Since this thread opened I read a nice Maisie Dobbs mystery from cover to cover and then started the newest James Holland Sgt Jack Tanner book, Blood of Honour.

 

[Mister Dave]

20 or so pages shy of finishing this one......

 

[Warrior]

Funny you mention this because I actually have.

And a nice one by you too Dave, War and Peace by chance?

Actually, your reading choice is an outstanding one...........

 

[Mister Dave]

And a nice one by you too Dave, War and Peace by chance?

Actually, your reading choice is an outstanding one...........

Thanks George, and yes this one has been a real page turner for me.

Maybe I will look at War and Peace next.

MD

 

[Warrior]

Thanks George, and yes this one has been a real page turner for me.

Maybe I will look at War and Peace next.

MD

Dave,
I recently finished Seen the Glory, a novel of The Battle of Gettysburg by John Hough Jr, tells the story of the 20th Massachusetts during the battle; spectacular, could not put it down once I started it ..........

 

[kingtoot]

Just thought i would put these up again to refresh EVERYONES memory what you are all "DISCUSSING"........

WOW!!These are really great looking figures!! Somebody tell me more about them!!when will they be available?

 

[Scott]

Seen the Glory, That was pretty good. I got it for my wife because she used to be a Park Ranger at Gettysburg and knew one of the author's advisers. I read it and was surprised that the Confederates were actually portrayed as the "bad guys."

 

[Vezzolf]

Re: “Good Taste… Bad Taste… and No Taste!”

Hi Guys,

I’ve been following the debate on the photos of our “Refugees on the Road” that I posted recently… Here’s my take on it…

Good taste is like great beauty—it’s very much in the eye or eyes of the beholder. As the old adage says “One man’s meat is another man’s poison”.

Let’s get one thing straight… from the time warfare began refugees, of one kind or another, have been a sad fact of life (and death).

What the 19th. and particularly the 20.th Centuries brought us was photography (both still and moving) where we could actually see photographs and newsreel of ordinary civilians displaced by the tide of war.

Any pictorial record of the Fall of France in 1940 or the Invasion of Russia in 1941 or the Defeat of Germany in 1945 rarely fails to include images of civilians on the road or standing by the ruins of their homes during these tumultuous events. They are as much a part of a wartime scene as a Sherman Tank or a column of German infantry foot sloggers… So, what’s with the “slightly disturbing”… “Looks like a load of Jews”… “They look too clean to be refugees”… etc… etc.

As for “doing without photographers taking photos of them”… well, would it be acceptable if it was K&C’s GI photo journalist or even a civilian photographer perhaps? Is it just because we used a couple of Germans?

As K&C (and many collectors) move even deeper into creating scenes, dioramas or dramatic displays I feel it’s important to add extra elements like accessories… buildings… destroyed vehicles and, yes, even civilians where they are appropriate. I am happy to see that most of the respondents on this particular thread seem to agree with me.

No matter what K&C does there’s always going to be a few people who don’t like it or choose to suggest sinister ulterior motives…

Oh well… c’est la vie… c’est la guerre.

Best wishes and happy collecting!
Andy C.

P.S. Talking of guns being held to heads… If you don’t like it… don’t buy it!

Completely agree Andy,....The refugees are a very "interesting take" on the realities of war.......And IMO are not done in bad taste....Well done Vezzolf......PS: where is the Old Man and Old Woman figures....does not appear in the Fields of Battle section on Treefrog

 

[Vezzolf]

Sorry folks, I know that I am relatively new here and maybe not 'experienced' enough in this forum to let spray, but...

Geezus guys! Cut the hypocrisy! Some of us will quite happily create our little fantasy scenes of violence, brutality and senseless death & destruction with our figures then say a column of civilians being photographed is tasteless.

It seems to me like the armchair generals want to pretend that it's all a heroic between equally armed and skilled opponents on a level playing field... and where everybody gets up and goes home afterwards. WAR is tasteless and all of us would/could be accused of being tasteless in our glorification of it.

And don't give me that BS about honoring those that served etc. As an ex Special Forces soldier, I'd rather see the memory of the few mates that I have lost (or are struggling with PTSD issues) honored by somebody donating the cash that they would otherwise spend on K&C to a charity organisation like Legacy (which looks after the wives & kids of deceased servicemen here in Oz) than buying model soldiers.

The civilians that K&C have released, plus the scene set up in the photo are a fact of life ... things like that happened. You can choose to include them in your set up or not ... but don't try and tell me that setting up a diorama where one 'human' is killing or preparing to kill another 'human' is a depiction of anything less reprehensible or disgusting.

Good work, Andy, carry on

Absolutley TRUE.....well said I applaud you

 

[Scott]

Sorry folks, I know that I am relatively new here and maybe not 'experienced' enough in this forum to let spray, but...

Geezus guys! Cut the hypocrisy! Some of us will quite happily create our little fantasy scenes of violence, brutality and senseless death & destruction with our figures then say a column of civilians being photographed is tasteless.

It seems to me like the armchair generals want to pretend that it's all a heroic between equally armed and skilled opponents on a level playing field... and where everybody gets up and goes home afterwards. WAR is tasteless and all of us would/could be accused of being tasteless in our glorification of it.

And don't give me that BS about honoring those that served etc. As an ex Special Forces soldier, I'd rather see the memory of the few mates that I have lost (or are struggling with PTSD issues) honored by somebody donating the cash that they would otherwise spend on K&C to a charity organisation like Legacy (which looks after the wives & kids of deceased servicemen here in Oz) than buying model soldiers.

The civilians that K&C have released, plus the scene set up in the photo are a fact of life ... things like that happened. You can choose to include them in your set up or not ... but don't try and tell me that setting up a diorama where one 'human' is killing or preparing to kill another 'human' is a depiction of anything less reprehensible or disgusting.

Good work, Andy, carry on

There's that.

 

[Peter Reuss]

Re: “Good Taste… Bad Taste… and No Taste!”

Completely agree Andy,....The refugees are a very "interesting take" on the realities of war.......And IMO are not done in bad taste....Well done Vezzolf......PS: where is the Old Man and Old Woman figures....does not appear in the Fields of Battle section on Treefrog

They were on the site, but apparetnly we didn't get them in the proper category! They show up now.

 

[Vezzolf]

Re: “Good Taste… Bad Taste… and No Taste!”

They were on the site, but apparetnly we didn't get them in the proper category! They show up now.

Thanks Peter

 

[Warrior]

I read it and was surprised that the Confederates were actually portrayed as the "bad guys."

The book portraits life in The Army of the Potomac, specifically the brothers Luke and Thomas Chandler, who served together in the 20th Massachusetts, who fought against the Confederates; to them, they WERE the bad guys, not sure why that is a surprise to you................

 

[Scott]

Right. I was thinking of the even handed portrayals in something like Killer Angels. I really hated the Confederate that shoots a main character. (Spoiler!)

 

[Warrior]

I really hated the Confederate that shoots a main character. (Spoiler!)

Yeah, I'm sure you shed a tear over that one............

 

[Scott]

Yeah, I'm sure you shed a tear over that one............

 

[octavedoctor]

I just saw the trailer for a forthcoming documentary, called 'An Unfinished Film'. There were some stills of German cameramen which reminded me of these new figures.

 

[Iron Brigade]

Hi Guys,

We’ve had a few requests to show groups of our new “Civilians” together…
So, here goes…what’d you think?

Best wishes and Happy Collecting!
Andy C.

Dear Andy:

Again, a splendid job done with these #5 new sets of "Refugees" of circa WW Two Europe. I agree that these sets could be very appropriate for some collector's displays or dioramas of WW2. I certainly do not believe you meant to belittle refugees or refer to the Jews being marched off to their likely deaths. For one thing I believe that the SS units, etc only allowed the jews to take only what they could carry with them on thier persons which would rule out your set showing the cart full of assorted items.

I guess it goes back to the old question of "harmless" marching toy like miniatures Vs much more realistic figures in battle. Those who do not want to get too "realistic" certainly do not have to do it! I for one am hoping for more updated versions of US Army First Infantry Division in action including casualty figures to add to my D-Day on Omaha Beach diorama I started in last part of 2009. It would be silly to show just marching troops with a band on the beaches of Omaha on June 6, 1944!

I considered using some or even all of the new "Refugees" sets as part of my "1914 ... The March On Paris" diorama of the German Army at the start of World War One in August 1914. So far I have not to ordered any of these sets as yet, but I may do so at a later time. Yes Andy, poor displaced refugees have been part of many wars especially in WW2. Keep up the splendid work you are doing!

Best regards, Gary "Iron Brigade" in Wisconsin, USA

 

[forlornhoper]

going to pickup my refugees and ss photographers on friday , these should put the finishing touches to my french diorama,its been a long time in the creation but all good things come to those who wait.Never knew how to complete it ,but thanks to Andy and his great creations the job is done or to quote a really famous historical figure " It is finished " . Ken

 

[Vezzolf]

Just picked up some of the K/C Fields of Battle fleeing refugees....Very well done Andy and very sobering....Man's inhumanity to man....Really tells some of the story of the oppression and suffering of the victims of Nazism....