Seeking collectors opinions (1 Viewer)

[Currahee Chris]

Hey guys-

Being a member on this board for sometime I am curious as to why everyone believes modern toy soldiers are not popular- modern being post 9-11, not Arab Israeli conflict, Falklands, etc. I have found this very puzzling as a collector. Feel free to post your opinions freely- I certainly do not believe anyone on here isn't supportive of our troopers so feel free to be candid.

Some of the reasons I have heard in the past are "it's too recent". Ok, though I look at Call of Duty Modern Warfare and sales of that video game are through the roof. The 1:18th scale collectors seem more interested in modern conflict than the 1;32 crowd.

Another thing I hear is that there is disagreement in the politics behind the decision for the current efforts. Again, I find that puzzling as I have a hard time wrapping my head around the fact that WW2 Nazi figures seem to be extremely popular yet their regime was far more appaling than anything the US has produced.

Again, just curious to see what everyone thinks.

 

[Rob]

Hi Chis,

Can only speak for myself but it's pretty straight forward as I see it. For me WW1 and WW2 were such huge, History changing conflicts that the future of the civilised world depended on and were fought in many countries in many different theatres. I mean absolutely no disrespect to any vet of the Falklands or Iraq but these conflicts just don't get me the same way. There are also myriad troops,vehicles,aircraft, ships from both sides and many famous battles/campaigns, the subject is enormous. As for the Nazi element you mention , a more repulsive regime its hard to think of, but they had very talented Generals and brave soldiers, my admiration and I know that of my fellow countrymen stops there.

I hope collectors of modern conflicts get more releases in the future,I see no reason why they wouldn't sell, variety is the spice and all that.

Cheers

Rob

 

[theBaron]

Not sure, Chris. I've been thinking about it.

As you point out, folks in other hobbies--your example, gamers, or in scale modeling--find more modern subjects as interesting as the "classic" toy soldier subjects. There are a lot of scale modelers who are veterans, and who model what they worked on, like armor or aerial subjects (and paratroopers, who focus on airborne )

I was thinking that perhaps it has to do with areas that we were interested in, when we were kids. That's a general rule, in the broader collectibles hobby, that people collect what they played with or otherwise knew, when they were kids. For a lot of the guys here, they were either kids during WWII, or their dads and uncles were. A lot of them were kids during Viet Nam, but there is still so much controversy over the war, that it impacts that collectibles rule. If nothing else, the same thing that elder toy soldier experts like Garratt said about WWI and WWII, is true about Korea, and Nam and the Middle Eastern wars, and that's, that a Napoleonic hussar is more interesting to look at, than a doughboy in khaki or a grunt in the new BDU. That's not intended as a knock on contemporary soldiers, by the way, just an observation, that I think still is valid.

For me, one aspect of collecting toy soldiers is the toy aspect. As I've said, I like well-detailed figures, but I like them to be in gloss finish, to look like toys. For more modern subjects, I prefer scale models, even to the better detailed toy soldiers from K&C or First Legion, say, because scale models aspire to be exact replicas, historically accurate, a personal museum in miniature. So, I'd rather build a model of an M-60 in Vietnam markings, or an A-10 from Desert Storm, but I'll buy Frontline figures from the Seven Years War. I make that distinction, for myself.

As always, you come up with great topics!

Prost!
Brad

 

[thebritfarmer]

I think with older wars there is more variety in uniforms etc.... in this day and age all the regiments are being amalgated so the uniforms are becoming more of the same. I know when I was a kid all the squaddies looked the same to me, green jumpers and trousers, black berets (for the most part). It was only the cap badges that gave them away.

I like the variety of the older regiments and also the ceremonial uniforms.

 

[Mitch]

For me, looking only at what would be released as sets the modern stuff is just so very boring. I look at a challenger II or an Abrams and they just do nothing to inspire or interest my desire to know anything about them and, that applies to most of the other AFV's and, aircraft and ships today. I recently bought the owners guide to the Tiger I and found it very interesting to read. I find reading about modern stuff very hard work and heavy going when I do partake. Staying away from the political bits in your post which, don't apply to me I am very interested in modern conflicts, whats happening and the like Falklands etc but, you could not tempt me to buy any modern stuff.


I know its your interest but, its just all so bland and has no asthetic appeal
Mitch

 

[Go for Broke]

I think modern wars aren't popular, because we don't have a World power opponent with equally powerful tanks, AFVs, etc. (Thank goodness). Our enemies blend with the civilian population. Hard to make a cool dio with terrorists dressed in everyday clothes. They have no AFVs. I would love to collect modern soldiers, but if they made them now, I don't think I could afford them. I know Figarti made the Iraq or Afghan conflict, but again, the enemy just didn't have any cool uniforms for me to buy them.

 

[lancer]

Very interesting question, Chris. In my case, the interest was cemented in childhood. It is, as Brad said, what I grew up with. Father and uncles in WW2 and WW1 being recent, that is where my interest started. Spread to ACW during the centennial. Everything from Korea on, while interesting to me on a military history level, just doesn't hold any collecting interest for me at all. For instance, I couldn't care less about jet aircraft. If it doesn't have a propeller, it's crap. No interest in choppers, either. I know about that stuff, just don't collect it. Now, armor is a little different for me. I have some examples of the modern armor done by FOV, but that's it. I think it possible that modern warfare will gain in interest as time goes on as new collectors come into the hobby, for the same reasons my interests lie in pre-Korea conflicts. Today's children, exposed to the current conflicts from so many sources as they grow up, will have an interest in thse conflicts as opposed to what we 'old guard' find interesting. -- Al

 

[thebritfarmer]

I would like to add that IMO the modern wars (WWII and up) don't give you that "romantic" feel. I know war is not romantic but I can't find the word I am looking for or even if there is one.

 

[Louis Badolato]

Don't ask me. I collect every modern war toy soldier, vehicle and aircraft I can get my hands on. I've even had the honor of presenting some modern war collectibles to veterans who had returned from tours in Iraq or Afghanistan.

 

[Partner]

I would like to add that IMO the modern wars (WWII and up) don't give you that "romantic" feel. I know war is not romantic but I can't find the word I am looking for or even if there is one.

I have pondered this for a while . I don't collect modern figures and my interest in history is Victorian Era and up to WW 1. The word that I came up with was that the modern era was not "romantic " . I also wasn't sure it was the correct word but seeing your post I have to agree . War is not romantic but the uniforms , etc are

Regards.
Kirk

 

[wayne556517]

Chris mate im glad they don't because i couldn't help myself to buy some,those FIGARTI releases where hard to say no to,especially those ABRAMS Howard grabbed,for me not lack of interest lack of funds.

 

[jazzeum]

I think with older wars there is more variety in uniforms etc.... in this day and age all the regiments are being amalgated so the uniforms are becoming more of the same. I know when I was a kid all the squaddies looked the same to me, green jumpers and trousers, black berets (for the most part). It was only the cap badges that gave them away.

I like the variety of the older regiments and also the ceremonial uniforms.

I agree with Scott. Look at the British uniforms from yesteryear, very appealing plus it's history that we read about and are comfortable with from a distance. Not so with modern wars where the issues are with us every day. In addition, the weapons from yesteryear have an appeal of man fighting man and in control of the machine and his destiny. Today's weapons don't have that. I remember a line from the Patton movie (so don't know if he actually said it) where Patton belittles the possibility of modern warfare and says something like "where's the glory, the heroism." That's the problem with modern weapons and wars.

 

[Currahee Chris]

Gentlemen-

thank you for taking your time to provide me with your responses and input. I do sincerely appreciate it. Lots of additional information collectively provided which I have oft wondered on myself- particularly the utilitarian nature of modern unis vs Napolenic era. Some of you mentioned the term "romantic", trust me, I believe I know exactly where you are coming from with that.

I also agree with the generational attachement- both my grandfathers were combat vets- one pulled the hat trick- ww2, korea and nam and the other pulled six rotations in Nam. As a former trooper myself I have a very strong attachement to the weapons and gear of today... sitting inches beneath that 125mm Rheinmetall main gun on the abrams while rocking at 40 mph across the open road is comparable to very very few experiences in life.

Or sprinting across an open field, diving into a crashhawk, strapping in and feeling nothing but the wind smack you in the face as you roll to the next insertion point.............

or holding on for dear life as you bounce around inside that 113 as your teeth grind or mash to fine dust- if you've rode in em, you know where I'm coming from {sm4}

or watching the absolute devastation an A10 Warthog can unleash.

Trust me fellas, it is a once in a lifetime experience!!

Thank God for the American Military Industrial Complex!! {sm4}{sm4}

 

[Currahee Chris]

I remember a line from the Patton movie (so don't know if he actually said it) where Patton belittles the possibility of modern warfare and says something like "where's the glory, the heroism." That's the problem with modern weapons and wars.

Ouch!! {sm3} i think there are quite a few people wearing Silver Stars and a few MoHs that have put to rest Patton's "heroism" comment- I do know the one you are talking about.

Also counselor, interesting to find that you quote Patton to defend your argument here on this topic yet seem rather quick to throw him under the tracks per se when it comes to his legacy. {sm4}{sm3}

Very best regards
C

 

[jazzeum]

Ouch!! {sm3} i think there are quite a few people wearing Silver Stars and a few MoHs that have put to rest Patton's "heroism" comment- I do know the one you are talking about.

Also counselor, interesting to find that you quote Patton to defend your argument here on this topic yet seem rather quick to throw him under the tracks per se when it comes to his legacy. {sm4}{sm3}

Very best regards
C

Sure you don't have me confused with Louis. I don't usually get involved with those arguments. About the only thing I may have criticized him for was the raid to save his son-in-law. I can't remember anything else, not that I didn't say it; just don't remember it.

You're probably right about the heroism we see today. However, I think the rest of my points hold water.

Personally, it's not something I want to collect. Completely no interest.

 

[Currahee Chris]

Sure you don't have me confused with Louis. You're probably right about the heroism we see today. However, I think the rest of my points hold water.

Could be, I stand corrected. :tongue:

I am right about today's heroism, I buried a modern hero almost a decade ago. {sm2}{sm2} The blood of the "greatest" generation still pumps strong and true through their grandsons and great grandsons.

There isn't anything wrong with not collecting or even being interested in modern conflicts,,after all, I live 30 minutes from Gettysburg, never walked the battlefields. Only thing I know is that a lot of Americans died from both the North and South. My ignorance of that entire affair would be a mortal sin to most!! :redface2::redface2: All collectors have their own interests unique to their life experiences and academic interests.

 

[lancer]

Could be, I stand corrected. :tongue:

I am right about today's heroism, I buried a modern hero almost a decade ago. {sm2}{sm2} The blood of the "greatest" generation still pumps strong and true through their grandsons and great grandsons.

There isn't anything wrong with not collecting or even being interested in modern conflicts,,after all, I live 30 minutes from Gettysburg, never walked the battlefields. Only thing I know is that a lot of Americans died from both the North and South. My ignorance of that entire affair would be a mortal sin to most!! :redface2::redface2: All collectors have their own interests unique to their life experiences and academic interests.

30 minutes from Gettysburg and never walked the field? How can you not know the history of the great organization you live for? Oh, the agony. That will be 30 lashes with a wet noodle, at dawn. Chris, get in your Abrahms and take a drive to the battlefield of the greatest clash on American soil. You owe it to yourself.:wink2: -- Al

 

[trooper]

Lot of interesting points here. My opinion is that past wars were clean cut, nation against nation, army against army, battles fought and either won or lost. Modern warfare is not against a nation but rather groups of fighters, patrols, skirmishes, ambush and booby trap weapons. There doesn't seem to be any clear cut objective in mind, no ground to be gained, no army to defeat. There's nothing wrong with the troops, heroes one and all, just a lack of direction. Trooper

 

[Currahee Chris]

30 minutes from Gettysburg and never walked the field? How can you not know the history of the great organization you live for? Oh, the agony. That will be 30 lashes with a wet noodle, at dawn. Chris, get in your Abrahms and take a drive to the battlefield of the greatest clash on American soil. You owe it to yourself.:wink2: -- Al

I'm sure the federal park service might have some objection there my friend!! {sm4} Not to mention some federal types wondering how i procured an abrams to take on a joyride to GBurg anyway. {sm4}

It is a disgrace I agree. I have walked around them and looked at some of the areas/sights. Problem is my brother in law is a ACW buff and he just drives me bannanas. Nice guy,,,,I guess, it's just that he's one of those relatives where you hear him talk and it's like standing next to someone running their fingers down a blackboard!! {sm3} Anyway, he's always trying to talk me into going there with him. Maybe the poor battlefield is tainted with being associated with him!! {sm4}

 

[lancer]

I'm sure the federal park service might have some objection there my friend!! {sm4} Not to mention some federal types wondering how i procured an abrams to take on a joyride to GBurg anyway. {sm4}

It is a disgrace I agree. I have walked around them and looked at some of the areas/sights. Problem is my brother in law is a ACW buff and he just drives me bannanas. Nice guy,,,,I guess, it's just that he's one of those relatives where you hear him talk and it's like standing next to someone running their fingers down a blackboard!! {sm3} Anyway, he's always trying to talk me into going there with him. Maybe the poor battlefield is tainted with being associated with him!! {sm4}

Ah yes, the in-law factor. Well, don't let that stop you. Dump him out the back of the Bradley, and proceed to the Gettysburg Visitors Center where professional Park Service guides await. The tours are great. Incidently, I'm sure you can park an Abrahms or Bradley pretty much anywhere you want to. -- Al