The American Revolution by Ken Burns (3 Viewers)

Terp152 said:
Brad, I read the lengthy Hogeland disputation, from which he projects a "who really cares?" position regarding the 1754 conference (and a denigration of B Franklin). Nevertheless, there is a clear, at least to me and others, a direct connection in the opening episode between the Six Nations Confederation and the Colonial 1754 proposal to unite. Why else would Burns so deliberately include it? The Federalist Papers, crucial to the states ratification of the proposed constitution referenced the Greeks States but make no mention of the Haudenasaunee Confederacy.

BTW, I'm obtuse as to your reference to me in regards to the criticism of Burns Jazz docuseries. I did not watch that but am aware of the criticism.

Finally, are you a NR reader? Who'd thought?

And in the spirit of our colonial forefathers,
Your most obedient servant,
Chris
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The reference to “you” was not specifically you Chris but the the more general you. Nonetheless, I should have been more careful in my writing.

I’m not a NR reader but found the article you mentioned. NR is not my tempo.

I take no position on the Six Nations Conference and the supposed link to colonial unification. I don’t really know enough about it to comment.
 
What’s wrong with you people falling asleep? I am totally raved up, cleaned my musket and am now scouring the neighborhood for the British. Love it.
 
Andanna said:
What’s wrong with you people falling asleep? I am totally raved up, cleaned my musket and am now scouring the neighborhood for the British. Love it.
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The series is good, but I'm just tired at night. Even reading a good book, the book falls on my face after 3-pages.
 
Terp152 said:
On a less controversial note, which historians have piqued your interest? I've read many, if not all books by J Ellis and R Atkinson, HW Brands from Burns' B Franklin series seem promising.
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Some that piqued my interest:

Independence Lost: Lives on the Edge of the American Revolution — Kathleen Du Val

Oxford Handbook of the American Revolution — Jane Kamensky

Ideological Origins of the American Revolution — Bernard Bailyn

British are Coming — Atkinson

These will have to wait, though, until I finish what I’m reading, The Words That Made Us: America’s Constitutional Conversation, 1760-1840 by Akhil Reed Amar.
 
jazzeum said:
Some that piqued my interest:

Independence Lost: Lives on the Edge of the American Revolution — Kathleen Du Val

Oxford Handbook of the American Revolution — Jane Kamensky

Ideological Origins of the American Revolution — Bernard Bailyn

British are Coming — Atkinson

These will have to wait, though, until I finish what I’m reading, The Words That Made Us: America’s Constitutional Conversation, 1760-1840 by Akhil Reed Amar.
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Some of those I had not heard of but sound interesting.
I often read books that are primary references of books I particularly like. So I have just ordered Letters of Eliza Wilkinson, mentioned during the series, a SC low country resident during the British occupation and initially pro-British until witnessing their depredations.

Friederike Baer, a German American historian oft interviewed in the series, wrote a highly acclaimed book about the Hessian troops in the ARW. But I have no desire to read about that plundering horde. BTW, according to Burns over 25% of the Hessian troops opted to remain in America after the war. Their descendants, known as the Pennsylvania Dutch, would later become the mainstay of the 11th Corps in the ACW, renown for their predilection to run in the face of the enemy particularly at Chancellorsville and Gettysburg.

Stacy Schiff, heavily interviewed, wrote a B Franklin bio that was the basis of the miniseries that starred Michael Douglas. I thoroughly enjoyed the series although it suffered major distortions/falsehoods in the final episode.
 
Terp152 said:
Some of those I had not heard of but sound interesting.
I often read books that are primary references of books I particularly like. So I have just ordered Letters of Eliza Wilkinson, mentioned during the series, a SC low country resident during the British occupation and initially pro-British until witnessing their depredations.

Friederike Baer, a German American historian oft interviewed in the series, wrote a highly acclaimed book about the Hessian troops in the ARW. But I have no desire to read about that plundering horde. BTW, according to Burns over 25% of the Hessian troops opted to remain in America after the war. Their descendants, known as the Pennsylvania Dutch, would later become the mainstay of the 11th Corps in the ACW, renown for their predilection to run in the face of the enemy particularly at Chancellorsville and Gettysburg.

Stacy Schiff, heavily interviewed, wrote a B Franklin bio that was the basis of the miniseries that starred Michael Douglas. I thoroughly enjoyed the series although it suffered major distortions/falsehoods in the final episode.
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Schiff is a Pulitzer Prize winner for a bio of Mrs. Vladimir Naboko (most of us whom never heard of). She also wrote a bio of Samuel Adams.
 
Tried watching the first episode…no thanks!

And yes, I do find it a bit a distressing that it seems the numerous historians who are interviewed clearly have ZERO to little concept or understanding of the Roman Republican and deep Protestant influences on the American Revolution.
 
Regnar Rick said:
Tried watching the first episode…no thanks!

And yes, I do find it a bit a distressing that it seems the numerous historians who are interviewed clearly have ZERO to little concept or understanding of the Roman Republican and deep Protestant influences on the American Revolution.
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The native Americans were given too much credit for inspiring US democracy. What about Greco-Roman culture? Surely colonists would have been more influenced by the cultures they studied and looked up to than people who were regarded as savages (unfairly - indigenous culture is rich, but that's not my point). Judeo-Christian ideals would have been even more on colonists' minds. Protestantism does have an egalitarian aspect, and colonies founded by Protestants, generally, were more free than Catholic colonies in the New World.
Still, I enjoyed the series enough. Any euro-centric documentaries?
Best Wishes
Paddy
 
To answer myself (does that make me an Academic?;)) I do think Indigenous cultures played a part as practical models of democracy studied by Franklin and others. I just think Enlightenment philosophers like Locke played a larger part and weren't really mentioned. Also English Law (Magna Carta, etc.)
Well, the natives were treated so badly for so long I guess they have to have their say now. Fair enough.
The Battle of Trenton was done very well.
Happy Trails!
Paddy
 
Having read many books on the subject, I was looking fwd to this series very much but sorely disappointed. The denigration of colonial Americans in general and our Founding Fathers in particular was distracting to say the least. I had to force myself to watch the last two episodes and became more interested in what next woke diatribe was coming and less to learn from and enjoy the show. A few examples:
  • immigrants came to America for opportunities mainly in "slavery and Indian lands." How many lower class people from Europe owned slaves?
  • Geo Rogers Clark, who ended British rule in what was then the far west, criticized for using Indian tactics (not seen as such by the narrator)
  • constant slandering of G Washington over the slavery issue. One antidotal story concerning an African boy, which was not true. Had to mention his personal slave accompanying W after tendering his resignation to Congress, widely seen a truly magnanimous gesture.
  • Mary Jenison, taken captive by Seneca and later married two Indian men. Not mentioned was the murder of her parents and young siblings during her journey.
  • Mary Corbin, wounded at Ft Washington and given a half pay pension. We're told this was half given to men (evidently because Congress hated women). Actually a half pay pension was also given to men wounded in combat.
  • Jane McCrea, fiancée of a Tory officer, brutally murdered and scalped. This became a "propaganda" story used against "our people" according to the interviewed historian (Americans are obviously not "his" people). It was a true story, not propaganda.
  • Even Gen'l Clinton gets no credit for offering freedom to the slave as it was a "military purpose." Which it was but still...
  • Many newly created states in the NE banned slavery after the war, but that was only because slaves were not economically important and evidently not done in the spirit of equality or enlightenment.
The narrative was so pointed and wearisome I will not be watching this series again, unlike the Civil War and Baseball documentaries.
 
paxtoysoldier said:
To answer myself (does that make me an Academic?;)) I do think Indigenous cultures played a part as practical models of democracy studied by Franklin and others. I just think Enlightenment philosophers like Locke played a larger part and weren't really mentioned. Also English Law (Magna Carta, etc.)
Well, the natives were treated so badly for so long I guess they have to have their say now. Fair enough.
The Battle of Trenton was done very well.
Happy Trails!
Paddy
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Happy Holidays to you and your Dad Paddy, thanks for chiming in on this.

And yes, Trenton was execellently done.
 
Terp152 said:
Having read many books on the subject, I was looking fwd to this series very much but sorely disappointed. The denigration of colonial Americans in general and our Founding Fathers in particular was distracting to say the least. I had to force myself to watch the last two episodes and became more interested in what next woke diatribe was coming and less to learn from and enjoy the show. A few examples:
  • immigrants came to America for opportunities mainly in "slavery and Indian lands." How many lower class people from Europe owned slaves?
  • Geo Rogers Clark, who ended British rule in what was then the far west, criticized for using Indian tactics (not seen as such by the narrator)
  • constant slandering of G Washington over the slavery issue. One antidotal story concerning an African boy, which was not true. Had to mention his personal slave accompanying W after tendering his resignation to Congress, widely seen a truly magnanimous gesture.
  • Mary Jenison, taken captive by Seneca and later married two Indian men. Not mentioned was the murder of her parents and young siblings during her journey.
  • Mary Corbin, wounded at Ft Washington and given a half pay pension. We're told this was half given to men (evidently because Congress hated women). Actually a half pay pension was also given to men wounded in combat.
  • Jane McCrea, fiancée of a Tory officer, brutally murdered and scalped. This became a "propaganda" story used against "our people" according to the interviewed historian (Americans are obviously not "his" people). It was a true story, not propaganda.
  • Even Gen'l Clinton gets no credit for offering freedom to the slave as it was a "military purpose." Which it was but still...
  • Many newly created states in the NE banned slavery after the war, but that was only because slaves were not economically important and evidently not done in the spirit of equality or enlightenment.
The narrative was so pointed and wearisome I will not be watching this series again, unlike the Civil War and Baseball documentaries.
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Always great to get the point of view from someone with vast knowledge about the AWI, thanks Chris.
 
Terp152 said:
Having read many books on the subject, I was looking fwd to this series very much but sorely disappointed. The denigration of colonial Americans in general and our Founding Fathers in particular was distracting to say the least. I had to force myself to watch the last two episodes and became more interested in what next woke diatribe was coming and less to learn from and enjoy the show. A few examples:
  • immigrants came to America for opportunities mainly in "slavery and Indian lands." How many lower class people from Europe owned slaves?
  • Geo Rogers Clark, who ended British rule in what was then the far west, criticized for using Indian tactics (not seen as such by the narrator)
  • constant slandering of G Washington over the slavery issue. One antidotal story concerning an African boy, which was not true. Had to mention his personal slave accompanying W after tendering his resignation to Congress, widely seen a truly magnanimous gesture.
  • Mary Jenison, taken captive by Seneca and later married two Indian men. Not mentioned was the murder of her parents and young siblings during her journey.
  • Mary Corbin, wounded at Ft Washington and given a half pay pension. We're told this was half given to men (evidently because Congress hated women). Actually a half pay pension was also given to men wounded in combat.
  • Jane McCrea, fiancée of a Tory officer, brutally murdered and scalped. This became a "propaganda" story used against "our people" according to the interviewed historian (Americans are obviously not "his" people). It was a true story, not propaganda.
  • Even Gen'l Clinton gets no credit for offering freedom to the slave as it was a "military purpose." Which it was but still...
  • Many newly created states in the NE banned slavery after the war, but that was only because slaves were not economically important and evidently not done in the spirit of equality or enlightenment.
The narrative was so pointed and wearisome I will not be watching this series again, unlike the Civil War and Baseball documentaries.
Click to expand...
It's a pity these shameless adulters of history can't actually hear how twisted their corrupting of a nations history is, as they make it fit an idealogical path they have been led down, by not those seeking knowledge, but by those with their own agenda of maliciousness caused by jealousy.
 
Dammit, Burns, General Riedesel's name is not "ree-DAYZEL", it's "reed-ayzel", even stress on both syllables!!! No one ever gets that right.
 
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