The finest WWII figures I have ever seen... (1 Viewer)

[Warrior]

Many customers have asked me what scale these figures are and will they go with K & C, HB, CS, etc, etc.

My response is pretty simple; "If you are collecting these figures to do a stand alone Stalingrad diorama, you will be very, very, very happy, if you are buying these to mix and match with any other manufacturer's product, you will be unhappy."

End of story.

The whole mixing and matching thing gets confusing too; the sculpting and more importantly, the painting style from one manufacturer to another varies, so mixing and matching within the same scale even gets difficult...........................

 

[Spitfrnd]

I don't know anything about scale, and who is right or wrong in calculating it, but these figures are about the same size as the figures that come with 21st Century, which are advertised as 1:32 scale. They are definitely considerably smaller in height, and in size of appendages, than any of the figures advertised as 1:30 scale today.

Interestingly, the math of scale is very simple; accuracy in advertising is something else again. Brad and George are quite right however.

 

[fmethorst]

Thank you all for the kind words of encouragement. This range of figures is going to make taking pictures a lot of fun.

As for scale, these figures are much more at home amongst 54mm connoisseur figures than the 60mm mainstream toy soldier figures.

Personally I take all scales with a grain of salt. The two important things for me are proportion and consistency from figure to figure. From a proportion perspective I think FL has nailed it, legs and hands and heads all "look" to be the correct size in relation to the body as a whole. In addition the weapons "look" like they are the right size in relation to the bodies. Correctly scaled weapons is certainly refreshing. On that note, I pulled out my handy caliper and took it to the Kar98s I had easy access to. They consistently came in around the 37.5mm range. The real Kar98 is 1110mm in length so 1110/37.5 = 29.6 (or rounded to 1/30).

The bottom line is they aren't compatible at all with the mainstream figures in your collection. They would be more compatible with any connoisseur WWII figures you have (i.e. Aeroart, Lead Army). If you invest in these plan to use them in their own display.

 

[Phantom Warrior]

Thank you all for the kind words of encouragement. This range of figures is going to make taking pictures a lot of fun.

As for scale, these figures are much more at home amongst 54mm connoisseur figures than the 60mm mainstream toy soldier figures.

Personally I take all scales with a grain of salt. The two important things for me are proportion and consistency from figure to figure. From a proportion perspective I think FL has nailed it, legs and hands and heads all "look" to be the correct size in relation to the body as a whole. In addition the weapons "look" like they are the right size in relation to the bodies. Correctly scaled weapons is certainly refreshing. On that note, I pulled out my handy caliper and took it to the Kar98s I had easy access to. They consistently came in around the 37.5mm range. The real Kar98 is 1110mm in length so 1110/37.5 = 29.6 (or rounded to 1/30).

The bottom line is they aren't compatible at all with the mainstream figures in your collection. They would be more compatible with any connoisseur WWII figures you have (i.e. Aeroart, Lead Army). If you invest in these plan to use them in their own display. That said who really cares if they are 1/28, 1/30, 1/32.

Again, good photos that clearly compare size and painting and level of detail.

Terry

 

[Wraith]

Again, good photos that clearly compare size and painting and level of detail.

Terry

And what's more impressive, is the amount of detail, and painting standard on a comparably much smaller figure.
Great photos Frank, very helpful.

 

[lenswerks]

I like the figures and the tank but what scale.I only post and read on K&C thread but have had interest in Russian soliders so why the big deal.Ask a question would like a answer .Simmo.

Simmo,

Not sure about the scale as there are other factors other than height with the figures. Here is K&C figure from the new WS076 set next to FL figure. Note the size of head, lid, hands, MP-40 and figure heft. George summed it up very well.

 

[thebritfarmer]

Wonderful figures and photos Frank. I found this old photo amongst some papers I had stashed away and thought I would share it with you. Hope you don't mind, it is a favourite of mine.

 

[Spitfrnd]

...
As for scale, these figures are much more at home amongst 54mm connoisseur figures than the 60mm mainstream toy soldier figures.
...
Personally I take all scales with a grain of salt. The two important things for me are proportion and consistency from figure to figure. From a proportion perspective I think FL has nailed it, legs and hands and heads all "look" to be the correct size in relation to the body as a whole. In addition the weapons "look" like they are the right size in relation to the bodies. Correctly scaled weapons is certainly refreshing. On that note, I pulled out my handy caliper and took it to the Kar98s I had easy access to. They consistently came in around the 37.5mm range. The real Kar98 is 1110mm in length so 1110/37.5 = 29.6 (or rounded to 1/30).
.....
The bottom line is they aren't compatible at all with the mainstream figures in your collection. They would be more compatible with any connoisseur WWII figures you have (i.e. Aeroart, Lead Army). If you invest in these plan to use them in their own display.

I think that pretty well sums it up, weapons, unlike people, are a constant size. Nice calipers BTW mate.

 

[APACHEJOL]

It sounds like these are as good as lets say an Aeroart figure? If so this company could give other Russian companys some real competition. They are alot cheaper but just as good? I have been having alot of second thoughts on dropping 500-700 hundred dollars on mounted figures from Aeroart. Fmethorst you buy alot from Kolobob and Aeroart I think? Do these figures from FL come that close in quality? Looking forward to peoples opinions. Thanks

 

[Andanna]

It sounds like these are as good as lets say an Aeroart figure? If so this company could give other Russian companys some real competition. They are alot cheaper but just as good? I have been having alot of second thoughts on dropping 500-700 hundred dollars on mounted figures from Aeroart. Fmethorst you buy alot from Kolobob and Aeroart I think? Do these figures from FL come that close in quality? Looking forward to peoples opinions. Thanks

My opinion: they are getting close with the WWII range. Also, St. Petersburg is just a term describing a lot of different studios - and even within a studio, several quality levels are offered.

I think the "standard" of Russian miniature painting (because of its consistent quality) is Aeroart and possibly Russian Vityaz. I would be careful saying that FL is as good as Aeroart or Russian Vityaz. But FL can be painted to Aeroart standard, if you want to pay for it:

http://www.modelsculpt.org/gallery/?author=24

I understand that upon request, FL will sell its figures with the higher painting standard to you (like most Russian studios will do.), but the justification of doing that is certainly eroding. We should not forget that FL has strong ties to the Russian industry and that Matt Pavone is one of these "continuous improvement" people. There is no question in my mind that FL will continue increasing its quality, particularly the painting, and at some point meet or beat studios like Aeroart. But higher painting quality certainly translates into higher prices - in FL's case from $35/a piece to $50/a piece. This might still be a good cost/benefit ratio (I think it is). But would you be willing to pay $75/ a piece if you could increase the painting level marginally?

One word on scale: I think the standard is 54mm. I only know one manufacturer (with some smaller ones attempting to "buy into the system") that uses a different scale. As they say, one swallow does not make a summer. I think FL is right applying the classic scale: From shoe sole to eye: 54mm.

 

[marco55]

I myself like the more true 54's as they match up with scenics better,especially trees and you can put more figures in a given space.Actually my dream would be FL putting out a FIW painted 40mm range but I know that will never happen.
Mark

 

[FirstLegion]

I myself like the more true 54's as they match up with scenics better,especially trees and you can put more figures in a given space.Actually my dream would be FL putting out a FIW painted 40mm range but I know that will never happen.
Mark

Never say never...

 

[marco55]

Never say never...

Don't be a big tease.
Mark

 

[FirstLegion]

Thank you all for the kind words of encouragement. This range of figures is going to make taking pictures a lot of fun.

As for scale, these figures are much more at home amongst 54mm connoisseur figures than the 60mm mainstream toy soldier figures.

Personally I take all scales with a grain of salt. The two important things for me are proportion and consistency from figure to figure. From a proportion perspective I think FL has nailed it, legs and hands and heads all "look" to be the correct size in relation to the body as a whole. In addition the weapons "look" like they are the right size in relation to the bodies. Correctly scaled weapons is certainly refreshing. On that note, I pulled out my handy caliper and took it to the Kar98s I had easy access to. They consistently came in around the 37.5mm range. The real Kar98 is 1110mm in length so 1110/37.5 = 29.6 (or rounded to 1/30).

The bottom line is they aren't compatible at all with the mainstream figures in your collection. They would be more compatible with any connoisseur WWII figures you have (i.e. Aeroart, Lead Army). If you invest in these plan to use them in their own display.

Thanks Frank for your kind words on the figures, your excellent photographs, and your handy calipers. I'm really glad to see you enjoying them.

I hope that at long last we can put these scale issues to bed once and for all and talk about the figures themselves and the direction of the range and not how big they are or what they are compatible with. I've been trying to explain this issue to people for 3 months now and you seem to have succeeded in illustrating it more clearly than I ever did with this single post.

More Stalingrad releases to be announced very soon, so stay tuned...

Regards,

Matt
First Legion Ltd

 

[jazzeum]

Matt,

Since you raised it, what is the direction of the range?

You can't say no comment on this one

Also, on the future releases will they be available for Chicago. I think that would give you a lot of exposure with people who may not be familiar with your figures, not to mention a larger variety of figures to choose from.

 

[debrito]

Excellent shots, excellent..

Good job Frank.

rod.

 

[FirstLegion]

Matt,

Since you raised it, what is the direction of the range?

You can't say no comment on this one

Also, on the future releases will they be available for Chicago. I think that would give you a lot of exposure with people who may not be familiar with your figures, not to mention a larger variety of figures to choose from.

Good question, Brad. GERSTAL010 Pioneer Assault Group will be shipping to customers in about 2 weeks or so. The pre-order on the next 7 figures will start at about the same time and yes, they will be at Chicago. So all totalled, there will be 28 of our WWII figures at Chicago being displayed with at least part of the diorama that is shown on our website home page. We are unsure at this point if the Stug will be there or not. We hope to at least have a sample of one there if not have them for sale. Too early to say...

Of the next seven figures, 3 are Russian and 4 are German. I've already shown one of the Germans in another thread (GERSTAL014 Oberleutnant). Here are a few images of the masters of the other 3 Germans that will be part of the next release.

GERSTAL011, 12, and 13 - 3 x Running Gemans.

After these are released and the Stug is released, we will immediately follow up before the end of the year with at least one other vehicle and get the Stug tank riders out plus a few more pioneers/heer infantry with various support weapons. The range, which will be heavily German at this point, will then shift towards the Russians and we'll release several figures/pieces meant to blow up that Stug as well as additional types of Russian Infantry. From there, we will continue to add vehicles, guns, and more and more figures at pretty consistent pace and with additional variety of equipment and covering additional sections of the battle. We've said that this is going to be a very thorough and complete range and it will be.

So those are the broad strokes but certainly you should expect a few surprises as well.

Best,

Matt
First Legion Ltd

 

[fmethorst]

It sounds like these are as good as lets say an Aeroart figure? If so this company could give other Russian companys some real competition. They are alot cheaper but just as good? I have been having alot of second thoughts on dropping 500-700 hundred dollars on mounted figures from Aeroart. Fmethorst you buy alot from Kolobob and Aeroart I think? Do these figures from FL come that close in quality? Looking forward to peoples opinions. Thanks

If you are asking if they are as good as this:

The answer is no. This figure is in the 9/10-10/10 range. Where you really notice it is under high magnification. The areas between the painted highlights and shading is blended very smoothly on the top figures. One or two notches down from there these fields are more distinct with a definite border between a highlight field or a shade field and the base color.

The other thing that the top level figures have is the insane small detail only visible under magnification. This level of painting costs 8-10 times what the FL figures are selling for. Really I look at those more like buying a piece of fine art.

As others have said not all connoisseur figures are painted to the same level. The Aeroart figures are a couple notches down from the top level figures but still very impressive. I would rate the painting on the FL figures close to Aeroart. I haven't seen a Lead Army figure in person but from the pictures this might be a better comparison. Those figures are still roughly twice the price.

http://www.leadarmy.com/catalogue.asp?list=,49,90,&category=52&parent=49

 

[jazzeum]

Matt,

Thank you for sharing that. I like the pose of the soldier holding his helmet. I haven't seen that before in a military miniature but that's what I would do if I were running for my life!

 

[Spitfrnd]

....One word on scale: I think the standard is 54mm. I only know one manufacturer (with some smaller ones attempting to "buy into the system") that uses a different scale. As they say, one swallow does not make a summer. I think FL is right applying the classic scale: From shoe sole to eye: 54mm.

Amen to that mate. I have given up saying it.