The Green Berets! (1 Viewer)

[arnhem44mad]

Interesting thought, without war there would be no toy soldiers and there is no war without its attendant horror. So it is rather hard to separate the one from the other unless you are talking about depicting a fantasy war that has yet to exist. Anyway, no need to panic, the thread is free to continue with its theme and no harm is done by a simple response to a side note triggered by the original post and unlike war, no one was harmed in this experience.

No but I think I might of offended George, and for that I am sorry!

 

[Warrior]

No but I think I might of offended George, and for that I am sorry!

Thanks for the concern, but you and I are fine, so nothing to worry about, but thanks for your concern.......

 

[pugio]

Strickly speaking of movies, John Waynes Green Berets rank right there with Henry Fonda,s Battle of the Bulge as one of the worst war movies ever!
I think John Wayne was the fattest Green Beret in history!
Gary

Here we go again and on a day when my meds ran out.... But at least he had the guts to go against Hollywood liberals like Jane Fonda and make a movie supporting the troops, and by the way Louis, who said we lost the war... Vietnam Combat Vet and proud of it....

 

[Rob]

Re Toy Soldiers from more modern conflicts.Must be honest they don't do it for me and I don't really know why. Maybe its because WW1/2 were such huge conflicts with different theatres and civilization hung in the balance,but Falklands, Iraq, Vietnam etc don't stir my collecting bug I'm afraid, but I hope you guys into these eras get some more releases, variety is the spice and all that

Rob

 

[Northgate Woods]

Toy Soldiers guys, Toy Soldiers.
Lets not go there. Lost too many mates.
But talking on Vietnam in a Toy Soldier sense, I would love an Aussie Centurion, a Centurion ARV and maybe a Bridgelayer. Then there is the M113 family of vehicles. Fantastic. What a range.
Cheers Howard

 

[Louis Badolato]

Well the reality of Vietnam was that those wearing the uniform were not treated with much respect by a great many for much of the war. I have some rather personal experience with that. It was not one of the nation's finest hours. So how our country feels about our troops can certainly depend on what they are doing, even though few of them really asked to do it.

That is a terrible shame, a disgrace to our country. Those service men and women deserve to be respected by every single American for the sacrifices they made for this country. I would be sick to my stomach if that is the reason that Vietnam series didn't sell.

 

[Louis Badolato]

Here we go again and on a day when my meds ran out.... But at least he had the guts to go against Hollywood liberals like Jane Fonda and make a movie supporting the troops, and by the way Louis, who said we lost the war... Vietnam Combat Vet and proud of it....

Pugio,

I have the deepest respect for Vietnam Veterans, just like every other American and Allied veteran. I hold those members of this forum who served in the Vietnam War, like Chuck Harris and yourself, in the highest esteem. Just for the record, one of my best friends, who stood up for me at my wedding, Rick Spinelli, did two tours in Vietnam.

That being said, I was seven years old when the Vietnam War ended, and I was taught that we lost the war, in that we failed to prevent the Communist North from taking over the Republic of Vietnam. In my opinion, that was not the fault of the American troops, whe were very successful when they engaged the enemy, but of the politicians and high command, who tied the troops hands with inane rules of engagement. I certainly hope that you understand that my comment about our having lost the war was in no way meant to be insulting to brave Veterans like yourself.

 

[pugio]

Pugio,

I have the deepest respect for Vietnam Veterans, just like every other American and Allied veteran. I hold those members of this forum who served in the Vietnam War, like Chuck Harris and yourself, in the highest esteem. Just for the record, one of my best friends, who stood up for me at my wedding, Rick Spinelli, did two tours in Vietnam.

That being said, I was seven years old when the Vietnam War ended, and I was taught that we lost the war, in that we failed to prevent the Communist North from taking over the Republic of Vietnam. In my opinion, that was not the fault of the American troops, whe were very successful when they engaged the enemy, but of the politicians and high command, who tied the troops hands with inane rules of engagement. I certainly hope that you understand that my comment about our having lost the war was in no way meant to be insulting to brave Veterans like yourself.

Louis, believe me, I was not insulted, especially coming from you. I argue with people all the time about "losing the war"... actually who said we lost the war... Macnamara/Westmoreland with their body counts, the liberal press, Fonda and her cronies. As you stated, if the politicians and chicken-**** high command would have let us do the job we were trained for, Vietnam would have been the 51st state. Out of respect for the 55,000 KIA's and MIA's, I cant come to rationalize us losing the war.

 

[Scott]

There's the "spit on the troops" story that really started after the Rambo movie "First Blood" in the 80s. I was around in the 60s-70s and the war was the enemy and it was the recruiters or police that I saw get the protesting. Vietnam service is a case of veterans of a lost or unpopular war trying to get some meaning out of their service. Examples would be the Confederates or German WW II veterans. I see Vietnam vets march every year in the fatigues rather than the dress uniforms of the WW II vets.

I don't know if I would try to invest in miniature Vietnam era figures and gear to sell. Strange but I have seen photos of Vietnam War reenactors in Eastern Europe doing US troops with a two and a half ton truck tricked out out for the 60s. Maybe they are "gear" collectors or romanticize a war they had little to do with. There's a market.

 

[Scott]

The idea that citizens opposing a war equals support for the other side or disrespect for our troops is a slander that should have been put away back in 1975. It keeps getting dragged out like the "Bloody Shirt" in the 1870s and 80s against the former Confederate States.

The Green Berets is now a "period piece" and you can get enjoyment out of the movie that way. At least it gave some Asia-American actors some gainful employment playing heroes rather than laundrymen or house boys.

 

[Spitfrnd]

There's the "spit on the troops" story that really started after the Rambo movie "First Blood" in the 80s. I was around in the 60s-70s and the war was the enemy and it was the recruiters or police that I saw get the protesting. .....

Sorry to thread wander but there is a little history matter I felt the need to address. Not to put to fine a point on it but I was "around" too, in unform, and I can tell you that I experienced the spit part first hand. It was not a "story", not a movie fiction and not even a remote incident (mine was at Washington National airport).

Actually, I had and have no problem with the protests against the war, I didn't much care for it either, but I was saddened by the lack of discrimination shown by some (too many) of the protests. Military personnel are expected to implement the policies of their elected officials, however ill advised and short of a coup, that should be accepted by the population that elected those officials. Ironically, at that time, the general population didn't even appreciate how limited the protest options of their troops really were. Let's just say it was an unfortunate period of our history.

 

[Rob]

Sorry to thread wonder but there is a little history matter I felt the need to address. Not to put to fine a point on it but I was "around" too, in unform, and I can tell you that I experienced the spit part first hand. It was not a "story", not a movie fiction and not even a remote incident (mine was at Washington National airport).

Actually, I had and have no problem with the protests against the war, I didn't much care for it either, but I was saddened by the lack of discrimination shown by some (too many) of the protests. Military personnel are expected to implement the policies of their elected officials, however ill advised and short of a coup, that should be accepted by the population that elected those officials. Ironically, at that time, the general population didn't even appreciate how limited the protest options of their troops really were. Let's just say it was an unfortunate period of our history.

Whether anyone is for or against the war is one thing, but to spit on a returning soldier who was doing what is country asked him to do is an absolute disgrace, as low as the women that handed out white feathers to British soldiers in WW1 who were on leave or wounded, sorry that happened to you Bill.

Rob

 

[Mitch]

Or, the recent disgraceful scenes at Wooten Bassett (where certain sections jeered at the coffins) for the repatriation of troops.
Mitch

QUOTE=Rob;312690]Whether anyone is for or against the war is one thing, but to spit on a returning soldier who was doing what is country asked him to do is an absolute disgrace, as low as the women that handed out white feathers to British soldiers in WW1 who were on leave or wounded, sorry that happened to you Bill.

Rob[/QUOTE]

 

[Scott]

Thanks! I looked up Wootton Bassett and the incident. They transport fallen soldiers in the daylight as well. have you ever heard of Rev. Fred Phelp's church protesting at current military funerals?

As far as incidents of spitting on returning soldiers I accept his word that it happened to Spitfrnd. I was an NROTC Midshipmen in college in 1972 (Hey we coulda gone over any minute) and it was crazy time. By 1975 students went back to joining ROTC where I was in Worcester, Ma.

The Spitting Image

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Spitting_Image

http://www.vvaw.org/veteran/article/?id=215

http://www.amazon.com/Spitting-Image-Memory-Legacy-Vietnam/dp/0814751474

 

[Mitch]

Scott... Sorry, forgot some may not have known what I was saying. Yes wooten bassett is now known as the village which, comes to a standstill to pay tribute to the repatriated soldiers.

Recently some elements from our society decided to boo and jeer them as they passed. Somewhat got my blood a boiling.
Mitch

Thanks! I looked up Wootton Bassett and the incident. They transport fallen soldiers in the daylight as well. have you ever heard of Rev. Fred Phelp's church protesting at current military funerals?

As far as incidents of spitting on returning soldiers I accept his word that it happened to Spitfrnd. I was an NROTC Midshipmen in college in 1972 (Hey we coulda gone over any minute) and it was crazy time. By 1975 students went back to joining ROTC where I was in Worcester, Ma.

The Spitting Image

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Spitting_Image

http://www.vvaw.org/veteran/article/?id=215

http://www.amazon.com/Spitting-Image-Memory-Legacy-Vietnam/dp/0814751474

 

[pugio]

There's the "spit on the troops" story that really started after the Rambo movie "First Blood" in the 80s. I was around in the 60s-70s and the war was the enemy and it was the recruiters or police that I saw get the protesting. Vietnam service is a case of veterans of a lost or unpopular war trying to get some meaning out of their service. Examples would be the Confederates or German WW II veterans. I see Vietnam vets march every year in the fatigues rather than the dress uniforms of the WW II vets.

I don't know if I would try to invest in miniature Vietnam era figures and gear to sell. Strange but I have seen photos of Vietnam War reenactors in Eastern Europe doing US troops with a two and a half ton truck tricked out out for the 60s. Maybe they are "gear" collectors or romanticize a war they had little to do with. There's a market.

"Spit on the troops" story was definitely not a story or a Hollywood fable. When I got off the plane at JFK in June of 68' (tour and a half in Nam) in my dress khaki's, a few protesters were there, yelling obsenities and trying to spit on us. My father, who is a WWII vet went nuts and my brother and I had to restrain him before he could do any damage. When I went back to college under the GI Bill, as soon as fellow students learned I was ex-military and Nam vet, I had problems, BABY-KILLER, etc. but none that I couldn't handle myself. So, they aren't stories, it was first- hand experiences that a lot of vets went through.

 

[Spitfrnd]

"Spit on the troops" story was definitely not a story or a Hollywood fable. When I got off the plane at JFK in June of 68' (tour and a half in Nam) in my dress khaki's, a few protesters were there, yelling obsenities and trying to spit on us. My father, who is a WWII vet went nuts and my brother and I had to restrain him before he could do any damage. When I went back to college under the GI Bill, as soon as fellow students learned I was ex-military and Nam vet, I had problems, BABY-KILLER, etc. but none that I couldn't handle myself. So, they aren't stories, it was first- hand experiences that a lot of vets went through.

Indeed, apart from your experience and mine, I have many friends from the period that had or witnessed similar scenes. It seems that Lembcke didn't interview any of those and his statement "that memories of being verbally and physically assaulted by anti-war protesters were largely conjured, arguing that not even one case could be documented." is simply silly and rather an example of historical revisionism. I didn't see him at National that day either.

 

[Scott]

I'm sure it was your experience. Heck I used to catch crap about "My generation" even walking around in my ROTC uniform from folks that were just mad in general at kids. I can't find any available information on-line that says that this was a mass experience or a common tactic of protest at airports or other wise. As veterans began to run the antiwar movement in the early 70s, such a tactic against other vets doesn't make sense.

"Spitting on the Troops" as a GOOGLE search gets storied of how US troops have been mistreated since 2003 by the VA, contractors, and transportation companies.