What quality improvements should be made by KC and would it affect your purchases? (2 Viewers)

I buy from George and Shannon and, when possible, I ask them to open the box and take a quick look to see if everything looks allright. If you establish a good working relationship with a dealer they'll do that for you and replace it if there's still a problem.
 
Good advice Brad,

Next time I’ll ask the dealer to review the sets prior to shipment to ensure quality. I hate bent gun barrels. Fortunately, KC gun barrels can be bent back without fear of breakage unlike some others manufacturers. However, it sometimes leaves a small paint chip in its place.

Carlos
 
They try very hard with their packaging to protect their product. I unpack a fair number of figures and I see product bent. I am not sure when it happens but it does. I am glad that the blister pack idea seems to have gone the way of the dodo.
 
Carlos,

Even sometimes the best plans go awry but I've been fortunate in that I haven't had too many problems. I know many people had broken headlights with the Panzer Meyer but I was fortunate. The worst I had was an arm broken off the Tommy in the Bren Gun carrier, which George quickly replaced.
 
Carlos,

Even sometimes the best plans go awry but I've been fortunate in that I haven't had too many problems. I know many people had broken headlights with the Panzer Meyer but I was fortunate. The worst I had was an arm broken off the Tommy in the Bren Gun carrier, which George quickly replaced.

Agreed Brad,

However how do I glue the broken headlight on my Panzer Meyer again? LOL,

Carlos
 
My wonderful wife-to-be bought over a $1,000 USD of Crusaders for me for Christmas last year and when I opened them up - the AXE Men were bent and had severe paint chips ....

.... All the other Crusader figures are fine and great - I Love Them ! But, these Axe Men are in desparate need of quality control. IMO.Ron

Count me in there too! Haven´t recieved any AXE men with a straight axe. Funny in a way - never recived a sword bended!

I might have mentioned it before, but i have the Ladder Set. The crusaders fell of the ladder - a "trip" for 1,5 m - and the result was 2 crusader with no paint on legs and feet and one broken arm. I know i can´t blame K&C for this, but it´s depressing and expensive - had to buy a new set :eek:

But have to admit - K&C is simply amazing!
 
The thing that is most intriguing to me will be how KC reconciles a rather narrow view of what sells based on past experience with the fact that they have done most of the big ticket German WWII items. Collectors that want KC Tigers, Panthers and such now have them and competitors like HB can cherry pick to make a higher quality version. Does that mean KC will move a bit from the dependence on German sets to other aspects of WWII? The Rammjager and Heydrich SL indicate they are exploring some less traditional ideas, but haven't quite taken the plunge to do the same for non-German sets. Sure there are lots of German items left to be made and another 88 is overdue, but the huge German sellers are a done deal for KC. Probably not enough new collectors to just keep producing Tiger remakes. I think they have to find a way to open up untapped markets like the Eastern Front. All sorts of possibilities out there. Maybe it requires a different type of marketing. One problem seems to be an almost total lack of knowledge among US collectors regarding this campaign. The more they learn about it, the more this line will sell. Make a knockout Russian JS2 and educate people as part of the marketing campaign that it was the best tank of the war. Some others have brought up the fact that the wargaming crowd is wild for this stuff. There has to be a market out there of existing collectors and eastern front enthusiasts that can move the 1,000-2,000 units that KC apparently needs to sell. It seems almost inevitable that something like this must happen to keep KC on top over the longer term.
 
I am someone who is interested in pretty much all WW2 History and armour.I for one think a JS2 is a Tank that would make a stunning vehicle and would go very nicely with the T34.I also think that sooner or later one of the big three will take the plunge and start producing some British armour.If there are still lots of German armoured subjects to make there is a plethora of British ones.I also agree with you that there does seem to be a lack of interest from our American friends in the Russian front,but i must say i don't know why this is.On the Tiger front,when i heard NMA's model would be a Tiger i thought we already have enough.However Blake has pulled out all the stops and produced some fantastic examples of this legandary Tank.We really are spoilt for choice at the moement,as someone said yesterday it is a golden age for collecting.

Rob
 
I haven't had too many problems with the Napoleonic line as of yet....a few with the Egyption sets though.....



WELLINGTON
 
Andy and K/C , You guys are doing a great job......Figures are excellent and poses are good......I would also be happy to see more Tigers and Panzer IV tanks with improvements over the older models which are a bit dated in style and way over-priced on the secondary market......Thank you for your efforts......Vezzolf
 
Hi,

I would like to see more OSTFRONT summer figurines. More Russians T34, Germans Panthers, halftracks Panzers, also some artillery and Anti aircrafts-Flaks.

Even a few civilians will be interesting to have.

visit
www.handmadehistory.spaces.live.com

CHEERS
 
I agree that better packaging would be a great improvement. All my Crusaders weapons were severely bent:(
 
Hi guys,

I’m a regular on the Canada Toy Soldier club forum but I finally decided to sign up over here just to post in this thread because this issue is so important to me and I want to make sure people in the toy soldier industry read it!

Since I’m younger than most posters on this forum, maybe my eyes are a little better. Or maybe my personality is a little more picky/discerning (for financial reasons I have to be). Or maybe I’m just really unlucky at receiving lemon sets… but I seem to notice quality control issues that apparently don’t phase that many others on the forums. Until this thread I haven’t seen anyone talk much about the disappointment you feel when you open a brand new set of figures only to discover a bent rifle, shovel, or paint missing from small areas of a figure so the silver shows through.

I have come to call it “The 3Ps of Poor Quality”: “Paint”, “Packaging” and “Polystone”. These are things every manufacturer in this industry needs to pay attention to.

First comes paint: I’ve found small painting irregularities or tiny spots of paint missing from figures that are fresh from the box, so some of these quality control mistakes are being made right at the factory. When silver glints from a figure, even from a small spot, it seriously compromises its aesthetic value by reminding you that you are not looking at a miniature soldier but instead just a metal facsimile. Andy, if for cost reasons you must focus on only one area, make sure the faces of your figures are free from different coloured marks, sloppy excess paint lines, paint cracks, and most importantly silver spots.

Next comes packaging: Most companies use pre-cut foam but I can tell you it’s just not working well enough. Just to concur with other’s observations, my MK-015(S) dealer special Crusader also arrived with a bent axe. Upon bending it straight there was paint loss – luckily it was only on the axe handle so it looks like part of the weapon. But such defects are hardly confined to the Crusader line alone, or K&C for that matter.

From my experiences I’m fairly certain that some figures are damaged at the factory when they’re packing them – I think the workers sometimes shove the figures into foam which isn’t cut properly and voila – bending occurs. I frankly can’t understand why toy soldier companies seem incapable of inventing packaging that doesn’t damage their own products, and ensures they can survive the gauntlet of the postal system. I’m not saying plastic blisters are any better – I’ve had Del Prado and Altaya/Frontline figures arrive with heavy paint loss due to banging around inside the bubble. So far I’ve found Figarti does the best job of packing their figure sets (on the other hand, their Japanese howitzer and tiger tank, while very well packed, still managed to arrived somewhat damaged).

Finally comes polystone. I read that K&C introduced polystone to this hobby – I very much wish they had not. Polystone is extremely heavy, brittle and unable to hold the fine details that plastic and metal can. The only reason K&C vehicles are so nice is because they’re painted so well, in spite of the cheap material used. No working treads or hatches (like 21st Century/Forces of Valour vehicles) – just a lump of painted stone. The only advantage of polystone as far as I can discern is that it’s much cheaper than plastic or metal for the manufacturer to produce in limited runs yet its heaviness deceptively conveys the feeling that it must be valuable and well made. I can only think that early on many collectors mistook K&C’s excellently painted vehicles for metal which allowed polystone to get a foothold in this hobby. Thanks to polystone we end up with tanks and artillery pieces with barrels that curve at odd angles, among other problems.

I’ll give two examples of poor K&C polystone pieces. My “beautifully executed winter Kettenrad” (in Louis’ words) is not particularly well executed at all. The top-mounted tubing superstructure is warped out of shape. I sent for a replacement kettenkrad but its tube rollcage was bent a different way and there was a spot of black paint right on the nose of the driver. Likewise, the K&C 8th Army 25lb field gun is seriously lacking in fine details (such as elevation cranks). It looks, as befits the name polystone, like a piece of soapstone carved to resemble the artillery piece rather than a scale representation of the real thing. I understand the 25 pounder was an earlier K&C mould but I wonder whether any of the newer guns are really any better given the detail limitations of polystone (and the propensity for warped barrels). The W. Britains 25 pounder, also polystone, is no better.

Now some might say these 3 inconsistencies in quality are meant to differentiate toy soldier products from mass-produced figures (e.g. the slogan in this hobby “bent but not broken”). On the contrary, I think that hand-made figures should be of a higher quality because each piece is inspected by human artisans. Certainly the price is high enough to warrant superb quality ($100 = the entire monthly budget of many people in sub-saharan Africa).

The previous observations should not be viewed in any way as a slam against K&C as these problems afflict every manufacturer my father and I have purchased from: King & Country, Britains, New Model Army, Figarti, East of India, Conte, Del Prado, Altaya (sold through Frontline), Monarch Regalia, and various other glossy brands. Rather, my desire is simply to help improve the quality of this wonderful toy soldier hobby.

Defects like this wouldn’t be tolerated so much in the 1/6 action figure hobby which I have long been involved in. Forum members in that hobby are all over such problems when they find them, and believe me, they are not nice to the manufacturers that suffer from them.

Andy, if you want to attract new customers from other hobbies, you have to step up on this issue. If you want to call yourself the best in the industry, which I agree K&C is at the moment, please make sure your quality control also tops everyone else.

Thank you.
 
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Firstly Welcome to the forum its good to have you aboard.I think you raise a very good point and in fact we as consumers need to speak up across the whole board and not just with toy soldiers!.Having read all the posts here it makes me realise how lucky i am.I buy my K&C from only two suppliers K&C UK and Treefrog and have never had a problem like this.I find both companies superb in all areas of their service and this coupled with the fact they are all very friendly helpful people that cements my loyalty as a customer.I can honestly say i have never received a single damaged item from either of these suppliers and this makes me:).

I am really pleased you have signed up on TF Canadian Samurai.Having read many posts over on your forum i understand you are a leading light as it were from that forum.In your post you said you were not knocking K&C.My point is it doesn't matter if you are!.This is a free open forum and anyone can say what they feel without fear of being shouted down.I say all this because i was saddened to read that many people on your forum think this forum is full of Rabid K&C fans who want to crush any views that differ from the 'Mass'.Speaking personally i would absolutely hate to be thought of like that.Yes we do have some very enthusiastic K&C supporters and i guess i'm the guy in the middle with the flag in one hand and the pistol in the other!.However i think that although there were some heated and over excited debates a while back some of us (including myself)have excepted we got a little bit over heated and things are different now.I hope some of your readers may consider checking TF out again as it is a great forum and its so important to share this Hobby with as many as possible.

Rob
 
I guess that I am lucky enough to minimize most defect issues ,by being able to professionally repair and repaint all blemishes, polystone or not...Some of my favorite K/C pieces are the ones that I bought cheap, because of defects, and was able to fix as original.........Because I got what I paid for, no crocadile tears over the damage, and since I collect for my enjoyment, no worry over resell value. I am ,in no way as good as Alex or others ,in the " trade ", but polystone is easy to work with and paints up nice. And I am one that collects them as super painted, reasonbly detailed sculptures. ( the spinning wheels on the newer vehicles do enhance the play value ) Michael
 
Canadian Samurai - that was a looooooong post, mate - but well worth reading - :)

I wholeheartedly agree - as a customer it's important to feel reassured that the company you are buying your soldiers from are doing all they can to monitor their QC systems and that they are working. I've never bought from K+C directly, and with less than one hundred pieces in my collection at the moment, my experience is fairly limited. However, most of the pieces I have have been bought from K+C UK, a local model shop, and more recently from Sierra Toy Soldiers in the US.

So far, I haven't had anything arrive bent out of shape or broken, but I have certainly had a few figures where I have felt inclined to touch up or repaint some dodgy or inconsistent paint work - most notably on areas of flesh, or 'red on black', black and gloss black on some of the Berlin '38 range. Being a long time wargamer and some time figure painter, I have the tools, a little skill, and the inclination to render a respectable repair job - but the fact remains, it irks me somewhat when I take the figure out of the box only to realise I have to do it.

As for packaging - I actually like the cut out foam variety - haven't really had any problems with it. I DON'T like the 'velvetty covered', pre-moulded plastic stuff with the plastic covered wires to secure the figures in place. I don't know which came first, or whether both systems have been used concurrently, but IMHO the sooner that is dispensed with the better. The one major problem I have encountered with a figure was when I ordered the LAH drum horse, after it had been retired, and I had to look long and hard to get one. It arrived in said packaging - but minus the wires. It had obviously been on display in the store where I got it from and when it arrived it had also suffered from being bashed around the insides of its box. I had to paint significant bits of it.

Having said all this, the thrill of taking that finely sculpted, exquisitely painted soldier out of the box, which more often than not I am doing, more than makes up for the odd disappointment - :D
 
...I am really pleased you have signed up on TF Canadian Samurai...

Rob


Hi Rob-

You surely can be pleased that CS had signed with TF. He will be a great addition to the forum. His posts are intelligent and interesting. He is a serious collector and his comments are reflecting that fact.

No doubts that you will enjoy reading him as much as I do in CTSC.

Pierre.
 
Hey Pierre,its always good to see new members joining TF.I look forward to reading his posts with interest.

Rob
 
Something to note about Figarti, their packaging is way overboard and they still have problems. But also the really fragile parts are packed seperately and are attached by the owner.
 
...things are different now...

...as (TF) is a great forum and its so important to share this Hobby with as many as possible.

Rob


Me again-

I can't say the contrary on both quotes.

However, just to clear things, CTSC is not, in any way, a rival of TF.

Firstly, CTSC is not sponsored by a dealer. Accordingly, the forum was not created to generate new clients for a business. Nicolas (the individual behind it) is an enthusiastic collector who wants/wanted to share his passion with other collectors. For some reasons (and there is no use to come back on those), he didn't feel comfortable to do it on the existing forums at the time. So, he created CTSC and he his paying the monthly fees to the webmaster from his own pockets. Then, we are not in competition with TF in respect of parts of market.

Secondly, CTSC is not devoted to any manufacturer. Accordingly, the freedom of expression, without fearing any disproportionate reactions by the other members in respect of the point posted, is the foundation of our forum.
So, we are not trying, in any way, to fetch any collector but we are looking for people who will become intimate (if you allow me that expression) not only because they love the hobby but also because they share and respect in what we believe (CTSC was created in 2006, accordingly while reading that paragraph have it in mind. As you said, things are different now).

Thirdly, we just want to have fun :)

I hope that this post will help you to understand who we are.

Mes meilleures amitiés,
Pierre.
 

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