Why are we so German Crazy (1 Viewer)

[Rob]

Agree Rob Kc are the best for British and commwealth stuff coming out

Very true Neil, anything you'd like to see still? I would still hope to see some more of the funnies myself if poss but I guess they may be more expensive to make than recent smaller tanks.

Rob

 

[desk11desk12]

You are in the midst of an "ancient" argument For years those of us in scale modeling asked the same basic questions. Why is it that the "dark side" is more appealing? Specifically, German stuff just seems to excite many people. The engineering was interesting and quite different than many Allied approaches. They often applied good tactical sense to the production of weapon systems. The German tanks have either a 1930s throw back look (Pz IV and earlier) or they have an angular "bad guy" look. The Germans embraced various camouf;age painting schemes early in the war, the Allies were rarely so colorful. I fully sympathize with your attitudes and some of the complaints. I am a notorius "GI freak" and I buy much more US stuff than German, but I will admit that on a lower shelf in my display case is a small K&C German battle group that were bought just 'cause they look cool.

The German vs Allied argument has been running thru models and toy soldiers "forever". It MIGHT be hopeful to realize after years of waiting the Allied stuff has become more prolific and of much higher quality. Glance through the new and upcoming vehicles on Terry Ashley's Perth Military Modeling Society (PMMS) web site. His site is the best place to get updates on the 1/35th market and you will see that quite a few of your requests have come out in plastic. Some of our "collectible miniatures" manufacturers use plastic models to support development of new projects, so more and better models can translate into more new Allied projects - it will just take time.

On the other side we still buy products from naufacturers who are just LAZY in their research in Allied subects. Two specifics are the K 'n C "DDay Sherman" which not nearly what it claims to be, and Collector's Showcase putting out that M4A1 with the glaring error on the rear. We still have a LOT of people who buy an item because of the name on the box, or because it's "good enough". Until we demand that these guys produce decent products I don't see them moving into some of the other stuff you want. Why make rare models when the collectors will buy any old crap? Just appreciate the releases that come out and that are correct models and don't buy the junk - vote with your hard-earned dollars (or Euros or whatever).

Gary B.

You tell them Gary...LOL

Good points none the less,

Carlos

 

[Hunter Rose]

Firebat,

Your question was answered many moons ago in the movie Spaceballs: "Evil will always win because good is dumb."

And so it is with toy soldier AFVs. :salute::

 

[Hunter Rose]

On a more serious note, for me the fascination with German stuff is because of the technical/tactical superiority of a lot of German equipment and units. Sure, some of them have been inflated to mythical proportions and there are many examples of poor German units and their performance, but on the whole the Germans owned the tactical and operational environments during World War 2. Their Achilles heal was in their inability to tie these tactical/operational victories to grand strategic success.

The Germans basically fought the entire world by themselves, especially in the later years of the war. Everybody loves an underdog. They often fought successfully in the offensive at 4-1 odds and defended successfully at 10-1 odds. Especially on the Eastern Front. We all know he Germans were basically overwhelmed by the Allies numeric and material superiority. Even in he last stages of the war, after years of fighting and after their troop quality had dramatically declined due to casualty attrition, in anything approach an even fight its a good bet the Germans came out on top.

The above coupled with the fact that to me German vehicles often just look cooler, as did their uniforms (hell Hugo Boss and other designers of the fashion industry were consulted to make them look cool) makes me focus on them for collecting.

 

[Panzer ace]

I collect more German K&C items for all of the reasons listed as well as the fact that I had family members who fought for the Germans.

I also do not understand the argument for the allied vehicles that relates to winning the war? Why would that make them more appealing?

 

[PanzerAce1944]

As others have already mentioned the appeal of the German technology, Tiger's, Panther's, King Tiger's, Jadgtiger, the list goes on and on. So true once you have 8 or 10 Tigers done it is possibly time to move on. As of late I have
been adding more American, British, Russian Armor and troops to round out my WWII ETO collection. That all being said I am still waiting to jump on the next new and appealing German armor release.

 

[Rob]

I collect more German K&C items for all of the reasons listed as well as the fact that I had family members who fought for the Germans.

I also do not understand the argument for the allied vehicles that relates to winning the war? Why would that make them more appealing?

I think it might have been that the allies were the 'good guys ' as it were , which of course compared to the odious Nazi regime they were. Its a great pity for those decent soldiers of Germany who were shackled to the racist, perverted, hate filled world of Hitler and his fellow pyscopaths.

Back on thread I hope in the future Andy may return to making the bigger Tanks again if poss.

Rob

 

[Firebat]

There is some excellent Allied stuff out......I would just like to see a little more of it.


Check out the items I mentioned at the beginning of this thread, They are very unique. Maybe I look at things more as a diorama builder than a collector and I imagine what I could do if I had some of that stuff.

I think you can see there is more of a market for Allied stuff than one might think...I hope the manufacturers tune into this thread and see that unique and accurate Allied stuff can sell.

Also notice my list does NOT contain combat vehicles, once again looking at it as a diorama builder, non combat scenes can have great character and powerful messages. K&C has done the most non combat stuff so I hope Andy gives some of those pieces some consideration.


Of all the scenes I have done the pics from this scene are some of my all time favorites......NON COMBAT but the message is awesome.....There are more on my website.


Alex

 

[Panzer ace]

Alex:

I apologize for stating the obvious, but your pics and dios are incredible!

-PA

 

[Firebat]

I collect more German K&C items for all of the reasons listed as well as the fact that I had family members who fought for the Germans.

I also do not understand the argument for the allied vehicles that relates to winning the war? Why would that make them more appealing?

Simple.....Because they were the vehicles manned by the men that won the war.


The vehicles were manned by civilian soldiers, not a professional ( German ) Army who had a lot of training and experience and the citizen soldiers prevailed. That is enough for me to want them.

 

[Firebat]

Alex:

I apologize for stating the obvious, but your pics and dios are incredible!

-PA

Thanks

And done with Allied stuff {sm4}{sm4}{sm4}

 

[Hunter Rose]

Nice scene, Alex, but it would have looked better if you had used a Panzer IV, Opel Blitzs, Kubelwagens, and a Hanomag ready to be loaded on a train instead of a landing craft. :salute::

 

[Combat]

1) The bad guys are always a source of great interest. That's why we have more TV shows on gangsters and serial killers than accountants.

2) Hitler was a master of propaganda. So the German uniforms, flags and even fighting vehicles are designed to have a visual impact. As a result, they translate well into toy soldiers.

3) The Germans were innovative. All manner of ideas in terms of rockets, monster tanks/guns, jets etc.

 

[Poppo]

As others have already mentioned the appeal of the German technology, Tiger's, Panther's, King Tiger's, Jadgtiger, the list goes on and on.


But let' s not forget that, by far, the main quantity in the "panzerwaffe" was made of old " panzer 4", produced till the end of the war because of Guderian' s will. He was right, panzer 4 was easy and cheap to build, and effective till the end....{sm3}

 

[Blowtorch]

If you look at the postwar to modern militaries, you see German influence all the way, from weapons to doctrine. Monty would dance with Rommel till he ran out of fuel. Russia had massed waves. America would fall back and call in an artillery or carpet bombing armageddon. Not the stuff of legend.

What was the first thing the US Army did with the German officers? Made them sit down & write.

 

[Firebat]

Nice scene, Alex, but it would have looked better if you had used a Panzer IV, Opel Blitzs, Kubelwagens, and a Hanomag ready to be loaded on a train instead of a landing craft. :salute::

Darn..I should have thought of that ! {sm4}

Hows this.

 

[h.hammer]

If you look at the postwar to modern militaries, you see German influence all the way, from weapons to doctrine. Monty would dance with Rommel till he ran out of fuel. Russia had massed waves. America would fall back and call in an artillery or carpet bombing armageddon. Not the stuff of legend.

What was the first thing the US Army did with the German officers? Made them sit down & write.

Perspectives are always a fascinating subject. Funny, when I was at West Point in the 60's I never saw all those brilliant accounts written by brilliant German officers, nor did I see anything but a footnote in the tactics section by Rommel or Manstein. Illusions are indeed intoxicating. As I have said before, perhaps so many of our "European Allies" who post on the Forum, have other motivations for the German products than 'They sell best"
h. hammer

 

[Panzer ace]

Simple.....Because they were the vehicles manned by the men that won the war.


The vehicles were manned by civilian soldiers, not a professional ( German ) Army who had a lot of training and experience and the citizen soldiers prevailed. That is enough for me to want them.

Fair enough, I was just curious what that angle was.

 

[Guy]

I normally do not participate in such threads. I can only say we dio makers, we need them both :the Germans and their friends and the Allies.There are always at least two parties envolved in every conflict. The Germans in WWII had the better weapons, were more inventive and inovative . The Allies had the numbers. Both are evenly important in the TS world . The commercial aspect and importance however is never out of sight . If you want to make a dio about say "the red ball express" you need US negro soldiers-drivers . Nobody is venturing into this field because they say such figures will not be popular ,will not sell well so we don't make them ( except now for the Askari).The same is true for the Italians, the japs,the PTO in general, etc...only a few of them about. Even when you look at the o so popular Germans what do you see : Panzers and Panzertruppen, panzergrenadiers, SS and a few regular army figures. Where is the Kriegsmarine and the Luftwaffe, the Engineers etc.... these series were started but had a quiet death.This is how the TS world works my friends ..........
guy

 

[Guy]

Perspectives are always a fascinating subject. Funny, when I was at West Point in the 60's I never saw all those brilliant accounts written by brilliant German officers, nor did I see anything but a footnote in the tactics section by Rommel or Manstein. Illusions are indeed intoxicating. As I have said before, perhaps so many of our "European Allies" who post on the Forum, have other motivations for the German products than 'They sell best"
h. hammer

WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY THAT MY FRIEND ?????????
guy