Britain's Greatest General - National Army Museum (2 Viewers)

[Gazza]

The National Army Museum (I received membership as a Christmas present) is running an interesting competition on who is Britain’s Greatest General. There is a public vote and will be a speaker event in April.

There are 20 contenders across the ages:

First Row:
Frederick Roberts, John Moore, Archibald Wavell, James Wolfe, Garnet Wolseley

Second Row:
Colin Campbell, Edmund Allenby, Douglas Haig, Robert Sale, Duke of Marlborough

Third Row:
Robert Clive, Gerald Templar, Thomas Fairfax, Montgomery, Jan Smuts

Fourth Row:
Herbert Kitchener, Claude Auchinleck, Duke of Wellington, William Slim, Oliver Cromwell

Interesting choices. I have to say was not aware who Gerald Templar was – though he was in charge of British forces during the Malaysian Emergency and is credited with coining the phrase ‘hearts and minds’. Are there any others who should have been included? None from more modern era’s like Falklands and maybe Henry V / Richard the Lionheart were considered only English.

At the moment the top 5 are as follows:

Haig 626
Slim 527
Wellington 237
Monty 229
Duke of Marlborough 227

Controversially Haig is winning; personally, I struggle with this, given the whole sale repeated massacre of British and Commonwealth troops in WW1 when Haig blindly followed the same foolhardy tactics again and again.

Thoughts?

 

[Louis Badolato]

The 626 people who voted for Douglas Haig and the 239 who voted for Montgomery need to have their heads examined. Haig could be the worst commanding general the British ever produced, and Monty was a classic example of the peter principal.

Anybody who doesn't vote for Bill Slim and Wellington hasn't spent enought time studying military history.

Sir Collin Campbell (he was a Brigade commander during the Crimean War), Kitchener (he was a figurehead by the time WWI rolled around), Fighting Bob Sale, Frederick Sleigh Roberts and Sir Garnett Woseley were very good generals who commanded during colonial wars, and never faced an opponent like Napoleon or the Axis forces who could have conquered the British Empire, so I would disqualify them from the running.

Claude Auckinleck and Archibald Wavell both had major failure against Romell, so don't make my list.

 

[Wraith]

So, is that a vote for Monty then Louis?

 

[DMNamiot]

Well this is an interesting poll. My vote would be for Wellington. However I am not surprised that Haig is winning right now. He is an interesting General to be sure.

Look forward to seeing the results of this one.

Dave

 

[Currahee Chris]

I'm taking Boudicca. Or the enigmatic Arthur. Wellington seemed pretty competent too.

 

[Currahee Chris]

just so everyone knows, I am taking this thread to be banned/blocked or otherwise sixed by post 125. I'm giving good odds too ^&grin

 

[DMNamiot]

Whats the odds chris?

Dave

 

[lancer]

Very interesting choices. Certainly would have to include Slim and Duke of Marlborough as best. Like Roberts and Wolseley to lesser extent. Despite prevailing opinion, Haig has to be in my Top 5. NO ONE came out of WW1 looking good but Haig did lead Britain to victory and didn't shirk the responsibility. -- Al

 

[Wraith]

just so everyone knows, I am taking this thread to be banned/blocked or otherwise sixed by post 125. I'm giving good odds too ^&grin

Whats the odds chris?

Dave

Do I detect a certain conflict of interests?:rolleyes2:

 

[DMNamiot]

Hi Wraith

One must maintain a sense of humor or the moderation becomes less than moderate...:wink2:

Besides I am seriously hoping Chris is incorrect here and we can have a civil discussion on the merits of the various generals in the poll.

While I would certainly cast my vote for Wellington I am also interested in several of the other Generals mentioned like Wolfe and Clive as well as Roberts. Not sure I would have included some of these gents but they are all worthy of discussion.

Dave

 

[jazzeum]

just so everyone knows, I am taking this thread to be banned/blocked or otherwise sixed by post 125. I'm giving good odds too ^&grin

I'll see you on that and bid you by post 50! ^&grin:salute:::wink2:%^V

 

[Wraith]

Hi Wraith

One must maintain a sense of humor or the moderation becomes less than moderate...:wink2:

Dave

Heck Dave, I'd be on it like a shot. Make the bet, whatever gives you the best odds and then close the thread and cash in. ^&grin

 

[Rob]

Well Wellington deserves to be in there for kicking Napoleons backside at Waterloo, Monty for reminding Rommel he had an urgent appt back in Germany (and please let's not hear the tired old line about 'it was only supplies' that won Alamein-Monty inspired the 8th army, taught them they could beat the Fox with the right attitude. Supplies alone did not give the Desert rats the confidence and morale to go forward and kick the much vaunted Afrika Corp out of North Africa, it's an insult to those men to suggest otherwise) Monty also totally out thought Rommel during that campaign and also used fake troop concentrations to limit Rommels actions.

And am glad to see Haig in there too, for his leadership of the British army in the last 100 days of the war in which they enjoyed a string of victories pretty much unmatched in it's History. I'm glad to say that the prehistoric and absurd generalising of ' Lions led by Donkeys has gradually been replaced over the last couple of decades with a calmer more rounded view of Haig taking it's place^&cool:salute::

 

[marco55]

Wolfe and Clive really had only one major victory each I believe.Roberts did good in 2nd Afghan War and did he not turn the British around in the Boer War.
Mark

 

[marco55]

Were not Smith-Dorrien,Byng and Plumer more compentent than Haig?
Mark

 

[lancer]

Were not Smith-Dorrien,Byng and Plumer more compentent than Haig?
Mark

Tough to answer as there is no real comparison, scale-wise. All three had success at their command levels but none were the CinC, as Haig was. Haig and Smith-Dorrien were Corp commanders under FM French early in the war, where S-D ran afoul of French but S-D did, by account, save the BEF. S-D's command position did not last long because of his dust up with French. Would have to say that the three men's tactical abilities were better than Haig's but that wasn't really Haig's job as CinC. Tough question. -- Al

 

[hsm]

What?!! Elphinstone didn't make the list?........of course not he is at the top of the worst generals!

 

[blaster]

Folks,

generals are measured by the number of battles fought, significance and success rate.
If so and based on mere facts alone, then Wellington beats all of them for sheer number of battles fought, Salamanca and Waterloo (significant battles) and 100% success rate.

Any other British general match the above statistics?

Rgds Victor

 

[Rob]

Folks,

generals are measured by the number of battles fought, significance and success rate.
If so and based on mere facts alone, then Wellington beats all of them for sheer number of battles fought, Salamanca and Waterloo (significant battles) and 100% success rate.

Any other British general match the above statistics?

Rgds Victor

Thats a very good point, however, when you put something out to the vote like this everybody has different criteria and will vote on not just statistics but how they feel about certain Generals and perhaps on an area they have an interest in.

Very interesting none the less and Wellington surely has to be right up there.:salute::

Rob

 

[Mitch]

Regardless of what some think I would say Montgomery or Haig will eventually be the winners
Mitch