Could someone who owns this fine model please tell me what its dimensions are? Height , width and length. I am constructing a Diorama of the third battle of Karkov of March 1943; the last German offensive victory of WW II. I plan to repaint the Panzer III in Panzer Grau and Dunkel Gleb camouflage suitable to the Ost Front of this period. Help would be appreciated. Thank You
Collectors Showcase Panzer III Dimensions? (1 Viewer)
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bradleyl30
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There was a great thread with tons of detail on this just a few months ago. If you either scroll down or search for it you should find it pretty easy.
Blowtorch
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My kind of guy. One thing...most would be white washed here. You thinking Kharkov 42?
The CS III is large format. A big tank that won't match K&C or FL. What unit you going to do?
Third battle of Karkov was from March into April 1943, after the fall of Stalingrad. A massive Russian attack pushed the Germans out of Karkov. Von Manstein counter attacked
using 1st SS Panzer Army supported by the Grossdeutschland Panzer Grenadier Division. The Panzer III will have the markings of Grossdeutschland; a white Stahalheim. The Grossdeutschland was one of the few Heer Panzer Divisions I am aware of that had a Tiger battalion.
using 1st SS Panzer Army supported by the Grossdeutschland Panzer Grenadier Division. The Panzer III will have the markings of Grossdeutschland; a white Stahalheim. The Grossdeutschland was one of the few Heer Panzer Divisions I am aware of that had a Tiger battalion.
Mitch
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Definitely a man after my own heart. This is the one battle I really have a fascination with. Done a lot of repaints for this battle and have nearly finished the dio of Leibstandarte Platz for them. Look forward to seeing some of the work
I can see why FL started with Stalingrad but, would like to see them expand into this as it had everything
Mitch
I can see why FL started with Stalingrad but, would like to see them expand into this as it had everything
Mitch
The battle of Karkov was a classic panzer battle. The Russian Guards Army HQ was enveloped and destroyed. At the end of the battle the casualty count was 40,000 Russian versus 11,000 SS. A far more interesting battle than Kursk; which was a battle of attrition.
The third battle of Karkov was the last victory of the Panzer Waffe. I agree it had everything happening! Interestingly many of the protagonists on the German side at Karkov were at the Battle of the Bulge i.e./ Sepp Detrich, Joachim Piper etc.
The third battle of Karkov was the last victory of the Panzer Waffe. I agree it had everything happening! Interestingly many of the protagonists on the German side at Karkov were at the Battle of the Bulge i.e./ Sepp Detrich, Joachim Piper etc.
Blowtorch
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We'll at work now, can't take measurements yet. You want any comparison photos with other III's?
Blowtorch
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Taking a stab at this, the GrossD at Kharkov 43 was comprised of two panzer units. The remnants of the 1942 division that went through Blau & Rzhev iirc, which didn't have much left, and no panzer IIIs anyway. The second formation was fresh from France and probably whitewashed over panzer grey. Won't have the details until I get home.
Photos are always wecome. I look forward to seeing them. This period was when the Dunkel Gleb replaced the Schwarz Grau as panzer base color. Early camouflage patterns combined these two colors, Regards
Blowtorch
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Must do the photos later. But here's some data: the 1942 GD Pz Bn had 2xIIIL42& 1 Befehl; the rest were II & IV. They (III) must have all survived because on 2/11/43 the battalion had 6xIV & 3xIII left. The newly formed second battalion joined the div a few days later around Kharkov & had 10xIIIL60 plus IVG, VIe, Befehl & Flamm. Don't have the numbers for StuGs & Marders. Of the pics I have of the unit in this time period, I would say a ratio of 8:1 grey to whitewash. Some of the tanks have a small light patch on the turret. This is seen in pics of III & VIe. Artists usually have colored this as sand yellow or dunkelgelb. Don't know if it has ever been explained. It's found on grey turrets. When joined, the 1942 battalion became First Bn, and the new battalion became Second of the GD Pz Regt.
http://www.tanks-encyclopedia.com/ww2/nazi_germany/2nd_SS_PzGrndiers_Kharkov1943.png
Example of GD camo 1943
Example of GD camo 1943
Blowtorch
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Not really an SS guy but I think that's das reich at Kursk. Mitch?
Mitch
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''Tiki'' was DR and was for Kursk and not at Kharkov. I have repainted a Tiger into the Tiki colour way and in those training months ''Tiki'' had a couple of camo repaints as pictures show different camo patterns for the Dunkelgelb pattern. The battles in and around Kharkov are great for painters like myself as many units were mixed with dunkelgelb and Grey with whitewash and some without. GD Tigers arrived and were active for some time without Whitewash so, it not only is the most fascinating battle in WWII it has everything from Panzer I's to Tigers active on the front lines.
It is also interesting that had the Germans pushed on after the recapturing and complete routing of the Russians Kursk may never have happened those short months later.
Mitch
It is also interesting that had the Germans pushed on after the recapturing and complete routing of the Russians Kursk may never have happened those short months later.
Mitch
Mitch; the reference drawing was just to show the combination of Dunkel Gleb and Schwarz Grau used in early 1943. Do you have dimensions for the CS Panzer III. Brian may have used the Stug III molds/patterns for the Panzer III; if so than it would be 4.125 inches wide and 1/28 scale per my CS Stug III dimensions. The Stug III and first Tiger I are some of Brian's best work. The CS Panzer III looks good but I have not purchased one yet pending knowing the dimensions. Regards
Blowtorch
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wayne556517
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And at half the price i know which one i would buy.
Phantom Warrior
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Excellent photo comparison between the three manufacturers. Brian certainly did his research well on this model. Thank you for the size information. The width of a full size PZ III is 114 inches (2.895 Meters). The CS PZ III scale is 1/27.5. Almost the same scale as the Stug III. Perfect scale for K&C, CS and TG figures and some Figarti figures. Will not work with FL figures; but not a problem as the excellent FL PZ III is available in 1/30 scale. I find it very interesting that the K&C model falls in between the FL and CS models in size! Looks like K&C may be increasing scale size as CS has done to better match the larger figure size being produced. Realisticly their are now three Toy Soldier scales 1/32; the original British scale. 1/30 and 1/27 Scales where Toy Soldiers have evolved. 1/27 is close to the old European Toy Soldier scale of 70MM established by Lineol and Hausser. The current 1/27 (68MM) figures work well with the old Tin Toy vehicles and artillery and are far superior to the old composition figures of 1930-39. Thank you very much for the size data!
Regards