Honestly...is anybody really gonna stop? (4 Viewers)

[Njja]

I have been a loyal King & Country collector ever since I first walked into Gideon's shop in NYC. I liked the fact that they offered quality products at a reasonable price. I also liked the fact that many of their pieces actually retained and in many cases increased in value!

Sorry, I know several of you have no interest in the value of your collections. I on the other hand appreciate it when something I have purchased for enjoyment actually increases in value! It shall we say enhances the experience. It also make it a lot easier to deal with the occasional price increase that may come along as production costs rise.

I also did not care for the most recent turn of events, but Andy has always conducted himself as a gentleman and often things do not turn out quite as well as we would have liked them to.

I have been known to let the situation get the best of me on "Rare" occasion......... usually daily.

So to me loyality is earned over time, and not discarded lightly. I will continue to remain a loyal King & Country customer.

This is provided my Den doesn't fall through the living room ceiling anytime soon.

 

[PJDeluhery]

I will continue to remain a loyal King & Country customer. This is provided my Den doesn't fall through the living room ceiling anytime soon.

I actually had that happen! It can be repaired! No reason to stop collecting!

 

[arnhem44mad]

I read this post this morning and was not going to post but I have decided that I need to!

Toy soldiers is more than a hobby for me, it is a release, something that keeps me happy at sad times, an escape from the real world when times are tough, and it is also something which I base most of my imagination on and what I use as inspiration to do well!

King and Country is also more than a company to me, they are the creators of something which really makes me happy, gives me enjoyment. My mum used to tell people 'Collecting is what keeps him off the streets with his mates' and she was right, if not for the past 5 years of waiting for monthly K&C Dispatches, and saving up money to get items from Dispatches, I would have been out with my mates, spending money on getting drunk, fighting with people from other areas and all that kind of cr*p!

So if people are asking me if I am going to throw all of that away because of a rise in price of items which are getting more and more spectacularly detailed, sculpted and painted....

Then my answer is a 100% NO!

Andy even puts up with my constant pm's asking him to make certain arnhem sets and vehicles, and every so often gives me a hint about up coming sets which he thinks I will like, so to repay years of kindness, knowledge, and putting up with my constant posts, I will keep buying King and Country, as I hope many people will!

I think of 'boycotting K&C' like the recent riots by students in the conservative parliament building. They tried to make a point by breaking windows and demolishing property which Tax payers (something they will no doubt become) have to pay for, so in actual fact they just set themselves back by a couple of years.....if people stop buying King andCountry just to make a point, what will it do to the collectors who have the sense to keep buying and ingore the idea of 'boycotting', and what will it do to the actual people when they decide that it was a stupid idea all along and start buying again? The prices for figures, virtually just like the prices for student tax payers will go up!

Just my thoughts, sorry if they are deep, but they are honest.

Scott

 

[mikemiller1955]

I don't want anyone to misinterpret this thread or my last post as a bash on K&C products or an attempt to promote other companies...

K&C figures...I like them...I buy them and I will continue to buy them...

the thread was started because on previous threads a lot of people said they were finished with K&C after this week's announcements...I was just curious if anybody still really felt the same way about boycotting now that they have had time to digest and consider...

my second post was because I don't like to be openly "stifled" of "berated" for my questions...

that someone would PUBLICLY dismiss my question because it didn't interest him just irritated me...I really wanted some input from people on the replies that they might actually stop buying K&C over these recent issues and events...

while I don't agree with K&C's policies...the bottom line is I will continue to buy the product and understand it's not my business to make decisions with his business or policy...

I am a K&C buyer...and will continue to be one...I will not cut off my nose to spite my face...if you choose to boycott them for any reason...I'm curious to what extent and why...

I own...
King and Country Crusaders 1096-1204

1-MK01...Mounted Knight with Lance
1-MK02...Foot Knight with Sword and Shield
1-MK03...Foot Knight with Sword and Crucifix
1-MK04...Mounted Knight with Shield
1-MK05...Foot Soldier with Spear
1-MK06...Foot Soldier with Spear and Shield
1-MK07...Siege Tower
1-MK08...Mounted Knight with Flag
1-MK09...Standing Knight with Sword and Shield
1-MK10...Standing Knight with Flag and Shield
1-MK11...Fighting Knight with Shield
4-MK12...Crossbowman Loading
4-MK13...Crossbowman Firing
1-MK14...Fighting Knight with Axe and Shield
1-MK15...Charging Knight with Axe and Shield
1-MK16...Fighting Bishop
1-MK17...Horn Blower
1-MK18...Attacking Knight with Axe and Shield
1-MK19...Knight Drawing Sword
1-MK20...Man at Arm Fighting with Axe
1-MK21...Wounded Man at Arms
1-MK22...Man at arms with Sword and Shield
1-MK23...Knight Attacking with Axe
1-MK24...Mounted Knight with Axe
1-MK25...Catapult Set
1-MK26...Ladder Set
1-MK27...Mounted Saladin
1-MK28...Saladin’s Bodyguard
1-MK29...Saladin’s Bodyguard Soldier with Spear
1-MK30...Saracen Drawing Sword
4-MK31...Saracen Crossbow Ready
4-MK32...Saracen Crossbow Loading
1-MK33...Saracen Defending with Sword and Shield
1-MK34...Saracen Attacking
1-MK35...Saracen Attacking with Axe
1-MK36...Saracen Charging with Sword and Shield
1-MK37...Saracen Attacking with Sword and Shield
1-MK38...Saracen Defending with Sword and Axe
1-MK39...Saracen Flagbearer
1-MK40...Saracen Casualty
1-MK41...Wounded Saracen with Flag
4-MK42...Saracen Firing Crossbow
1-MK43...Mounted Saracen with Lance Down
1-MK44...Mounted Saracen with Lance Up
1-MK45...Mounted Saracen Lance Bearer
1-MK46...Knight with Axe
1-MK47...Man at Arms With Dagger
1-MK48...Mounted Crusader Attacking with Sword
1-MK49...Mounted Crusader Charging with Lance
1-MK50...Gruesome Trophy
1-MK51...Fight to the Death
1-MK52...The Bishop of Tours
1-MK53...Richard the Lionhearted
1-MK54...Sir Walter De La Mer
1-MK55...Robert of Abbotsinch
1-MK56...Duke Boris of Saxony
1-MK57...Sir Roger De Talkinghorn
1-MK58...Duel to the Death
1-MK59...Mounted Saracen Archer
1-MK60...Kneeling Saracen Archer
1-MK61...Loading Saracen Archer
1-MK62...Sir Arthur De Mountford
1-MK63...Wounded Templar Set
1-MK64...Standing Saracen Archer
1-MK65...Mounted Charging Saracen with Sword
1-MK66...Mounted Templar with Banner
1-MK67...Crusaders Archer Set
1-MK68...Fighting Priest with axe

K&C Napoleonics

1-NA125
1-NA126
3-NA128
6-NA129
3-NA130
3-NA131
1-NA132
3-NA133
3-NA134
3-NA135
3-NA136
1-NA184
1-NA186
1-NA187
1-NA188
1-NA189
1-NA190
1-NA191
2-NA193

I also own assorted K&C Indians from the BR series...

 

[6th Wisconsin]

I have stopped doing business with companies in the past on principle, but that was only when it was a very serious issue - for example, they cheated me personally or displayed offensive materials on their website. Am I happy K&C is raising its prices and doing it in this manner? - no. Am I happy with the general trend toward very high prices that is making it harder and harder to buy toy soldiers and still have money for travel, photography, and other things that are more important to me? - no. However, their decision to make this increase was a business decision. As a collector, and not a distributor, I simply don't like any of the high price trends, but that is not because I don't understand the reason but because I can afford the items less than before. It will not affect my purchases of K&C except that I can buy fewer items. There are so many companies producing high quality items right now, and I buy from many of them. I do think companies in general have to be worried about what high production costs and pricing are going to do to the future of the hobby though.

 

[arnhem44mad]

I don't want anyone to misinterpret this thread or my last post as a bash on K&C products or an attempt to promote other companies...

K&C figures...I like them...I buy them and I will continue to buy them...

the thread was started because on previous threads a lot of people said they were finished with K&C after this week's announcements...I was just curious if anybody still really felt the same way about boycotting now that they have had time to digest and consider...

my second post was because I don't like to be openly "stifled" of "berated" for my questions...

that someone would PUBLICLY dismiss my question because it didn't interest him just irritated me...I really wanted some input from people on the replies that they might actually stop buying K&C over these recent issues and events...

while I don't agree with K&C's policies...the bottom line is I will continue to buy the product and understand it's not my business to make decisions with his business or policy...

I am a K&C buyer...and will continue to be one...I will not cut off my nose to spite my face...if you choose to boycott them for any reason...I'm curious to what extent and why...

I own...
King and Country Crusaders 1096-1204

1-MK01...Mounted Knight with Lance
1-MK02...Foot Knight with Sword and Shield
1-MK03...Foot Knight with Sword and Crucifix
1-MK04...Mounted Knight with Shield
1-MK05...Foot Soldier with Spear
1-MK06...Foot Soldier with Spear and Shield
1-MK07...Siege Tower
1-MK08...Mounted Knight with Flag
1-MK09...Standing Knight with Sword and Shield
1-MK10...Standing Knight with Flag and Shield
1-MK11...Fighting Knight with Shield
4-MK12...Crossbowman Loading
4-MK13...Crossbowman Firing
1-MK14...Fighting Knight with Axe and Shield
1-MK15...Charging Knight with Axe and Shield
1-MK16...Fighting Bishop
1-MK17...Horn Blower
1-MK18...Attacking Knight with Axe and Shield
1-MK19...Knight Drawing Sword
1-MK20...Man at Arm Fighting with Axe
1-MK21...Wounded Man at Arms
1-MK22...Man at arms with Sword and Shield
1-MK23...Knight Attacking with Axe
1-MK24...Mounted Knight with Axe
1-MK25...Catapult Set
1-MK26...Ladder Set
1-MK27...Mounted Saladin
1-MK28...Saladin’s Bodyguard
1-MK29...Saladin’s Bodyguard Soldier with Spear
1-MK30...Saracen Drawing Sword
4-MK31...Saracen Crossbow Ready
4-MK32...Saracen Crossbow Loading
1-MK33...Saracen Defending with Sword and Shield
1-MK34...Saracen Attacking
1-MK35...Saracen Attacking with Axe
1-MK36...Saracen Charging with Sword and Shield
1-MK37...Saracen Attacking with Sword and Shield
1-MK38...Saracen Defending with Sword and Axe
1-MK39...Saracen Flagbearer
1-MK40...Saracen Casualty
1-MK41...Wounded Saracen with Flag
4-MK42...Saracen Firing Crossbow
1-MK43...Mounted Saracen with Lance Down
1-MK44...Mounted Saracen with Lance Up
1-MK45...Mounted Saracen Lance Bearer
1-MK46...Knight with Axe
1-MK47...Man at Arms With Dagger
1-MK48...Mounted Crusader Attacking with Sword
1-MK49...Mounted Crusader Charging with Lance
1-MK50...Gruesome Trophy
1-MK51...Fight to the Death
1-MK52...The Bishop of Tours
1-MK53...Richard the Lionhearted
1-MK54...Sir Walter De La Mer
1-MK55...Robert of Abbotsinch
1-MK56...Duke Boris of Saxony
1-MK57...Sir Roger De Talkinghorn
1-MK58...Duel to the Death
1-MK59...Mounted Saracen Archer
1-MK60...Kneeling Saracen Archer
1-MK61...Loading Saracen Archer
1-MK62...Sir Arthur De Mountford
1-MK63...Wounded Templar Set
1-MK64...Standing Saracen Archer
1-MK65...Mounted Charging Saracen with Sword
1-MK66...Mounted Templar with Banner
1-MK67...Crusaders Archer Set
1-MK68...Fighting Priest with axe

K&C Napoleonics

1-NA125
1-NA126
3-NA128
6-NA129
3-NA130
3-NA131
1-NA132
3-NA133
3-NA134
3-NA135
3-NA136
1-NA184
1-NA186
1-NA187
1-NA188
1-NA189
1-NA190
1-NA191
2-NA193

I also own assorted K&C Indians from the BR series...

Then the world is at piece!What are you getting next?

 

[MapleLeaf]

Way to go mikemiller
Same here, stop buying, ur kidding
what about if they make more RAF WAAF girls
nobody but KC makes them, i would be missing the boat
Love my ME-109 and Spit, waiting for the next one
When i'm with the RAF, nothing hurts and nothing is bad
STOP BUYING , ARE U KIDDING
Maple Leaf

 

[mikemiller1955]

Then the world is at piece!What are you getting next?

Anybody that knows me...knows that I'm mostly a JJD collector...but since you asked......I have 5 sets of Cold Stream Naps that should be coming any day now...as it was a retro price purchase in advance of price increase...

but after that...probably just new Crusaders...

I'm really anxious for this guy to make his appearance...he's gonna look good next to my castle...a "stone cold" warrior...

 

[Hartschier]

K&C's "retroactive price increase"..."dealer no discount" policy...or "loss of a dealership news" has really been run through the grinder this week...

seems everyone has posted an opinion...

lets hear some honest answers now...

Is anybody really going to stop buying K&C's products over this?

I have seen claims...I have seen promises...I have seen threats...

but is anybody really gonna boycott them over this...

I'll be honest...I'm not...

I have already ordered some sets to cash in before the retro price increase goes into effect...

I don't like it or agree with it...but I'm not quitting them...

Is anybody really gonna stop buying K&C products or even slow down on them over any of these issues...

I saw a lot of post of people saying..."enough is enough"...or..."the straw that broke the camels back"...

but is anybody serious...

Interesting thread Mike. Perhaps it be more easily answered by Andy or his favorites. I have enjoyed your honest posts...please do not start kissing...bu

 

[Iron Brigade]

K&C's "retroactive price increase"..."dealer no discount" policy...or "loss of a dealership news" has really been run through the grinder this week...

seems everyone has posted an opinion...

lets hear some honest answers now...

Is anybody really going to stop buying K&C's products over this?

I have seen claims...I have seen promises...I have seen threats...

but is anybody really gonna boycott them over this...

I'll be honest...I'm not...

I have already ordered some sets to cash in before the retro price increase goes into effect...

I don't like it or agree with it...but I'm not quitting them...

Is anybody really gonna stop buying K&C products or even slow down on them over any of these issues...

I saw a lot of post of people saying..."enough is enough"...or..."the straw that broke the camels back"...

but is anybody serious...

Dear "MikeMiller1955":
I'll be picking up a few new 2010 copywrite WW2 type K&C sets and some old 2003 copywrite Napoleonic sets in the next week or so at my local store. Still hope to get a few more new "in action" D-Day sets from K&C next year. I am glad that my collecting is at least largely completed. Certainly K&C price increases have more than kept up with inflation in the USA these last few years. I am sure that if I should have to do some serious downsizing in the future I will get more than what I paid for my K&C sets overall at least. I think that it is wise to buy K&C sets now before the price increase of 1/1/2011. You are only hurting your self by passing up the chance to buy before the 1/1/2011 price increase on pre 2009 K&C sets. Certainly other manufacturers since the 1990's have greatly increased thier prices as well.
"Iron Brigade"

 

[mikemiller1955]

Dear "MikeMiller1955":
I am sure that if I should have to do some serious downsizing in the future I will get more than what I paid for my K&C sets overall at least.

Gary...I like that theory...I have always found it comforting...that when I buy something...if I decide to downsize...I can recoup most...all...or more of my investment...I have always preferred "limited editions" and try to stick with purchases that lend to this...

 

[arnhem44mad]

Anybody that knows me...knows that I'm mostly a JJD collector...but since you asked......I have 5 sets of Cold Stream Naps that should be coming any day now...as it was a retro price purchase in advance of price increase...

but after that...probably just new Crusaders...

I'm really anxious for this guy to make his appearance...he's gonna look good next to my castle...a "stone cold" warrior...

nice, I am curious aout this figure!

 

[Vezzolf]

Answer: YES... Honestly, I will be buying much less K/C....The most disturbing factor and deciding factor for me in all of this is the "public" heavy handed, almost arrogant approach in which the "offending" dealers (offerring a modest "Show Discount") was handled....Add to the Mix....Retro-price increases on "shelved" products...and.....K/C "retired" price inflation;a K/C ploy to create "percieved" value.....it's simply manipulation....These are some of the reasons I have been purchasing much less K/C....There are other manufacturers out there today......K/C no longer has a captive audience.

 

[Phantom Warrior]

Answer: YES... Honestly, I will be buying much less K/C....The most disturbing factor and deciding factor for me in all of this is the "public" heavy handed, almost arrogant approach in which the "offending" dealers (offerring a modest "Show Discount") was handled....Add to the Mix....Retro-price increases on "shelved" products...and.....K/C "retired" price inflation;a K/C ploy to create "percieved" value.....it's simply manipulation....These are some of the reasons I have been purchasing much less K/C....There are other manufacturers out there today......K/C no longer has a captive audience.

K&C never did have a captive audience. For the past several years there was Britain's, Minichamps, Dragon, FOV, Corgi, Honour Bound, Dinky, 21st Century and New Model Army and several others. Some of them have fallen by the wayside and been replaced by Figarti, Thomas Gunn, John Jenkins, Collector's Showcase and FL. There has always been choice. And there is the choice to just not buy if you don't like the company - toy soldiers are not a necessity.

I buy (or not) based on selection, quality and price. Politics and manufacturer's personality or business decisions don't enter into it. Especially when there are conflicting reports of what went on and differing opinions about what was right or wrong.

Terry

 

[marco55]

I don't collect any K&C.Not because I don't like them but because the ranges they offer don't appeal to me.I did collect the Crusades range for a while and they were very nice.If they come out with a range I'm interested in I would buy them as everybody's prices are close.They average $29-$35 so for $6 more a figure so I'm gonna get something I really want.I've cut down overall but still try to get at least one set every month.
Mark

 

[nmrocks]

Real men don't whine...especially about toys. This 2 week "Dialogue" is better suited for "the View".

 

[PJDeluhery]

Real men don't whine...especially about toys. This 2 week "Dialogue" is better suited for "the View".

Amen!

I'll continue to buy what I can afford and what I enjoy - which definitely includes K&C, J Jenkins and a few Russian manufacturers. We're supposed to be having fun, here.

 

[MCKENNA77]

No being practical I'm not really going to stop. What I'm curious about is when will the toy soldier market stabilize. When will there be a year with out a price increase? The prices from 2005 versus now is roughly a 57% increase. On this current pace, a single figure will cost around $52 in 2015. Yes currently I'm going to do what most people are doing and thats slow down my collection pace. Yet, if prices go to $52 a figure that slow down pace will become a halt. I'm not sure anyone could actually know or predict when the market will stabilize. I do hope that this current price increase of old stock isnt a troubling sign for K&C as a company. Drastic action or measures by K&C for the time that I have been collecting have been non-existent. The other part of me wonders why they didnt just retire the majority of the old stock. The dudes I really feel sorry for are the big Alamo collectors. Having available figures go from $19 to $33 overnight cant be very much fun. Hopefully K&C as a company is working on the stabilization of production means and methods in regards to long term market price. Well here is to hoping.

Keep it silly.

 

[Vezzolf]

For the past several years there was Britain's, Minichamps, Dragon, FOV, Corgi, Honour Bound, Dinky, 21st Century and New Model Army and several others. Some of them have fallen by the wayside and been replaced by Figarti, Thomas Gunn, John Jenkins, Collector's Showcase and FL.


Terry

The manufacturers of past years did not create serious competition to K/C products with the exception of Honour Bound.....Newer Manufacturers such as Thomas Gunn, John Jenkins, Collector's Showcase and of course Figarti and First Legion are different animals....Figarti and First Legion especially have been producing products on a par or better then K/C....Thus K/C is no longer in a class of it's own....They no longer have a captive audience and lately have presented themselves in a less then diplomatic manner.....Frank

 

[Rob]

I'm sorry guys but I agree with Mikes sentiments at the start of this thread. Theres no way I would give up collecting my favourite product, whilst I do honestly feel for the guys who are no longer dealers there is always two sides to every story. I love this hobby and to give it up over this would not only be pointless but also melodramatic.

Rob