How Toy Soldiers saved the world! (1 Viewer)

[Jack]

I am reading an article entitled 'Modelling for War? Toy Soldiers in Late Victorian and Edwardian Britain' and came across this passage-

...it was the prevalence of militarism in Europe rather than alliances and assassinations which was ultimately responsible for the outbreak of the First World War...it is certainly difficult to see how, in the absence of just such a deeply held engrained militarism, Britain was able to sustain its armed forces on a voluntary basis for well over a year of the most demanding war in its history'.

The author then links the 'toy soldier craze' in England prior to 1914 (Britains alone was turning out 200 000 figures a week in 1910) to the preparedness of the Brits to go to war in 1914 and once there, stay there!

Could toy soldiers, therefore, have helped win a 'real' war?

 

[Mitch]

No would be my answer.
Mitch

 

[larso]

"Could toy soldiers, therefore, have helped win a 'real' war?"

Great post. I think buying and playing with toy soldiers illustrated a general enthusiasm for the British army by it's public. I've read that for a long time, British boys knew all the regiments that fought at Balaklava, the same as modern boys know the players in their favourite sports team. Winning most of their battles probably helped. The literature of the time, like Kipling's framed it all in a fairly exciting manner too. Sooooo.... I think it's fair to say that British men of the time were conditioned to value their army and playing war as kids was part of this.

 

[Jack]

"Could toy soldiers, therefore, have helped win a 'real' war?"

Interestingly, most of Britains output was in the form of opposing armies and their catalogue between 1895 and 1914 was a roll call of contemporary conflicts, hence their production of Spanish and American infantry, Boers, Turkish, Greek, Montenegrin, Serbian and Bulgarian armies. Of particular note was that during this period they never produced German soldiers.

 

[waynepoo]

They may have saved me from cancer, alcoholism and S.T.D's as I have given up smoking, drinking and sex to afford them.^&grin
Poo.

 

[Jack]

They may have saved me from cancer, alcoholism and S.T.D's as I have given up smoking, drinking and sex to afford them.^&grin
Poo.

I don't want to embarrass you Wayne my friend, but your thread would seem to indicate that you were paying money for all three vices!

 

[Scott]

I don't want to embarrass you Wayne my friend, but your thread would seem to indicate that you were paying money for all three vices!

"..and like a fool he squandered the rest."

 

[waynepoo]

I don't want to embarrass you Wayne my friend, but your thread would seem to indicate that you were paying money for all three vices!

Honestly Jack , money better spent on T/S than smokes! Cheaper these days.
Poo.

 

[waynepoo]

"..and like a fool he squandered the rest."

Scott,
Swaped one addiction for another, all be it a healthier one.{sm4}
Cheers.
Poo.

 

[larso]

"..and like a fool he squandered the rest."

Brilliant!

 

[Currahee Chris]

I can appreciate the enthusiasm the children of the time might have had for their toy soldiers but I find it nearly impossible to believe that toy soldiers could have lead to victory- did BEF generals play toy soldiers in 1910? Massed cavalry charges and fluid open battlefields seem to be the norm prior to the restrictive trench warfare that eventually evolved.

 

[Jack]

I can appreciate the enthusiasm the children of the time might have had for their toy soldiers but I find it nearly impossible to believe that toy soldiers could have lead to victory- did BEF generals play toy soldiers in 1910? Massed cavalry charges and fluid open battlefields seem to be the norm prior to the restrictive trench warfare that eventually evolved.

Valid point - easy to overstate the influence of one factor, but perhaps there was some link - the Volunteer regiments for the adult male, the youth movement for the adolescent and the toy soldier for the younger boy. The playing fields of Eton were often trumpeted as a contributor to English victories, when many more thousands of children were exposed to toy soldiers than that one school.

There were also many powerful figures who not only collected but played with toy soldiers, and sometimes not just as children - Churchill, HG Wells, Charles de Gaulle, Duff Cooper amongst them. Churchill even wrote that 'the toy soldiers turned the current of my life.'

By 1914 the output of toy soldiers was 10 or 11 million - imagine how cheap the figures would be today with that output! Regardless, one must admit that trench warfare played out by toy soldiers would be a rather tedious game!

Thanks for replying!

 

[Scott]

Right on the eve of the Great War you have "Little Wars". H.G. Wells claimed that a few military friends joined in the game.

 

[Currahee Chris]

I am reading an article entitled 'Modelling for War? Toy Soldiers in Late Victorian and Edwardian Britain' and came across this passage-

...it was the prevalence of militarism in Europe rather than alliances and assassinations which was ultimately responsible for the outbreak of the First World War...it is certainly difficult to see how, in the absence of just such a deeply held engrained militarism, Britain was able to sustain its armed forces on a voluntary basis for well over a year of the most demanding war in its history'.

The author then links the 'toy soldier craze' in England prior to 1914 (Britains alone was turning out 200 000 figures a week in 1910) to the preparedness of the Brits to go to war in 1914 and once there, stay there!

Could toy soldiers, therefore, have helped win a 'real' war?

I didn't mean to "gloss" over the numbers (sorry for the Toy Soldier pun there {sm4}) but this is a pretty staggering quote- the 200,000 figures a week- must have been pretty amazing to see what the hobby was like back then- figure at 200,000 figures a week/ that is 20 figures rolling off the production like each minute- 24/7. Mind sharing the article or link if possible?

 

[UKReb]

In his popular book on toy soldiers, Andrew Rose mentions the production of 150 castings per hour from a single hand mould as being possible for a skilled worker. The castings then were painted either in the factory or by at-home pieceworkers. There were 300 employees before the Great War. I've never seen factory records quoted as to numbers of figures produced. Maybe the answer's in Opie's Great Book of Britains? [Re later production: Wallis' Regiments of All Nations gives a quantity of 20 million pieces a year by 1931- but that includes flowers for their Garden Series and wee piglets for the Home Farm series, both series inspired by the inter-war disinterest in (disgust with?) militaria.]

It's also worth remembering that the first hollow lead soldiers were primarily a "rich kids" toy. Britain's realising this prompted them to introduce the W Series sold exclusively through Woolworth a few years before WWI which were deliberately marketed for poorer families.

But Mike raises a relevant point that by the early 1920's sales of all toy soldiers plummeted due to the enormous anti-war feeling that permeated the world market. W Britain were quicker to react than other manufacturers and only survived this downturn by introducing a new range of toy minatures such as farms; animals; zoos etc.

 

[trooper]

I can appreciate the enthusiasm the children of the time might have had for their toy soldiers but I find it nearly impossible to believe that toy soldiers could have lead to victory- did BEF generals play toy soldiers in 1910? Massed cavalry charges and fluid open battlefields seem to be the norm prior to the restrictive trench warfare that eventually evolved.

You may be interested to know that at the time of Frederick the Great blocks of wood with soldiers painted on the sides were routinely used to teach young officers the art of troop movements in battle. In more modern days I have seen photographs of a large display showing the Trooping with a sergeant explaining the various sequences to the troops. Also of course there are the sand table exercises doing exactly the same as the aforementioned F the G. So it is possible that toy soldiers played some part in the military successes. Trooper

 

[Currahee Chris]

Interesting discussion one and all. I have often wondered if toy soldiers in the Victorian era influenced young British men towards military service. I certainly believe it did- I believe they could be indirectly atributed to victory as a teaching aide but no so sure about a direct influence. I am always really intrigued by this time period of the hobby- 1895- 1920's as to me that was really the golden period of the hobby. Without a doubt they are very useful for being visual aides- Trooper- I believe there is a scene in Braveheart where the Plantagenets use some mocked up wooden toy soldiers to simulate a battle plan- probably akin to your Frederick the Great example. I give a couple presentations each year at the local high school Latin honors class discussing the Imperial Roman Army, Alesia and Phillipi and use the toy soldiers I have for Rome because it aides in discussion.

it is interesting to hear where they turn up- those Chinese terra cotta troops are amazing.

 

[Jack]

I didn't mean to "gloss" over the numbers (sorry for the Toy Soldier pun there {sm4}) but this is a pretty staggering quote- the 200,000 figures a week- must have been pretty amazing to see what the hobby was like back then- figure at 200,000 figures a week/ that is 20 figures rolling off the production like each minute- 24/7. Mind sharing the article or link if possible?

No worries - PM with an email address and I will forward the article.

 

[Northgate Woods]

You may be interested to know that at the time of Frederick the Great blocks of wood with soldiers painted on the sides were routinely used to teach young officers the art of troop movements in battle. In more modern days I have seen photographs of a large display showing the Trooping with a sergeant explaining the various sequences to the troops. Also of course there are the sand table exercises doing exactly the same as the aforementioned F the G. So it is possible that toy soldiers played some part in the military successes. Trooper

Trooper mate,
Good point you raised. I remember many moons ago when I was an Armoured Instructor to the Officer Cadets at Monash University Regiment (a Reserve Unit) that I used a huge sand box with 1/72 scale Centurion Tanks and M113s and blocks of same scale infantry to teach Armoured tactics and Infantry/Armour fire and movement.
Cheers Howard

 

[Mitch]

Monash... I have heard this many times in the last few days!!!!!!!
Mitch