Just as competition closes in.... (1 Viewer)

Rob

Four Star General
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May 18, 2005
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K&C up the bar.The quality of both the figures and Tanks is wonderful.How lucky are we to be collecting right now?!.I got to say chaps i'm one happy collector right now,can't remember a better dispatches.

Was wondering if any of you guys will be collecting WW1 now as i will be ?.

Rob
 
Well, I have all of the first issue but am planning to skip over the Germans and will try to pick up as many as I can of the British. There are probably some good Xmas presents in there but then there are good Xmas presents in BoB, Market Garden and FoB:D
 
I must start my WW1 collection soon,don't want to get too far behind.Also that Tiger is going to look great next to the Desert Stug.;)

Rob
 
In the absence of new NAPs or even AWI .... my interest in WW1 is stirred by the new releases.

Sizewise, does the WW1 series lean towards the 1/32 ... or towards 1/30?

Any pics will be appreciated.

OD
 
Awesome dispatches i agree, but i really think that we need german tank for BoB. As for the WWI, i do really like them, but there are so many things that i want to get before them, so they will probably not show up in my shelves except for the Christmas truce.

Any one else pre-order there Tunisian tiger yet?
 
The problem I am having ,is K/C now producing stuff, just to mimmic and upstage the competition, when NMA.HB, or Figarti ,produce or advertise to produce a given vehicle? This is becoming suspicious, as of late, K/C makes duplicate pieces, that are already out ( LRDG truck-jeep vs Figarti ) (Desert Tiger vs NMA ). In fact, there seems to be one upmanship going on, as Andy has to know, his adoring fans will choose his stuff over any others.....How many different Tigers,etc. do we need? There has been a been a major trade secrets suit going on in the toy train world ( MTH vs Lionel ) because the same Chinese factories make the different mfg. products and were passing on production secrets and schedules to the competing mfg. Not saying this is happening, but it is amazing how Andy can read the minds of HB, NMA, and Figarti, when it comes to stunting their potential sale growth...of a given item.....Michael
 
The problem I am having ,is K/C now producing stuff, just to mimmic and upstage the competition, when NMA.HB, or Figarti ,produce or advertise to produce a given vehicle? This is becoming suspicious, as of late, K/C makes duplicate pieces, that are already out ( LRDG truck-jeep vs Figarti ) (Desert Tiger vs NMA ). In fact, there seems to be one upmanship going on, as Andy has to know, his adoring fans will choose his stuff over any others.....How many different Tigers,etc. do we need? There has been a been a major trade secrets suit going on in the toy train world ( MTH vs Lionel ) because the same Chinese factories make the different mfg. products and were passing on production secrets and schedules to the competing mfg. Not saying this is happening, but it is amazing how Andy can read the minds of HB, NMA, and Figarti, when it comes to stunting their potential sale growth...of a given item.....Michael

So if andy cant produce a anything that any one else makes:confused: For one im glad he is producing the Desert tiger and the lrdg truck because his are BETTER than the competition. Lets not forget that he is doing a WWI line and that new M5 hes not a copy cat but a business man. He knows that these items will do well. And to him it doesnt matter if someone else is producing it because he know we will buy it because chances are that it will be BETTER.
 
The problem I am having ,is K/C now producing stuff, just to mimmic and upstage the competition, when NMA.HB, or Figarti ,produce or advertise to produce a given vehicle? This is becoming suspicious, as of late, K/C makes duplicate pieces, that are already out ( LRDG truck-jeep vs Figarti ) (Desert Tiger vs NMA ). In fact, there seems to be one upmanship going on, as Andy has to know, his adoring fans will choose his stuff over any others.....How many different Tigers,etc. do we need? There has been a been a major trade secrets suit going on in the toy train world ( MTH vs Lionel ) because the same Chinese factories make the different mfg. products and were passing on production secrets and schedules to the competing mfg. Not saying this is happening, but it is amazing how Andy can read the minds of HB, NMA, and Figarti, when it comes to stunting their potential sale growth...of a given item.....Michael

Michael,

I can't speak to the other items, but I can tell you that the LRDG truck was in the works way before Figarti announced theirs, as Andy asked me to help obtain necessary research material at the Symposium in March - it just took until September to come into production.
 
With respect to the Tunisian Tiger, this is something that people have been asking for awhile, myself included, and I believe Combat started a poll that included it. Andy is not stupid and he reads the Forum. However, this is not soemthing that can be turned out overnight so it had to be in the works for months, probably long before the others conceived it. And even if they had, so what?

Being competitive means being the first out of the box with something. There have been situations in the consumer world where two companies were working on the same product but one got it out to market first and became the market leader and the other fell by the wayside. Being first is important and if you can get it out first, you're likely to reap the rewards. That's just the reality.
 
Michael,

I can't speak to the other items, but I can tell you that the LRDG truck was in the works way before Figarti announced theirs, as Andy asked me to help obtain necessary research material at the Symposium in March - it just took until September to come into production.
Actually, as alluded to by Rick during the Lunch with Figarti at the Chicago Show, both Figarti and K&C independently decided to do a LRDG in early March. Rick asked me to get the same research material during the West Coaster that Andy asked Louis for, and we bidded against each other on eBay trying to get it.:D
 
Actually, as alluded to by Rick during the Lunch with Figarti at the Chicago Show, both Figarti and K&C independently decided to do a LRDG in early March. Rick asked me to get the same research material during the West Coaster that Andy asked Louis for, and we bidded against each other on eBay trying to get it.:D

who won?
 
Here is what Rick posted on CTSC, last 26 september:


The LRDG story, (...) the REAL story.

Both K&C and ourselves listen to collectors on what products to make, it now seems that both companies heard the same suggestions and decided to make it. The problem was finding the information and necessary resources to actually make the truck. So as natural as logic would take it, we shopped on ebay for a retired model kit of the LRDG. The LRDG is a difficult model to find, but lucky for both companies, there were a couple on the market and the bidding began. Collectors on both side were bidding on our behalf and to make the long story short, we both got one without knowing the other had it. Well, K&C beat us to the punch because they announced it 2 weeks before we wanted to. The decision was then whether or not we should put ours out and since it was already in production and done in a very different way, I decided why not. (...) So we did not copy the King, we simply touched on the same subject the same time and was not first to market. But our LRDG is very different, (...).

Pierre.
 
Re: “Who’s the mimic?”

Hi Guys,

Re the last post of “Maddadicus” about K&C trying to mimic and upstage the competition… I always like it when someone posts a fairly controversial assertion and then, near the end, says as a kind of back-handed rebuttal “Not saying this is happening but it is amazing how Andy can read the minds of HB, NMA and Figarti, when it comes to stunting their potential sales growth…

Well, just for the record, whatever few talents God gave Andy at birth the talent to read other people’s minds was not one of them!

Another factor not taken into account by Mr. “M” is that, occasionally, two or more people can come up with similar ideas at the same time. Especially if they read this Forum on a regular (daily basis) as I’m sure NMA… HB… Figarti… and K&C do.

Also, as regards to 'stunting other companies’ potential sales growth…” Really, “Maddadicus” you give me far too much credit if you think me or K&C can stunt other companies’ growth… they’re perfectly capable (in a few cases) of doing that all by themselves…

Finally, ask yourself this: which company first grew and developed the whole 1:30 scale market in figures and fighting vehicles? Was it NMA… HB… Figarti…? Now, if you can guess the correct answer (and it’s not too difficult) then you’ll know exactly who is trying to mimic and upstage who.

Best wishes and happy collecting!

Andy C.
 
I've been following this thread quite closely.
Must say that some of the more controversial posts have provided some hilareous entertainment.
:D:D:D:D:rolleyes:

Cheers
H
 
Andy.... don't get your feathers in a ruffle, both this and the Warbirds threads are all in good fun, Though I got to say, you may be stepping on your own tail when you talk about 1/30th scale, there's been some pretty intense conversations about K&C's drift away the that core value.
Ray
 
To continue with tonight’s entertainment, I gladly provide the following rambling thoughts…

The perception of who is copying who is largely influenced by who announces their products first... it is a fact that both NMA and Honor Bound announced they were doing Tunisian Tigers first... did K&C have theirs in the planning stages before either of them? Unlikely, but certainly possible....

It seems that if one claims K&C is really the market leader "upping the bar" over the competition, then the originality of the new releases should be part of the equation, even if the perception they are copying is entirely unfounded. Otherwise the question becomes: “who really is leading who here?”

Those in the 1/6th scale hobby have seen back-and-forth competition play out to eye-rolling effect, to the point where it has hindered the hobby. Every time a new competitor shows up on the scene, the market leader, Dragon Models, will frequently copy their creative new releases point for point. Because of this, many other interesting products that would otherwise have occupied Dragon's release schedule are shoved on the back burner because they are too paranoid about competitors to chart their own course. Once the challenger is squashed, and the threat of innovation in the hobby removed, the market leader returns to releasing the same-old, same-old. Thankfully Dragon now has serious competition in DiD to keep them on their toes.

I don’t know if anything like that is occurring here, yet. A tiger is hardly an innovative release anymore, no matter who announces theirs first or last. But I hope one manufacturer copying the other, "me-too" style, will not become a trend in this hobby in the future. The diversity of releases is what keeps it so interesting.

For one im glad he is producing the Desert tiger and the lrdg truck because his are BETTER than the competition. Lets not forget that he is doing a WWI line

I think all 3 tigers will have their merits. NMA’s desert tiger will have an advantage over K&C’s one in terms of price. Similarly, HB's Tunisian tiger has the potential to be superior to K&C's efforts in terms of quality and customizability, though not price. The K&C one represents a balance between the two with probably the best figures.

But another advantage of HB's version is that it will likely be far more “limited” than 1250. :rolleyes: Frankly I'm never one to get too excited over edition sizes because I collect for the pleasure of owning and displaying pieces, not selling them on ebay. However, if you're going to advertise your product as some kind of limited edition and charge a higher price accordingly, 1250 pieces seems a bit laughably high. Compare this to Figarti's new releases which truly are limited at 100 sets each. I'm not saying that is an advisable production number to follow (seems too low), but it's undeniably limited.

As for K&C's WW1 line, I have high hopes for this line, but so far I continue to be less than impressed. I wish K&C would get the guy who just sculpted their fantastic new Bulge Americans to take over this line and start injecting some much-needed dynamism and life into it. I think Britains retains the advantage in the WW1 field. Either way, this represents another me-too competition going on (not sure who’s leading and who’s following). Both manufacturers are concurrently doing very similar early war WW1 in incompatible scales when one or the other's resources might be better occupied with different subject matter.
 
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The problem I am having ,is K/C now producing stuff, just to mimmic and upstage the competition, when NMA.HB, or Figarti ,produce or advertise to produce a given vehicle? This is becoming suspicious, as of late, K/C makes duplicate pieces, that are already out ( LRDG truck-jeep vs Figarti ) (Desert Tiger vs NMA ). In fact, there seems to be one upmanship going on, as Andy has to know, his adoring fans will choose his stuff over any others.....How many different Tigers,etc. do we need? There has been a been a major trade secrets suit going on in the toy train world ( MTH vs Lionel ) because the same Chinese factories make the different mfg. products and were passing on production secrets and schedules to the competing mfg. Not saying this is happening, but it is amazing how Andy can read the minds of HB, NMA, and Figarti, when it comes to stunting their potential sale growth...of a given item.....Michael

Hi Maddi, or is that Mr "M" ;) I've been thinking along the same lines recently but it seems all's fair in love & war and models. However I do think it's a matter of great minds thinking alike rather than direct copy catting as it takes at least six months to get a model into production.

Btw, if Maddadicus is now Mr "M", will the King of King & Country be the BIG "A" from here on ;) :D
 
Brad,how about a poll type thing so we can see just how many people on here will be buying the Tunisian big cat.Would interesting to see what percentage of the total sales comes from the forum.

Rob
 

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