K&C Goes Plastic or…“It’s a long way from Renfrew to the Alamo!” (1 Viewer)

[Mitch]

I literally just had an e-mail about kits from FL who are supposedly releasing metal kits in 54mm which would be interesting. For the record I am not against plastic just have lots of questions about them and want to see detail and cost as painting price can't differ from plastic to metal so, I would presume if plastic is a real cheap alternative to metal then most of the price must be for painting?

That is one of the reasons why when you do something like this it would just be better to announce it fully than allow a couple of months of this type of thing to go on and expect nobody to discuss it.

We just need metal kits in 1/30th to be released which would be excellent


Mitch Thank you for that...what I love about this forum is the fact you will always have views for both side's of an idea...discussion......there is always something to learn from both views......the TS manufacturers have a great source here for ..likes...dislikes....idea.s ...etc.....it is a great forum for everyone to have a say and air idea,s etc...regards TomB[/QUOTE]

 

[binder001]

The idea of using resin is VERY interesting. I build (or actually buy and start building) 1/35th WW2 models as well as 1/32nd scale and 1/30th K&C scale. I have bought quite a few GIs from many manufacturers, including resin, styrene, metal, etc. The use of resin has all but eliminated metal figures from the 1/35th market.

I was curious about Peter's comment about needing a larger production run of resin versus metals. A LOT of resin figures were/are made by small companies or "basement modelers". The process that I have had explained to me is actually more conducive to small runs.

I don't think that we will see "cheap" K&C figures, just because the media is resin versus metal. MOST collectors on this forum buy fully assembled and painted figures/tanks/accessories. That means that a figure must still be assembled and then painted to match the metal K&C figures. After you pay for the finishing of the figure, your cost savings has basically evaporated, so don't get too excited! For example, one could buy figures from Old Northwest Trading Company, OR you could buy a number of the poses as unpainted kits from Valiant (later they were boxed under ONTC). Kit figures ran about $6 to $9 versus the painted ones in sets. I would be interested to know how many "kit" figures were sold versus the painted ones in sets. Andy has worked hard to build a certain "cachet" about K&C figures, so I don't see him putting out too many "economy" figures unless business really warrants it. That's why for many years American economy cars said "Chevrolet" not "Cadillac". There was even a discussion once about being able to buy the "raw" unpainted figures from K&C for those of us who can paint our own. That didn't go very far, either.

Yes, I wish that K&C applied their talents to plastics/resins, but I don't think that we will see "cheap" WW2 figures for quite a while (if ever). Besides, WW2 scenes don't need the massed firing lines of soldiers such as Naps or ACW. I like K&C because of the individuality the figures bring to a scene.


Gary B.

 

[trooper]

There are certain problems concerning resin figure production. Delicate items such as rifle slings and bayonets are quite difficult to cast and result in a heavy failure rate, an unfortunate fact as the failed parts cannot be recycled, and so these parts are best made in white metal. Also some people seem to be under the impression that plastic and resin are much the same thing, they are a world apart and require totaly different production methods.It will be interesting to see the outcome of this venture. Trooper

 

[Cyber Field Marshall]

Binder001 and many others make some very valid points. I find it difficult to meaningfully comment on something that doesn't exist yet however here it goes. My K&C collection I view as art that is collectible and therefore by definition should have future value (hopefully increasing but not always). Plastic ventures into the world I would call toys and becomes a commodity. That type of toy commodity especially put out in large numbers irrespective of the quality means little to no future value. I can't imagine K&C would reinvent itself to go down that road, too many lost customers.
For those of you who collect the pre world war eras, make dioramas, perhaps paint your own figures, need multiples for marching, firing lines etc this new venture makes a lot of sense. For the rest of us not in that category I really think this new venture is just another option that won't affect metal collectors or K&C mainstream manufacturing. I"m not even convinced the plastic toys would be significantly cheaper given the painting requirement to blend into existing K&C stock.
I'm reminded of the R.E.M. song, " It's the end of the world as we know it...and I feel fine". It appears that many collectors think this is indeed the "end of the world" but I doubt it and I feel fine about the future of metal collectibles especially for us WWII types.

 

[Denver]

I enjoy assembling, converting and painting figures.

My questions are, how Fragile is their Resin and
what do they Cost ?

 

[marco55]

If remember correctly Conte said it actually costs more to do plastic figures and that he had to know how many would buy his playsets to make sure it was worthwhile to do them.
Mark

 

[Flyboy]

What a great story for a great display. Love the title Renfrew to Alamo. Hence my last name. What will be next on the plastic release after Alamo? Mike

 

[HistoryfortheAges]

There are other costs to consider when you have "metal" versus "resin/plastic" production and one of those costs is shipping. I imagine K&C will realize a significant reduction in shipping costs to customers around the world with lighter weight materials. Also, there may be a reduction in breakage of figures and accessories. The reduction in these 2 costs alone could make it worthwhile to go "resin/plastic" if it doesn't take away from the existing quality/style that K&C produces. It's a response to the current and future economic environment that we find ourselves in and it makes sense. I think it's worth seeing. I would think that they will keep producing their flagship WW2 range in metal at least for the foreseeable future interspersed with a sampling of their new resin/plastic figures.

 

[Rob]

Binder001 and many others make some very valid points. I find it difficult to meaningfully comment on something that doesn't exist yet however here it goes. My K&C collection I view as art that is collectible and therefore by definition should have future value (hopefully increasing but not always). Plastic ventures into the world I would call toys and becomes a commodity. That type of toy commodity especially put out in large numbers irrespective of the quality means little to no future value. I can't imagine K&C would reinvent itself to go down that road, too many lost customers.
For those of you who collect the pre world war eras, make dioramas, perhaps paint your own figures, need multiples for marching, firing lines etc this new venture makes a lot of sense. For the rest of us not in that category I really think this new venture is just another option that won't affect metal collectors or K&C mainstream manufacturing. I"m not even convinced the plastic toys would be significantly cheaper given the painting requirement to blend into existing K&C stock.
I'm reminded of the R.E.M. song, " It's the end of the world as we know it...and I feel fine". It appears that many collectors think this is indeed the "end of the world" but I doubt it and I feel fine about the future of metal collectibles especially for us WWII types.

Hey CFM. I certainly agree re it not being the end of the world as collectors know it . There is no suggestion that K&C will stop making metal figures for WW2. I think LAH might be a big WW2 resin subject but as I don't collect that range it won't affect my collection. The only range that may tempt me might be ACW. Otherwise for me hopefully it will be business as usual.
Rob

 

[graycap]

Well, its only about seven weeks to go before the London Toy Soldier Show on 7th December. Andy usually attends the pre-Christmas show and perhaps he may be able to bring some of these new resin figures with him so that visitors can actually assess their quality and compare them with the existing metal figures. I'm sure that those members of this forum who regularly attend the London events will happily seize this opportunity to discuss them with Andy and no doubt express their opinions to him on King & Country's new project.