king and country plastic??? (2 Viewers)

here here fubar. I've heard many people talk about the 'greying' of the hobby and I think one of the main reasons is because of the prohibitive cost. (not knocking anyone agewise, just repeating things ive heard). As a college student, I have a lot of other costs to take care of. Personally, I ended up upgrading from 1:18 21st century stuff, to FOV, to KC in the course of a summer and sold everything other than KC because I decided to just collect the best, but it does irk me that I have trouble keeping up (and I only collect german/russian ww2!!). While I make due scrounging for a couple sets when possible, I completely agree with the idea of getting people hooked with plastic. I was hooked that way too, just through a different plastic path, so to speak.

Bill
 
Hi,I dont see a problem with k and c doing a line of plastics,[it wolud seem to me to be a great way to start a bit of brand loyalty]
The reason i started collecting britains was because i had played with their deetail line as a kid [so until recently tended to stay with britains]
My own son only gives the soldiers i have on display a cursory glance,
but if i give him some to play with [my old deetail stuff] him and his mates happily muck around for ages.I,m sure if they get to an age where they collect, the brands they played with as kids will be their starting point
 
Well, since Andy put the word "no" out, there seems to be little point debating it now. How unfortunate.

There are a number of considerations and compromises that would have to be made if Andy were to go into production anyway. I mean, just imagine the tooling that would have to be made. Adding to that, plastic and metal have so many differences in what the end result would turn out to be.

I remember the early days of Britians and Conte - Richard Walker and Ken Osen came into my store and showed me some of the masters they were working on for the plastics.

When the final product was released, there were many differences because the material was not able to be used exactly the way the needed.

To sum up, it would be a tremondous undertaking. I still see much value in it. Imagine what it would be like to have releases in both metal and plastic of this stuff. Ughhhhh, the possibilities. I could just imagine all the kids coming in here - finally able to afford something with the name "King & Country" on the box.
 
After having gone out on a limb and said no way, after reading Vandilay's and Gideon's posts, I actually see the merit in the possibility. It would be a great way to introduce kids to soldiers and to K & C until they're ready to graduate to something better and if they had played with K & C plastic, what brand of lead soldiers do you think they would buy?
 
Being a parent of three and grandfather to five, and a kid myself, I would offer the following observation about getting children into this hobby/passion of ours. The plastic soldiers would have to have some kind of electronics manufactured into them that would enable them (the kids) to play with friends at a distance through the net. Kids today are not of the same thought patterns, attention spans or exposures to events such as we were as a younger child. There were only three networks on tv, not hundreds on cable or satellite. The computer has taken the place of the old style television watching. More interactive play is required to keep them paying attention. Perhaps some kind of plastic soldiers with chips in them that could be part of a game or simulation that the child could play with when no one is on line or as a participant when they find someone on line to play with. Something to bring the hobby into the present and yet keep the simple pleasure of lining up and knocking down armies.:)
 
Boy !~i wish i had gotten this response when i first posted this:D . Sceic2 may be right about todays kids, you may need remote control soldiers to get their attention:confused: but if their were toy soldiers in the stores (WAL MART TARGET TOYs-r-US ect. ect.) stores kids would be found in,(as i,m sure theres not many toy soldier shops thare parents will stop at) with some Quality soldiers not the dollar store bag of g.i.,s boxed with art work of the figures like the old airfix match box ect. ect and good history movies out to spark intrest(battle of the buldge,waterloo.alamo,ect.ect.) i think we would see kids starting to regain intrest. I think thats how most of us got into it. I remember as a kid seeing all the MARX playsets, the KING of plastic at the time. Even as a kid my intrest was into the better sculpting of marx over the bagged figures. With me it was always the more realistic the figures the more i liked it, and marx was king and still known as top quality even today. They had a better range of history, not just ww2 like most. I was lucky in that my dad also collected as a kid and gave me what survived of his soldier collection mostly marx also and i always loved when he would tell me about all the figures that had gotten lost or stolen over the years before they finally made it to me. there were a few like the forgien legion figures that he only had a few left of and no arabs at all and i would love when he tell me what they looked like. I still have most of those old figures but like him i lost intrest in my teens and they got shoved around and alot got lost. A few years back i came back across them and it resparked an intrest that never really died and with the internet i became aware of all the new stuff thats out there in a hobby that i thought had died.
 
It is the companies that inovate and redefine themselves time and time again that last and end up with long term success. Its funny because just about every single item you guys listed as the pinacle of its industry is dead! Rolls Royce? Please since when? People dont covet Rolls anylonger and its pretty much dead. Had it not been for the Germans it would be completly scrap! Everything listed is no longer considered the pinacle inits market? I guess unless you happen to be one of those few who owns a piece of it? Nobody else cares!

Cheapen the line with Chinas plastic? Hate to break the news but were already getting Chinas best just with a premium attached? As a business goes people make decisions. This is a limeted niche to some degree and not a high demmand business. Unimax and 21st century may change that. Should they continue as is. If so you will see additional players develope and that in and of itself will then dictate changes one way or another.

Plastics? I guess it depends? If I were in charge at K&C and I thought i could sell one hundred thousand sets in plastic At say $20.00 versus 1000 in current form at $90.00 there would be a lot of pissed people on this forum.Guess its a good thing I am not in charge?
 
Who cares....grown men arguing about plastic army men...lol.....Andy owns King and Country he's a smart man thats why his business is where its at...at the end of the day its Andy's business and his decision and non of our business...for the first time a thread like this has actually turned me off of this hobby...remember thats all this is a hobby....:)

Wellington

Oh yes did I say I was in a pissy mood problems at work and at home sure takes the fun out of collecting.
 
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HI ,in responce to wellingtons last post,i feel your responce is pretty full on,
I personaly thought the initial thread starter was a good one.This is after all a discusion board ,I dont think anyone is trying to tell King and country how to run their buisness.If everything you dont agree with gets shot down in flames their is no discusion.As you have said this is just a hobby.
 
Your right it started out good and this is a forum to discuss things and if I don't like the tread I don't have to read it...I was just trying to say its really not that important to get upset about...as I said having a few problems and I guess they are spilling over into what I like doing.

Cheers
Wellington.....:)
Wives have that power over men........ODD
 
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As strickly a plastic collecter for 10 years, before I became addicted to K&C.
A bunch of companies have come and gone. Conte is the premier plastic producer, but from what I gather, his metal business keeps his plastic business afloat.
TSSD is currrently doing excellent plastic figures, but how long they can go on will be interesting.
What I,m getting at is that doing plastic is an expensive venture with not a lot of return.
As for kids, my 4 year old grandson plays on the living room floor, just as I did some 50 or so years ago, with just plain toy soldiers.
Gary
 
Plastic soldiers don't deminish the uniqueness of metal toy soldiers. If a company, we'll continue to use K&C for this, can enhance their profit margine by using their metal poses for a line of plastics, I say drive on. It will only help the company stay healthy and keep producing the metal soldiers. Plastics are lawnmower fodder and need to be inexpensive, for this reason. A set of BMCs version of K&Cs Iwo Jima line retails for about $8 USD. I think they are very well done and take nothing away from the metal figures. Metal collectors tend to be snobs (when it comes to plastics) and think of plastic collectors as some sort of lower life form. Plastic collectors don't tend to be in an income braket where they can afford metal soldiers. There are those who collect both. I think there is room for both. Conte had a good plan, they just had poor execution and over reached. Their plastics are too expensive for the average plastics collector (at least at the playset level) and they undercut their dealers via their website. That being said, their product is desirable. I have the Zulu set and would have been the happiest kid on earth to have a set just like it back in the day. I do metal now, as an adult, I did plastic when I was a kid. The two can exist in harmony.
 
With King and Country now doing plastic figures I thought you guys might get a kick out of seeng what the reaction of plastic figures from K&C was like back in 2005 when I joined the forum.
As you can see the thought of plastic figures was not to welcome back then!

I would like to see some unpainted plastic figures released also for us guys who like to paint and convert figures. I don,t see these painted plasic figures going for cheap money if they are going to have the same paint jobs as the metal figures??? Are the plastic figures going to have a cheaper more del prado style paint job to keep the price down???
I just hope there will be an unpainted version released also and the price is kept down,because these figures could be a figure converters dream come true!^&cool
I was priced right of of the painted metal market but now K&C could start seeing some of my money again.

Throw us plastic guys a bone Andy!^&cool
 
jazzeum said:
Your problem is equating Conte with K & C. There's the fallacy. Also the fact that everybody doesn't have the money all at once doesn't wash with me. People do what they can with what they have. It would cheapen the collectors who painstakingly built their collections.

But this is all academic. I can assure you that never in a million years would Andy make plastic. Please, next topic.
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Hey Brad, that was a quick million years!:tongue:
 
fishead19690 said:
I have a ? for andy. Would you ever consider doing a K&C plastic line of figures say something conte has done were they put out there metal figures in unpainted plastic? They have done really well with thare latest figures of the cival war and alamo mexicans. Then guys could paint and convert them to fill out dioramas like large scale napoleonic battles with the greatest plastic figures that would ever be made! you could take over the plastic market with your metal figures done in plastic if you put out a few good sets like conte has done. maybe get some more use out of the retired moulds also. If any one agrees with me please leave some feedback on this so andy has an idea if this could be a good future project! I know i would buy a ton of his napoleonics in plastic to paint and convert. and i,ll bet i,m not alone, you world war 2 guys would do the same i,d bet, and he already has a ton of the moulds.
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G'day Fish.....dont despair about all the neg feedback......If K&C new plastic's are the Mex figures from the Alamo done as Naps that would be interesting.....the Mex figures were sourced out I believe....K&C can continue with their metal figures and source out the plastic......they need a cheap..profitable...side line to fiance the more expensive metal figures....that makes business sense to me..but hey ,,what would I know.....I like your ideas ....you have the same right to express your idea's on this forum ..same as everyone else.....as long as you dont go kicking sailors dog's..you will be fine (Sorry Chief)...cheers TomB
 
As a metal and a plastic collector from what I understand K&C,s new plastic, resin, whatever, really is not geared towards the true plastic collector. Two reasons, it,s painted, most plastic collectors, myself included, want their plastic figures to be one solid color. And second, it,s size. Andy told me the size will be the same as it,s metal. That makes these figures way to large to fit with Conte, TSSD, and other current plastic figures.
And probablly a third reason, I,ve heard some plastic collectors moan about the price of a 16 figure bag of figures at the $25 range. I,m just assuming here, but I would think just one of these new "plastic" figures will fall somewhere in that price!
Gary
 
These figures aren't plastic.

They are and will be resin, so forget about conversions, not made in the right medium for it.

They won't be offered unpainted as a "cheap" alternative to K & C.

These are not designed as a "cheap" alternative to anything, they are designed to allow horse and musket collectors to fill out the ranks with less expensive figures that will blend easily with metal figures.

Funny to see Sceic2's posts, he at one time was one of my best customers, one day he just up and decided to blow out his entire collection on Ebay, then he fell off the toy soldier grid, never to be seen or heard from again.

Always wonder how people who are so enthusiastic about a hobby can just up and bail out without a moments hesitation.

Been at this for about 45 years, am never stopping.

Mark that down.

In pen.
 
gk5717 said:
As a metal and a plastic collector from what I understand K&C,s new plastic, resin, whatever, really is not geared towards the true plastic collector. Two reasons, it,s painted, most plastic collectors, myself included, want their plastic figures to be one solid color. And second, it,s size. Andy told me the size will be the same as it,s metal. That makes these figures way to large to fit with Conte, TSSD, and other current plastic figures.
And probablly a third reason, I,ve heard some plastic collectors moan about the price of a 16 figure bag of figures at the $25 range. I,m just assuming here, but I would think just one of these new "plastic" figures will fall somewhere in that price!
Gary
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Silly me...I completely forgot K&C are 1/30 and that would exclude them from the general plastic collectors....however ...at a guess ...and forgetting the purists...some K&C collectors would welcome a cheaper way to bulk up their dioramas ( mainly marching figures from posts )...and..another silly me....I thought collectors liked to paint their own TS and would welcome unpainted figures...but apparently there are enough K&C collectors who like their figures painted and would be quiet happy with the painted figures...K&C seems to have an aversion about unpainted figures........Fair enough...they have their reasons.....it is always interesting to read comments about K&C on this forum...they are many and varied and sometime's informative ...thank you for sorting me out on the scale thingo...never gave that a thought..... cheers TomB
 
Warrior said:
These figures aren't plastic.

They are and will be resin, so forget about conversions, not made in the right medium for it.

.....
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Why forget about conversions? I have seen many successful resin and metal conversions; it is just a different process than for plastic.
 
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