Robin Hood 2010 (4 Viewers)

[Spitfrnd]

Since i started the "accent" debate in Robin Hood,i would like to clarify a general point on accents in movies.Todays modern movie goers demand /want more for their money,we can no longer look back to "classics" as benchmarks,this is a new age in film making and modern trained actors / actresses if they are taking the role of a historic character know they have to do the research and attempt to reincarnate this person in the genuine attempt at authenticity or at the minimum convince the viewer that their character is as real as could be replicated through their acting skills.John Wayne,Charlton Heston ,Kirk Douglas and their ilk,lived in a different age and their craft and movies should not be judged by the modern era.Russell Crowe prides himself in his craft but in my opinion he got this accent wrong but he was surrounded by British actors and director who should have known better,Ridley Scott is from South Shields and as a Brit should know if a non British actor can pull off a regional British accent or not ,his own South Shields accent could not be easily duplicated by any actor born outside the North East of England its so specific.If the Robin Hood character in the movie was from Nottinghamshire,Crowe should have been embedded with a family from the region as part of his research in order to hone and perfect the regional dialect,we don't need audio tapes of 12th century British speech,few regional dialects change that much,i have not lived in Glasgow for over 30 years but still retain most of my dialect /accent,being a well traveled individual doesn't necessarily mean you will lose the accent you were born with , it may soften in time but ones accent can never be completely eradicated. Ken

I can't agree with that on three points. First I think the craft in general today is not at the level of Heston, Douglas or Wayne; Crowe being one of the pleasant exceptions. Secondly, I would say that regional dialects do very much change, even in less that a hundred years, not to mention near a thousand. I suggest embedding in modern Nottingham, if that is even the appropriate place for the "legend", would have added nothing of value. Finally, I am personal proof of how much one's regional accent can be lost with intent and travel. I went from a very thick local accent to a near Midwest plain version in just a few years and have not relapsed. I am certainly not unique. All that said, to me the accent is the least important part of the role and the one most mangled when an actor is forced or allowed to deviate dramatically from his natural speech. Does that excuse a Texas drawl for a Russian, probably not, but I loved Sir Sean as a Russian sub commander and it did not in the least interfere with my enjoyment of those movies. Had he attempted a Russian lilt, that might have been problematic.

 

[jac28]

Originally Posted by forlornhoper View Post
"Since i started the "accent" debate in Robin Hood,i would like to clarify a general point on accents in movies.Todays modern movie goers demand /want more for their money,we can no longer look back to "classics" as benchmarks,this is a new age in film making and modern trained actors / actresses if they are taking the role of a historic character know they have to do the research and attempt to reincarnate this person in the genuine attempt at authenticity or at the minimum convince the viewer that their character is as real as could be replicated through their acting skills...."

Yeah - I can't completely agree with this statement either.. This is just my opinion... I go to the movies to be entertained... If the movie is entertaining, reasonably accurate/believable then I'm good to go....None of the accents or slight historical inaccuracies (perceived or real) were a problem for me.. In fact - I'll go so far as to say this is my favorite version of Robin Hood alongside (and in many ways surpassing) the Errol Flynn version. I've NEVER made that statement about any other Robin Hood film (or TV show).

This is definitely one of those things we're all going to agree to disagree on.. we all have different likes and dislikes - so our expectations about movies, books, etc are also going to be quite different...

I've already purchased the soundtrack and the paperback book version of the movie

Jim

 

[Rob]

Originally Posted by forlornhoper View Post
"Since i started the "accent" debate in Robin Hood,i would like to clarify a general point on accents in movies.Todays modern movie goers demand /want more for their money,we can no longer look back to "classics" as benchmarks,this is a new age in film making and modern trained actors / actresses if they are taking the role of a historic character know they have to do the research and attempt to reincarnate this person in the genuine attempt at authenticity or at the minimum convince the viewer that their character is as real as could be replicated through their acting skills...."

Yeah - I can't completely agree with this statement either.. This is just my opinion... I go to the movies to be entertained... If the movie is entertaining, reasonably accurate/believable then I'm good to go....None of the accents or slight historical inaccuracies (perceived or real) were a problem for me.. In fact - I'll go so far as to say this is my favorite version of Robin Hood alongside (and in many ways surpassing) the Errol Flynn version. I've NEVER made that statement about any other Robin Hood film (or TV show).

This is definitely one of those things we're all going to agree to disagree on.. we all have different likes and dislikes - so our expectations about movies, books, etc are also going to be quite different...

I've already purchased the soundtrack and the paperback book version of the movie

Jim

Certainly agree with you re your last main paragraph.Some of us are happy to accept films purely as entertainment and are not concerned about historical faults/slights,others of us demand a higher benchmark for our bucks and want (especially in Historical films)realism and truth,its all down to us to decide what we will accept as a good film with good acting or merely another pumped out two hour entertainment,thats freedom of choice.

PS Am not talking about Robin Hood here because A)I havn't seen it yet and B)Its not a Historical film but purely entertainment,and so cannot be judged alongside some of Gibsons films and other insults such as U571.

Rob

 

[Spitfrnd]

Certainly agree with you re your last main paragraph.Some of us are happy to accept films purely as entertainment and are not concerned about historical faults/slights,others of us demand a higher benchmark for our bucks and want (especially in Historical films)realism and truth,its all down to us to decide what we will accept as a good film with good acting or merely another pumped out two hour entertainment,thats freedom of choice.

PS Am not talking about Robin Hood here because A)I havn't seen it yet and B)Its not a Historical film but purely entertainment,and so cannot be judged alongside some of Gibsons films and other insults such as U571.

Rob

One man's insult and all that mate. There is of course a difference between good acting and a choice of accents. I do know from Jim's and Rob's posts that I am really going to like this one.

 

[Rob]

One man's insult and all that mate. There is of course a difference between good acting and a choice of accents. I do know from Jim's and Rob's posts that I am really going to like this one.

Thing is Bill I know Mr Crowe is a good actor I've seen it in Master and Commander,and I go to see Robin Hood knowing its an action romp and a chance for two hours escapism.

But you laugh off my insult remark as if it doesn't matter,quite right its not me thats insulted,its the veterans of my country who actually captured that submarine only for Hollywood to insult their memory and wipe them out of the film.Of course you're not insulted Bill,because you don't care about it..

When it come to the veterans who fought and died for my country then no,no Hollywood production should insult their memory.I put it to my US friends,imagine for a moment a British director/producer was in charge of the Pacific series.And a scene was inserted in the series in which the Marines stopped off on an Island on the way to Iwo Jima and murdered a village full of women and children,an act that never happened in reality.How would you HONESTLY feel?

Rob

 

[Spitfrnd]

Thing is Bill I know Mr Crowe is a good actor I've seen it in Master and Commander,and I go to see Robin Hood knowing its an action romp and a chance for two hours escapism.

But you laugh off my insult remark as if it doesn't matter,quite right its not me thats insulted,its the veterans of my country who actually captured that submarine only for Hollywood to insult their memory and wipe them out of the film.Of course you're not insulted Bill,because you don't care about it..

When it come to the veterans who fought and died for my country then no,no Hollywood production should insult their memory.I put it to my US friends,imagine for a moment a British director/producer was in charge of the Pacific series.And a scene was inserted in the series in which the Marines stopped off on an Island on the way to Iwo Jima and murdered a village full of women and children,an act that never happened in reality.How would you HONESTLY feel?

Rob

I am not sure those are apt analogies my friend. This is quite a difference between depicting ones ancestors as murders and rapists and choosing not to depict one of several true events in favor of a more romantic action version of a similar but different event. Frankly I do not think it is wise or even fair for "ANYONE" to be insulted by a movie version of history, however important the moment was for them or their families. But then I also don't think it is appropriate for native Americans, or those who purport to speak for them, to be insulted by the use of Redskins by my favorite football team.

I also simply DO NOT regard the fact that U-571 was an admitted made up glorification of a composite set of similar events, most of which were really done by UK crews, an insult to those crews in the least. You are free to disagree but I can tell you I would most definitely feel the same if the men in the real events had been my closest relatives. Books are for history, movies are for fun. So it is not that I do not care, I simply disagree.

 

[Rob]

Well Bill,even though we don't agree I do enjoy these discussions,and should I call in to see you during my trip to the states you're going to want to get a lot of Whisky and Pizza in for our Gibson fest...it could get rowdy.

I also don't want to give the wrong impression about cinema in general,I may come across like some Historical scrooge but its only a very small percentage of films that get my blood up.Give me a Dirty Harry,Airplane,The Mummy,Hammer Horror or anything with Ms Anniston and you won't hear a peep out of me

Rob

 

[forlornhoper]

Rob ,in answer to your Russell Crowe accent ,there was definately a hint of Irish in a number of his lines but the actor who played Alan Adale his attempt at a Welsh accent was nothing short of "Shocking".The problem with British accents and dialects is that they are so specific and different from their closest neighbours Eg a South Shields accent is totally different to a Gateshead accent and the two places are only a few miles apart.Ridley Scott should have kept the accents more real ,for British audiences,who are obviously more discerning than our American cousins LOL Ken

 

[Rob]

Rob ,in answer to your Russell Crowe accent ,there was definately a hint of Irish in a number of his lines but the actor who played Alan Adale his attempt at a Welsh accent was nothing short of "Shocking".The problem with British accents and dialects is that they are so specific and different from their closest neighbours Eg a South Shields accent is totally different to a Gateshead accent and the two places are only a few miles apart.Ridley Scott should have kept the accents more real ,for British audiences,who are obviously more discerning than our American cousins LOL Ken

Thanks Ken.I was born and raised in leafy Hertfordshire.I remember the first time I went to visit friends in Scotland they thought I had a cockney accent...can you imagine,a hertfordshire Cockney!

Rob

 

[Spitfrnd]

Rob ,in answer to your Russell Crowe accent ,there was definately a hint of Irish in a number of his lines but the actor who played Alan Adale his attempt at a Welsh accent was nothing short of "Shocking".The problem with British accents and dialects is that they are so specific and different from their closest neighbours Eg a South Shields accent is totally different to a Gateshead accent and the two places are only a few miles apart.Ridley Scott should have kept the accents more real ,for British audiences,who are obviously more discerning than our American cousins LOL Ken

Once again mate, it is not that we are less discerning (well apart from the masses that likely applies to any country), only more interested in different things.

 

[thebritfarmer]

Thanks Ken.I was born and raised in leafy Hertfordshire.I remember the first time I went to visit friends in Scotland they thought I had a cockney accent...can you imagine,a hertfordshire Cockney!

Rob

Most people think my accent is either Irish or London

The shame, they usually get.....The cheek of it !! I not a bloody southener nor am I Irish. I am from Yorkshire !!! Where is that they ask? Heard of Manchester United or Coronation Street? Yup.....next county over

 

[jac28]

Once again mate, it is not that we are less discerning (well apart from the masses that likely applies to any country), only more interested in different things.

Agreed... plus the fact that I personally have only been to England once.. and that was two years ago - was there one week.. So my knowledge of different dialects of the UK is practically non-existent...You would perhaps, have difficulty recognizing the many different dialects of the US or China, or.... you name it...

 

[aujj65]

Agreed... plus the fact that I personally have only been to England once.. and that was two years ago - was there one week.. So my knowledge of different dialects of the UK is practically non-existent...You would perhaps, have difficulty recognizing the many different dialects of the US or China, or.... you name it...

Jim, that was because you was with me and I speak the Queens English!

Jeff

 

[jac28]

Jim, that was because you was with me and I speak the Queens English!

Jeff

Jeff,

All else is gibberish when compared to the Queen's English? Is that what you're getting at?

Jim

 

[aujj65]

Jim, that was because you was with me and I speak the Queens English!

Jeff

Jeff,

All else is gibberish when compared to the Queen's English? Is that what you're getting at?

Jim

When you speak the Queens English one doesn't have an accent like those who live north of the Watford Gap! I’m going to get some stick for this I bet...

Jeff

 

[Wraith]

When you speak the Queens English one doesn't have an accent like those who live north of the Watford Gap! I’m going to get some stick for this I bet...

Jeff

Blaady Suverners!
Didn't realise they had internet connections available Souf of the Gap.

 

[Spitfrnd]

Well Bill,even though we don't agree I do enjoy these discussions,and should I call in to see you during my trip to the states you're going to want to get a lot of Whisky and Pizza in for our Gibson fest...it could get rowdy.

I also don't want to give the wrong impression about cinema in general,I may come across like some Historical scrooge but its only a very small percentage of films that get my blood up.Give me a Dirty Harry,Airplane,The Mummy,Hammer Horror or anything with Ms Anniston and you won't hear a peep out of me

Rob

No problem Rob, it is something like a tennis match; you serve and I volley. Yes of course I do very much wish to see you on your trip to our accent free environs. It may take more wiskey than you think, I have a great deal of Mel's work; perhaps we could start with Road Warrior and work toward the more historically accurate stuff, like the Patriot.
I do have Dirty Harry 1 & 2 however. I am afraid I don't have anything with Jennifer although I did enjoy Office Space and Management. How many times have you seen those? I am looking forward to renting the Bounty Hunter when it comes out.

 

[Rob]

Blaady Suverners!
Didn't realise they had internet connections available Souf of the Gap.

What you moaning about,you just got the wheel up there didn't you?!

Rob

 

[Rob]

Blaady Suverners!
Didn't realise they had internet connections available Souf of the Gap.)

Why is it called the Watford Gap do we think,its nowhere near dear old Watford?

No problem Rob, it is something like a tennis match; you serve and I volley. Yes of course I do very much wish to see you on your trip to our accent free environs. It may take more wiskey than you think, I have a great deal of Mel's work; perhaps we could start with Road Warrior and work toward the more historically accurate stuff, like the Patriot.
I do have Dirty Harry 1 & 2 however. I am afraid I don't have anything with Jennifer although I did enjoy Office Space and Management. How many times have you seen those? I am looking forward to renting the Bounty Hunter when it comes out.

I have just had a shocking memory Bill....I....enjoyed...the Lethal Weapon movies!

Rob

 

[Spitfrnd]

Why is it called the Watford Gap do we think,its nowhere near dear old Watford?




I have just had a shocking memory Bill....I....enjoyed...the Lethal Weapon movies!

Rob

Well then we are good to go mate; I have those.