September Releases - The Figures! (1 Viewer)

Gunn Miniatures said:
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SPA019 Spartan warrior thrusting spear over shoulder, comes with 3 shield variants comprising Spartan Lambda (C version shield on box label ), Zeus with young girl (Q version shield on box label ) and finally a beautiful Mermaid with sailor rendition (R version shield on box label).

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The above variants with Spartan Lambda shields are unlimited so long as demand warrants, the other versions are limited to 100 pieces worldwide. All the above Spartans are priced at $55/£45 inc VAT depending on your location.
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Keep these excellent Spartan figures coming! Love them.
 
Gunn Miniatures said:
Joe if any our figures resemble Aeroart in terms of paint quality then we will take that as a compliment. A lot of our master samples are now painted in Russia, if Aeroart use the same studio then I cannot comment on this.
I know none of our figures resemble Aeroart with regards to pose and each one is unique in this way. Saying that the human body only has so many ways of firing a rifle or throwing a spear and therefore in that respect there maybe some similarity, but that could be said for any manufacturers offerings.
I can pretty much guarantee that when we make a Templar Knight in the future he is going to look similar clothing and paint wise to any one currently on offer from Aeroart, K&C and FL but I am pretty sure none of them are going to claim exclusivity with regards to Templar Knights clothing or attire. After all before these manufacturers there were plenty of other manufacturers making Templar Knights. However I am very confident that none of our Templars will look similar with regards to pose as afore mentioned manufacturers, in fact I would go so far as to say they will be radically different in this respect.
With regards to Aeroart several of their figures resemble model kits on offer from Pegaso albeit in a different scale. I am pretty sure Pegaso had these models out before Aeroart, but who is to say the Pegaso one is unique and was not inspired elsewhere?
If a manufacturer makes a figure based on a painting or photograph then said manufacturer cannot claim exclusivity were somebody else to make it at a future date.
We have a Napoleonic figure coming out very soon based on a painting, we already know its been made in kit format before, but just because somebody else made it in a kit does not mean we cannot make it. Similarly if K&C or FL make the same figure later on we cannot complain they copied our design. After all if anybody has the copyright its the painter - who has long since died!
Where possible we now try to avoid making the same products as other manufacturers as our sales are much more buoyant when we do this. However being relative new comers to the market its pretty much a guarantee that somebody will have made a similar product, particularly the Romans or the Spartans before us at some point in time.

Hope this helps and thanks for your comments
The Gunn Team
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Hi Gunn Team,

Thank you for your reply. I think your figures look great, and I own several of your WWII figures. I appreciate your fine products, but can't help but notice when it comes to your ancients there are many uncanny resemblances to Aeroart's figures. I mean it is really pronounced to me. I will provide photo examples, but first I would like to respond to some of the things you stated:

1) "if Aeroart use the same studio then I cannot comment on this"
Aeroart does not use a "studio" or singular production facility. Of course you know that your figures are not painted at the same location as Aeroart's, but I see what you're doing here.

2) "Saying that the human body only has so many ways of firing a rifle or throwing a spear and therefore in that respect there maybe some similarity"
I completely concur here, but it is not always the figure pose that are similar between TG and Aeroart but extends to some shield art, a given figure's attire, the colors chosen for such garments and accessories, and even some facial sculpts that at times draw a keen alikeness.

3) "I can pretty much guarantee that when we make a Templar Knight in the future he is going to look similar clothing and paint wise...."
I'm not talking about yet to be released and unseen Templar knights here but rather some of your current Romans, a Byzantine guard, Cypriot Marine, Egyptian Marine, Frederick Barbarossa, and Roman elephant (which appears to be modeled on the Russian Vityaz Roman elephant # PB220). These aren't figures clothed in a simple off-white cloak with a red cross on it.

4) "With regards to Aeroart several of their figures resemble model kits on offer from Pegaso"
If this is the case I would like to know which ones. Please provide examples if time permits.

5) "We have a Napoleonic figure coming out very soon based on a painting..."
I'm not talking about metal miniatures based on paintings. I'm talking about metal miniatures possibly based on another manufacturer's current metal miniatures. Maybe your sculptor does not always reveal his/her inspiration to you?

6) "Similarly if K&C or FL make the same figure later on we cannot complain they copied our design. After all if anybody has the copyright its the painter - who has long since died!"
I'm not trying to rake your over the coals, nor am I an expert in copyright infringement or even implying such. That is a subject only you chose to breach. All I'm saying is there are some strong and thus peculiar similarities between some of your figures and Aeroart's (and also Russian Vityaz in reference to your elephant). Perhaps it is merely coincidence. But I can say that I see no such striking cases of coincidence between the products of K & C, FL, WB, CS, etc and that of Aeroart's.
The question would have been asked sooner or later, and your response seems to reveal you had been expecting such a query to arise.

Some examples that caught my eye:









More photos to follow,
Joe
 
Okay, what ever the point was, I for one is glad that Thomas Gunn are coming out with all this pieces, with me possibly spending a lot less than what I would have spent on Aeroart figures. I love Aeroart. But with the TM figures there are a lot more pieces to love for the price that I would have spent with Aeroart, And who plain and simple would not want that?...... Thanks!!! TG!! For giving us this pieces!!!
 
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sfarrelly said:
they look absolutely nothing like each other !! what is your point ?
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I have to agree with you. There are so many differences that to intimate they are copies, which in effect is what has been said, seems strange to me.
 
joesgis said:
Hi Gunn Team,

Thank you for your reply. I think your figures look great, and I own several of your WWII figures. I appreciate your fine products, but can't help but notice when it comes to your ancients there are many uncanny resemblances to Aeroart's figures. I mean it is really pronounced to me. I will provide photo examples, but first I would like to respond to some of the things you stated:

1) "if Aeroart use the same studio then I cannot comment on this"
Aeroart does not use a "studio" or singular production facility. Of course you know that your figures are not painted at the same location as Aeroart's, but I see what you're doing here.

2) "Saying that the human body only has so many ways of firing a rifle or throwing a spear and therefore in that respect there maybe some similarity"
I completely concur here, but it is not always the figure pose that are similar between TG and Aeroart but extends to some shield art, a given figure's attire, the colors chosen for such garments and accessories, and even some facial sculpts that at times draw a keen alikeness.

3) "I can pretty much guarantee that when we make a Templar Knight in the future he is going to look similar clothing and paint wise...."
I'm not talking about yet to be released and unseen Templar knights here but rather some of your current Romans, a Byzantine guard, Cypriot Marine, Egyptian Marine, Frederick Barbarossa, and Roman elephant (which appears to be modeled on the Russian Vityaz Roman elephant # PB220). These aren't figures clothed in a simple off-white cloak with a red cross on it.

4) "With regards to Aeroart several of their figures resemble model kits on offer from Pegaso"
If this is the case I would like to know which ones. Please provide examples if time permits.

5) "We have a Napoleonic figure coming out very soon based on a painting..."
I'm not talking about metal miniatures based on paintings. I'm talking about metal miniatures possibly based on another manufacturer's current metal miniatures. Maybe your sculptor does not always reveal his/her inspiration to you?

6) "Similarly if K&C or FL make the same figure later on we cannot complain they copied our design. After all if anybody has the copyright its the painter - who has long since died!"
I'm not trying to rake your over the coals, nor am I an expert in copyright infringement or even implying such. That is a subject only you chose to breach. All I'm saying is there are some strong and thus peculiar similarities between some of your figures and Aeroart's (and also Russian Vityaz in reference to your elephant). Perhaps it is merely coincidence. But I can say that I see no such striking cases of coincidence between the products of K & C, FL, WB, CS, etc and that of Aeroart's.
The question would have been asked sooner or later, and your response seems to reveal you had been expecting such a query to arise.

Some examples that caught my eye:









More photos to follow,
Joe
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I did a little consulting and research for TGM (total commissions one nice Spartan Commander. Nice deal)

What I found as I was helping them is that many of the same sources are used by all Toy Soldier manufacturers. In fact you could say that Aeroart gets a lot of their ideas from Osprey and other publishers.

This is especially true for ancients where our reference sources are quite limited.

I have not performed any peer reviewed analysis but when I was helping out I independently noticed this. Lots of Oh, that is why you see this, that or the other.

I made lots of recommendations and TGM took some and not others. There are some small details that set theirs apart that I can highlight over the weekend.
 
bradleyl30 said:
And almost all of these pre-date Aeroart and can be found primarily in Osprey and other published works.
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bradleyl30,

Yes, Aeroart designers and sculptors have drawn inspiration from published works for some pieces, but I do not know if that applies to any of these specific figures. I would imagine maybe some but not all. Even if we extended your premise to each of the figures exhibited, I believe objective thought would still lead one to ponder the similarities between the final product's of Aeroart and TG.

Joe
 
spartan71 said:
Okay, what ever the point was, I for one is glad that Thomas Gunn are coming out with all this pieces, with me possibly spending a lot less than what I would have spent on Aeroart figures. I love Aeroart. But with the TM figures there are a lot more pieces to love for the price that I would have spent with Aeroart, And who plain and simple would not want that?...... Thanks!!! TG!! For giving us this pieces!!!
Click to expand...

This sums up my thoughts perfectly. TG are getting big into ancients and that can only be a true benefit to collectors, like me, of this era. Another 16 ordered from the September releases and I look forward to them arriving in New Zealand. This thread has sparked my interest in Aeroart though.

Keep up the good work TG. Success always brings detractors. Gary
 
joesgis said:
Hi Gunn Team,

Thank you for your reply. I think your figures look great, and I own several of your WWII figures. I appreciate your fine products, but can't help but notice when it comes to your ancients there are many uncanny resemblances to Aeroart's figures. I mean it is really pronounced to me. I will provide photo examples, but first I would like to respond to some of the things you stated:

1) "if Aeroart use the same studio then I cannot comment on this"
Aeroart does not use a "studio" or singular production facility. Of course you know that your figures are not painted at the same location as Aeroart's, but I see what you're doing here.

2) "Saying that the human body only has so many ways of firing a rifle or throwing a spear and therefore in that respect there maybe some similarity"
I completely concur here, but it is not always the figure pose that are similar between TG and Aeroart but extends to some shield art, a given figure's attire, the colors chosen for such garments and accessories, and even some facial sculpts that at times draw a keen alikeness.

3) "I can pretty much guarantee that when we make a Templar Knight in the future he is going to look similar clothing and paint wise...."
I'm not talking about yet to be released and unseen Templar knights here but rather some of your current Romans, a Byzantine guard, Cypriot Marine, Egyptian Marine, Frederick Barbarossa, and Roman elephant (which appears to be modeled on the Russian Vityaz Roman elephant # PB220). These aren't figures clothed in a simple off-white cloak with a red cross on it.

4) "With regards to Aeroart several of their figures resemble model kits on offer from Pegaso"
If this is the case I would like to know which ones. Please provide examples if time permits.

5) "We have a Napoleonic figure coming out very soon based on a painting..."
I'm not talking about metal miniatures based on paintings. I'm talking about metal miniatures possibly based on another manufacturer's current metal miniatures. Maybe your sculptor does not always reveal his/her inspiration to you?

6) "Similarly if K&C or FL make the same figure later on we cannot complain they copied our design. After all if anybody has the copyright its the painter - who has long since died!"
I'm not trying to rake your over the coals, nor am I an expert in copyright infringement or even implying such. That is a subject only you chose to breach. All I'm saying is there are some strong and thus peculiar similarities between some of your figures and Aeroart's (and also Russian Vityaz in reference to your elephant). Perhaps it is merely coincidence. But I can say that I see no such striking cases of coincidence between the products of K & C, FL, WB, CS, etc and that of Aeroart's.
The question would have been asked sooner or later, and your response seems to reveal you had been expecting such a query to arise.

Some examples that caught my eye:









More photos to follow,
Joe
Click to expand...

Hi Joe

Looking at the Photos of the Marius Mule figure, yes it has some similarity I would say. Though personally I find the Aeroart head quite ghastly, the shield along with other some details are different. The shape of Roman shields changed over time, but at a glance the figures do look alike.
My personal verdict would be assuming price were same, I would buy the TG figure.

The Medieval figure. One appears to be mounted the other on foot ! The mounted figure seems to have had much too much varnish applied.

The last figures are both totally different poses. Historical evidence for arms and armour is very limited for these periods in history for research purposes, visit the Museums in Greece or even search the internet and you will see this.

However TG do continue to make historical errors, such as Centurions wearing their swords on the right side. Where they should be on the left!
Wrong type of saddle on their forthcoming Roman Cavalry is an example, where ALL other manufacturers I have seen have got it right !
Hopefully they will put it right before release. If it's right I will certainly buy several, if it remains wrong, I'm not sure I will buy any. IF I do it'll be only single offerings as JJD have done a very good job on their offerings.
At the end of the day it is up to us as to whether can live with the manufacturers errors or we buy different companies offerings or not !

Steve
 
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If Aero art is close to the price of the FIrst Legion pieces, I would buy it instead of the other offerings. But with their price, It is strictly Generals like Germanicus, Crusader Grandmasters, Tibernicus... I can not justify the price to myself if its just a regular soldier....
 
As a relatively newcomer on this forum, I am a little bit surprised about the discussion on this thread.
In my opinion the point that Joe is making has nothing to do with the quality and price of the figures. It has to do with creativity. For me it's somewhat disappointing to see that TG had made some ancient figures that looks almost the same as the ones from Aeroart. For instance, the praetorian guards, anyone can see that there is a big resemblance in colour and in style. The shield has exactly the some painting ! Why? I really can't understand. I like variety and creativity in figures, that is what for me makes the hobby interesting. Not repeating the same over and over again.
I collect Roman figures from different manufacturers, including TG and Aeroart. I like them both very much, and some figures are brilliant.
So, why not be more creative, and make (for instance) a serie of praetorian guards that looks totally different from earlier figures. I will buy them instantly....
 
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