Jack the Ripper-your suspects (2 Viewers)

[UKReb]

and of course Albert Victor Victoria's granson was also suspected, but I think it was later proven he was in Scotland during some of the murders.
Rob

This story exploded during the 1960's and as Rob states was soon debunked by simply viewing the court circulars at the time on his whereabouts during most of the Whitechapel murders-but the accusations still continue to pop up in every new Ripper theory.

However, Albert Victor (known as Eddy) is an interesting and tragic figure in his own right. As the eldest son of the Prince of Wales (later Edward VII) he would, if he had survived, have succeeded his father to the British throne in 1910. But he was described as suffering "abnormally dormant condition of the mind" he was sent to Cambridge but his tutors practically gave up on teaching him any of the arts as he simply refused to read any books-possibly suffering from dyslexia. In common with the rest of his royal class he was excused exams and was sent to military college with the new title of the Duke of Clarence & Avon and became an officer in the 10th Hussars.

Just like his father- Eddy was a frequent visitor to London brothels (hence my comment to Damian's post that a royal would not know his way around Whitechapel-yes he would or rather his carriage driver would). He was involved in the Clevedon Street scandal which was hushed up by the royal courtiers and he was quickly sent off to India. He fell in love with the Princess of Hesse but she did not reciprocate instead marrying Tsar Nicholas II of Russia-and would be murdered along with her husband and family during the Russian Revolution. He then fell head over hills with another European princess who was a Catholic-Queen Victoria stepped in then as at the time no Catholic had any chance of being associated with the British royal family. She arranged Princess Mary of Teck as a suitable bride for her troublesome grandson and the wedding was arranged for 1892-but Eddy contracted influenza during the pandemic and died. The Princess of Teck was then farmed off to the Duke of York (later George V) and became the famous Queen Mary our present Queen's Grandmother.

But Eddy's story did not die in 1892 some years later long after his death a woman made a claim that her child's father was The Duke of Clarence when he was stationed in India which became the basis of the Ripper story that the Duke had sired a child with one of the Ripper's victims and that he or rather his colleagues murdered all the prostitutes who knew the truth. Pure bunkum of course but a great story.

Truth of all the Ripper theories is the fact that much of the original evidence gathered at the time has been lost and many "facts" are no more than opinions proffered by the mutitude of writers about the case over the last century. He was not the first serial killer but was most probably the first to appear in a large metropolis where the general populace were literate and the press had become a force of social change. As Jack was never officially caught this only fueled the myth/legend and created an intellectual puzzle that people today still want to solve but more importantly after over a hundred years old Jack can still sell a hell of a lot of books and movies

Reb

 

[Rob]

Excellent post Bob,and I think your final paragraph nails it.Its because he was never caught that his legend goes on and on,whoever he was his mind was certainly totally unbalanced, a look at the gruesome pictures of his last victim poor Mary Kelly testifies to that.

I remember another ripper film back in the seventies probably, that put forward the conspiracy theory and that the other prostitutes were killed to silence them,as you say total bunkum.

Wasn't Eddy suspected of having syphilis from his trips to the east end and this could have contirbuted to insanity, or was this just another slur put about to try and justify his position as a suspect.

Rob

 

[Cornwallis]

Interesting thread Rob,

I can remember reading somewhere that there is evidence to suggest that Walter Sickert was in France at the time of one of the murders, which I discovered after reading the Patricia Cornwell book!

This J the R documentary was probably one of the best I have seen and one I recommend - 'Jack the Ripper in America'


"James Kelly (no known relation to the Ripper victim Mary Kelly) (20 April 1860 – 17 September 1929) murdered his wife in 1883 by stabbing her in the neck. Deemed insane, he was committed to the Broadmoor Asylum, from which he later escaped in early 1888, using a key he fashioned himself. After the last Ripper murder in London in November 1888, the police searched for Kelly at what had been his residence prior his wife's murder, but they were not able to locate him. In 1927, almost forty years after his escape, he unexpectedly turned himself back in to officials at the Broadmoor Asylum. He died two years later, presumably of natural causes.

A retired NYPD cold-case detective named Ed Norris examined the Jack the Ripper case for a Discovery Channel program called "Jack the Ripper in America." In it, Norris claims that James Kelly was not only Jack the Ripper's real identity, he was also responsible for multiple murders in cities around the United States. Norris highlights a few features of the Kelly story to support his contention. He worked as a furniture upholsterer, a job that requires handiness with a knife. He also left behind a journal that spoke of his strong disapproval of the immorality of prostitutes and of his having been on the "warpath" during his time as a fugitive. Norris claims Kelly was in New York at the time of a Ripper-like murder of a prostitute named Carrie Brown as well as in a number of cities while each experienced, according to Norris, one or two brutal murders of prostitutes while Kelly was there."

 

[OzDigger]

There's certainly no shortage of suspects: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_the_Ripper_suspects

Btw, It's General Oz from now on

 

[Louis Badolato]

Interesting thread Rob,

I can remember reading somewhere that there is evidence to suggest that Walter Sickert was in France at the time of one of the murders, which I discovered after reading the Patricia Cornwell book!

This J the R documentary was probably one of the best I have seen and one I recommend - 'Jack the Ripper in America'


"James Kelly (no known relation to the Ripper victim Mary Kelly) (20 April 1860 – 17 September 1929) murdered his wife in 1883 by stabbing her in the neck. Deemed insane, he was committed to the Broadmoor Asylum, from which he later escaped in early 1888, using a key he fashioned himself. After the last Ripper murder in London in November 1888, the police searched for Kelly at what had been his residence prior his wife's murder, but they were not able to locate him. In 1927, almost forty years after his escape, he unexpectedly turned himself back in to officials at the Broadmoor Asylum. He died two years later, presumably of natural causes.

A retired NYPD cold-case detective named Ed Norris examined the Jack the Ripper case for a Discovery Channel program called "Jack the Ripper in America." In it, Norris claims that James Kelly was not only Jack the Ripper's real identity, he was also responsible for multiple murders in cities around the United States. Norris highlights a few features of the Kelly story to support his contention. He worked as a furniture upholsterer, a job that requires handiness with a knife. He also left behind a journal that spoke of his strong disapproval of the immorality of prostitutes and of his having been on the "warpath" during his time as a fugitive. Norris claims Kelly was in New York at the time of a Ripper-like murder of a prostitute named Carrie Brown as well as in a number of cities while each experienced, according to Norris, one or two brutal murders of prostitutes while Kelly was there."

That would make sense from a profiling standpoint. Since the ripper was never caught, but the murders in London stopped, looking for similar type murders in other places, and then figuring out if any of your suspects were in the locations of the murders with the same M.O., is the best way to find a plausible suspect at this very late date. Simply stated, serial killers don't stop killing. If the murders stop, the killer is either dead, imprisoned on another charge, or has moved along.

 

[Scott]

"Wolf in the Fold" is a second-season episode of Star Trek: The Original Series. It is episode #43, production #36, and was broadcast on December 22, 1967. It was written by Robert Bloch, and directed by Joseph Pevney.

Overview: A series of bizarre murders points to Mr. Scott as the prime suspect.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wolf_in_the_Fold

 

[OzDigger]

That Star Wars story is pure fiction, I'm sure Carl Kolchak killed the Ripper by electrocution well before that.

 

[jazzeum]

Btw, It's General Oz from now on

Man, they let anybody in this neighborhood nowadays Time to look for a new house

 

[OzDigger]

Man, they let anybody in this neighborhood nowadays Time to look for a new house

Something 'moderate' perhaps

 

[jazzeum]

One never knows what may turn up

 

[Louis Badolato]

That Star Wars story is pure fiction, I'm sure Carl Kolchak killed the Ripper by electrocution well before that.

Nice Nightstalker reference. I loved that show as a kid, and I remember the ripper episode . . .

 

[Combat]

Nice Nightstalker reference. I loved that show as a kid, and I remember the ripper episode . . .

My favorite Nightstalker episode was the one with the headless motorcycle rider. They don't make them like that anymore. Cool theme song as well.

 

[OzDigger]

Nice Nightstalker reference. I loved that show as a kid, and I remember the ripper episode . . .

Louis, they don't make em like that anymore: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pY0TGZ9VMqU&feature=related

Edit: I don't believe it! Combat is another cliche fan

Speaking of "I don't believe it", here's one of my fav Victor Meldrew (One Foot in the Grave) scenes: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CM3I5ckJnUc

 

[Louis Badolato]

My favorite Nightstalker episode was the one with the headless motorcycle rider. They don't make them like that anymore. Cool theme song as well.

I liked the one with the American Indian spirit that changed shapes, and the one with the immortal guy who lived in the abandoned city below Seattle. To tell the truth, I loved every episode I saw. Once in a while there is a marathon of this show on SciFi or Chiller, and I glue myself to the TV.

 

[MCKENNA77]

Just an FYI, you can take a Ripper Tour in East London. Its actually become a popular thing to do with several different companies offering tours. I did it the last time me and Kgb were there and it was very interesting. Its one thing to read about history and its another to be standing at the murder sites and locations related to the case. In an odd twist at one particular scene location a young Indian couple was making out on a park bench approximately right where the murder occurred. Its a great way to see a whole other side of London and realize not everything is White Hall, Big Ben & Parliament etc etc.

Keep it silly

 

[OzDigger]

I liked the one with the American Indian spirit that changed shapes, and the one with the immortal guy who lived in the abandoned city below Seattle. To tell the truth, I loved every episode I saw. Once in a while there is a marathon of this show on SciFi or Chiller, and I glue myself to the TV.

I remember that one, Jaws played the big indian dude. I liked most of the episodes but 'The Energy Eater' that wrecked a hospital and 'Horror in the Heights' where Carl had to shoot a 'Miss Emily' Monster with a crossbow were my favs.

 

[marco55]

I also loved the Night Stalker and I remember the Star Trek episode.
Mark

 

[lancer]

I liked the one with the American Indian spirit that changed shapes, and the one with the immortal guy who lived in the abandoned city below Seattle. To tell the truth, I loved every episode I saw. Once in a while there is a marathon of this show on SciFi or Chiller, and I glue myself to the TV.

I occasionally watched this show but the only episode that really impressed me, besides the first one, was the subterranean Seattle one. Thought it very eerie and atmospheric. The Star Trek episode was a good one, too. Something about a serial killer that never stopped and kept moving to new hunting grounds seemed creepy and as it turns out, is true in many cases. -- Al

 

[Eazy]

It certainly is an interesting topic.
A few years ago I read 'From Hell" by Alan Moore and Eddie Campbell.
It's a graphic novel the size of a big old telephone book. It's a meticulously researched work that draws threads from practically every Ripper related theory and sighting and weaves it into a very detailed narrative.
His main thread revolves around Sir William Gull and the masonic conspiracy to silence the women who knew that Prince Eddy had fathered a child with Annie Crook.
Gull had his own agenda revolving around the suppression of the female. Churches built upon ancient sites of temples to Diana. Obelisks positioned in major cities asserting male domination.

A highlight for me was Gull's tour of London with the coach driver Netley, taking in along the way all manner of obelisks and Nicholas Hawksmoor built churches some of which dont exist any more. Gull posed the question why in a capsule in the pedastal of Cleopatra's Needle are, amongst other items, 12 photographs of women and a razor!

It really was quite chilling and makes you look at London in a new way. Once you've read it you'll suddenly start to notice all these places not exactly hidden but rather there in plain site amongst all the new buildings.

A friend of mine and I went down and did a similar tour of Hawksmoor churches. Try standing in front of Christchurch Spitalfields. There is nothing reassuring or warm about it. In fact it feels quite the opposite!

Anyway the culmination of The Ripper's terrible work was what went on in Marie Kelly's room on that final night. Whoever the Ripper was he took the killing to a new extreme on that night, alone with nobody to disturb him.
Looking at the photographs it's thankfully impossible to understand or imagine what really went on in that little room. But it seems that after this murder and mutilation the killer felt his task was complete.

Alan Moore in "From Hell" proposed that the Ripper laid the foundation for the 20th Century that night.

 

[Rob]

Sounds an interesting read James, might have to look that one up.Its the same story of Gull and his hatred of women caused by madness used in that Michael Caine film back in the eighties. And the tour sounds fascinating,London is so packed with History that there is always something around the next corner,whether its a ripper murder site or an ancient pub its just brilliant.

Apparently if you look out through the darkened tube windows at a certain spot you can still see wartime posters upon the wall of a long closed station used by Churchill and staff during the war. There used to be an entrance down to one of these stations closed back in the 30's or 40's in a well known part of London, 'A friend' told me it was easy to Jimmy the door and get in and have a look around, a bit dangerous but absolutely fascinating and not a little spooky,they've locked it up now though....he says

Off to Amazon to look that book up!

Rob