Jack the Ripper-your suspects (1 Viewer)

[Eazy]

Those disused and forgotten tube stations have always struck me as being really creepy but it would be pretty cool to look around one.

See what you think of "From Hell" - it's not an easy read in many ways but it makes a big impression.

 

[Rob]

They really are, they used to take tours of one or two, but following the tragic and unexplained death of a student at the Brompton road disused tube some years back they seemed to have stopped them. Really dangerous places now and you can imagine the law suits for injuries!.

They are not all falling apart though,not sure which one it is but one of them is kept in pristine condition preserving its art deco style,its used for filming Poirot,Miss Marple etc.

The book looks like quite a read, I have a ton of WW2 stuff I want to read this summer, so it might make a pleasant eek change, I think I will give it a whirl.

Rob

 

[Eazy]

I need to look up that tragic and unexplained death. Sounds very mysterious in a disused subway station.

 

[thebritfarmer]

Those disused and forgotten tube stations have always struck me as being really creepy but it would be pretty cool to look around one.

See what you think of "From Hell" - it's not an easy read in many ways but it makes a big impression.

I take it the movie From Hell is based on this book?

 

[Rob]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/how-did-sean-harper-die-1620582.html

Here you go James,pretty odd isn't it.

Rob

 

[Eazy]

I take it the movie From Hell is based on this book?

It's based on it in a very loose and vague way. The writer of the graphic novel disowned the movie.
There is so much depth and conspiracy theory missing from the film.
If you are interested in Ripper lore give "From Hell" the book a go but give the film a miss!
Go on Amazon and read the reviews of the book and it'll give you an idea of what to expect. It's not for everyone but if you get into it you will find it stays with you.

 

[thebritfarmer]

Thanks James I will look into it.

 

[GICOP]

They really are, they used to take tours of one or two, but following the tragic and unexplained death of a student at the Brompton road disused tube some years back they seemed to have stopped them. Really dangerous places now and you can imagine the law suits for injuries!.

They are not all falling apart though,not sure which one it is but one of them is kept in pristine condition preserving its art deco style,its used for filming Poirot,Miss Marple etc.

The book looks like quite a read, I have a ton of WW2 stuff I want to read this summer, so it might make a pleasant eek change, I think I will give it a whirl.

Rob

Rob

That would probably be this one, first called Strand then renamed Aldwych

http://underground-history.co.uk/aldwych.php

Cheers

Martyn

 

[Rob]

Rob

That would probably be this one, first called Strand then renamed Aldwych

http://underground-history.co.uk/aldwych.php

Cheers

Martyn

Hey Martyn,thanks for posting this.Yes its most probably Aldwych as you say,and thats a good website for these abandoned stations isn't it. Its a shame they can't make them safe enough for visitors and take tours again, so much underground history sitting down there.

Cheers

Rob

 

[UKReb]

It certainly is an interesting topic.
A few years ago I read 'From Hell" by Alan Moore and Eddie Campbell.
It's a graphic novel the size of a big old telephone book. It's a meticulously researched work that draws threads from practically every Ripper related theory and sighting and weaves it into a very detailed narrative.
His main thread revolves around Sir William Gull and the masonic conspiracy to silence the women who knew that Prince Eddy had fathered a child with Annie Crook.
Gull had his own agenda revolving around the suppression of the female. Churches built upon ancient sites of temples to Diana. Obelisks positioned in major cities asserting male domination.

A highlight for me was Gull's tour of London with the coach driver Netley, taking in along the way all manner of obelisks and Nicholas Hawksmoor built churches some of which dont exist any more. Gull posed the question why in a capsule in the pedastal of Cleopatra's Needle are, amongst other items, 12 photographs of women and a razor!

It really was quite chilling and makes you look at London in a new way. Once you've read it you'll suddenly start to notice all these places not exactly hidden but rather there in plain site amongst all the new buildings.

A friend of mine and I went down and did a similar tour of Hawksmoor churches. Try standing in front of Christchurch Spitalfields. There is nothing reassuring or warm about it. In fact it feels quite the opposite!

Anyway the culmination of The Ripper's terrible work was what went on in Marie Kelly's room on that final night. Whoever the Ripper was he took the killing to a new extreme on that night, alone with nobody to disturb him.
Looking at the photographs it's thankfully impossible to understand or imagine what really went on in that little room. But it seems that after this murder and mutilation the killer felt his task was complete.

Alan Moore in "From Hell" proposed that the Ripper laid the foundation for the 20th Century that night.

James

A most excellent post which I find much more enthralling than a "Star Trek" version

The Masonic connection which has fascinated any number of Ripper authors does indeed have some basis on a number of counts. The first was a message daubed on a wall in Goulston Street which read

"The Juwes Are the men
that will not
be blamed"

This was quickly ordered to be removed by Police Commissioner Sir Melville Macnaughton-at first people thought because of a possible incitement against the large Jewish community in the East End of London. However, the word "Juwes" has no bearing whatsoever on Jews- as any freemason would immediately identify the word as referring to three mythical Masonic characters at the building of King Solomon's Temple. Also it was written as I have typed here-
as a 3 stepped placement of the phrase-which could possibly relate to the three stepped entrance to the temple.

Using the Masonic connection further an investigator would then look at the wounds of the five victims. Throats cut; breasts removed and chests torn open and the one you refer to Marie Kelly who was completely disembowelled.
All of these mutilations are also Masonic signs!!!!!.

What has always interested me is the connection of the five victims-in London's East End at the time of the Ripper murders there were thousands of prostitutes but these five did indeed know each other-Why just kill these five??? Further to that two of them used the same name/alias- Marie Kelly- which is also very interesting and possibly relevant to the case as only one of the victims had her face mutilated-Did Jack make a mistake with the wrong Mary Kelly???

Fascinating stuff and your post James reminded me of the above.

Bob

 

[GICOP]

Hey Martyn,thanks for posting this.Yes its most probably Aldwych as you say,and thats a good website for these abandoned stations isn't it. Its a shame they can't make them safe enough for visitors and take tours again, so much underground history sitting down there.

Cheers

Rob

Hi Rob

These posters were discovered a few weeks ago at Notting Hill Tube Station, makes you wonder what else is hidden, Underground

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1286535/Notting-Hill-posters-1950s-artwork-Tube-station.html

Cheers

Martyn

 

[Rob]

Hi Rob

These posters were discovered a few weeks ago at Notting Hill Tube Station, makes you wonder what else is hidden, Underground

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1286535/Notting-Hill-posters-1950s-artwork-Tube-station.html

Cheers

Martyn

Excellent Martyn, wish they'd let me down there.

Does anyone think the 'Dear Boss' letters were from the ripper himself or another red herring designed to confuse the already struggling police?.The letter with the piece of ear lobe seemed to confirm his threat to 'clip the lady's ears off just for jolly'. The Police obviously got a lot of letters from fruit cakes during the investigation claiming to be Jack, but this one does have an air of horrible authenticity about it.What do you reckon?.

Rob

 

[trooper]

A book I recommend to all those interested in the Ripper case is "The Jack the Ripper A to Z" written by Paul Begg, Martin Fido and Keith Skinner, three dedicated Ripperologists. It deals with everyone connected with the case, those who have written books about it, looks at the various theories and explains the evidence to support or dispute them. Very useful as it covers much of the early work which is now hard to obtain, the police files and many newspaper reports. The authors do not make any claims for any particular person but just present the sum of what is available and leave the reader to draw their own conclusions. Well worth a look.

 

[trooper]

Excellent Martyn, wish they'd let me down there.

Does anyone think the 'Dear Boss' letters were from the ripper himself or another red herring designed to confuse the already struggling police?.The letter with the piece of ear lobe seemed to confirm his threat to 'clip the lady's ears off just for jolly'. The Police obviously got a lot of letters from fruit cakes during the investigation claiming to be Jack, but this one does have an air of horrible authenticity about it.What do you reckon?.

Rob

The general concensus seems to be that the only genuine letter was the one entitled "From Hell" sent to Mr Lusk. It has now been proven that the letters signed "Jack the Ripper" were the work of a newspaper reporter. The kidney sent to Lusk with the letter conformed to the remaining one in Catherine Eddowes body ie suffering from Bight's Disease and the length of renal artery attached corresponded to the length remaining. That letter was just signed "Catch me if you can"

 

[Mitch]

Talking of fruit cakes hoax letters and moving so slightly from one ripper to another the Hoaxer who caused so much confusion with West Yorks police and helped peter sutcliffe is airing on sky (nat geo) 19th of this month.

 

[Eazy]

James

A most excellent post which I find much more enthralling than a "Star Trek" version

The Masonic connection which has fascinated any number of Ripper authors does indeed have some basis on a number of counts. The first was a message daubed on a wall in Goulston Street which read

"The Juwes Are the men
that will not
be blamed"

This was quickly ordered to be removed by Police Commissioner Sir Melville Macnaughton-at first people thought because of a possible incitement against the large Jewish community in the East End of London. However, the word "Juwes" has no bearing whatsoever on Jews- as any freemason would immediately identify the word as referring to three mythical Masonic characters at the building of King Solomon's Temple. Also it was written as I have typed here-
as a 3 stepped placement of the phrase-which could possibly relate to the three stepped entrance to the temple.

Using the Masonic connection further an investigator would then look at the wounds of the five victims. Throats cut; breasts removed and chests torn open and the one you refer to Marie Kelly who was completely disembowelled.
All of these mutilations are also Masonic signs!!!!!.

What has always interested me is the connection of the five victims-in London's East End at the time of the Ripper murders there were thousands of prostitutes but these five did indeed know each other-Why just kill these five??? Further to that two of them used the same name/alias- Marie Kelly- which is also very interesting and possibly relevant to the case as only one of the victims had her face mutilated-Did Jack make a mistake with the wrong Mary Kelly???

Fascinating stuff and your post James reminded me of the above.

Bob

"The Juwes are the men who will not be blamed for nothing"

Those were the words written above a bloody piece of Catherine Eddowes apron. As you say Bob the words were wiped off by the Police under orders from above on the grounds that it could incite racial tension.

Interestingly of course it's likely that Juwes is not a misspelling of Jews but refering to the Masonic Juwes - Jubela, Jubelo, Jubelum!
Well at least likely if you have a penchant for conspiracy theory and Ripper lore is packed with conspiracy.

Other questions

Were all 5 women Ripper victims? Not all seemed to carry the same hallmarks of Jack.

Was there a sixth victim - Martha Tabram - possibly the first of the Ripper murders or was she a victim of a notorious criminal gang?

Was it really Mary/Marie Kelly that died on that final night?
It's been put forward that she had another woman staying with her at the time and indeed that Mary Kelly was spotted early the next day.

It's all fascinating stuff.

 

[Eazy]

A book I recommend to all those interested in the Ripper case is "The Jack the Ripper A to Z" written by Paul Begg, Martin Fido and Keith Skinner, three dedicated Ripperologists. It deals with everyone connected with the case, those who have written books about it, looks at the various theories and explains the evidence to support or dispute them. Very useful as it covers much of the early work which is now hard to obtain, the police files and many newspaper reports. The authors do not make any claims for any particular person but just present the sum of what is available and leave the reader to draw their own conclusions.a Well worth a look.

I have this book too- The Jack the Ripper A-Z. It really is a great reference guide to dip in and out of.

 

[trooper]

Other questions

Were all 5 women Ripper victims? Not all seemed to carry the same hallmarks of Jack.

Was there a sixth victim - Martha Tabram - possibly the first of the Ripper murders or was she a victim of a notorious criminal gang?

Was it really Mary/Marie Kelly that died on that final night?
It's been put forward that she had another woman staying with her at the time and indeed that Mary Kelly was spotted early the next day.

It's all fascinating stuff.

It is accepted that all five were victims. There was some doubt regarding Elizabeth Stride as she was unmutilated apart from her cut throat, but most theorists think that the killer was disturbed by Louis Diemschutz's arrival as the blood was still flowing when the body was discovered. She was the first victim on the night of the so called double event.
The attempt to include Martha Tabram into the list of dead was mainly the work of the journalists who were trying to drum up as much coverage as possible. Murder was not uncommon in the East End and it is more likely that Tabram was such a victim, there was not sufficient evidence to link her with the later murders.
Mary Kelly is a puzzle.She had been living with Joe Barnett but he left her when she started having other prostitutes round to stay, although he remained on friendly terms with her. Her identification must have been guesswork judging by the amount of mutilation evident in the photographs taken at the scene. As "Ducky" Mallard from NCIS would say, she was a real meat puzzle. Three people claimed to have seen her several hours after the time of death, Caroline Maxwell, Maurice Lewis and an unnamed woman.There was also some controversary over the inquest. Is it possible that the body was not Kelly? In my opinion it is possible but not probable, maybe some future publication will turn up something new.