mixing first legion & K&C (1 Viewer)

[Robin Hood]

The K&C figures look large and clumsy compared to FL and the FL figures are superior sculpts, I am slightly ( And I mean only slightly dissapointed with FL paint jobs) the figures on the website look great but in the flesh the production figures painted finish are not that great. Or not as great as FL would have us believe. I would prefer to collect FL to K&C from a diversity and accuracy of scale perspective expensive for level of painting can be my only minor gripe. That said painting is an slight improvement on other naps I own but not what its is bulled up to be. Unfortunately.

 

[IXEC]

The K&C figures look large and clumsy compared to FL and the FL figures are superior sculpts, I am slightly ( And I mean only slightly dissapointed with FL paint jobs) the figures on the website look great but in the flesh the production figures painted finish are not that great. Or not as great as FL would have us believe. I would prefer to collect FL to K&C from a diversity and accuracy of scale perspective expensive for level of painting can be my only minor gripe. That said painting is an slight improvement on other naps I own but not what its is bulled up to be. Unfortunately.

Robin Hood,

Welcome aboard

I'll wait to judge for myself when I purchase the Samurai range.

 

[Spitfrnd]

The K&C figures look large and clumsy compared to FL and the FL figures are superior sculpts, I am slightly ( And I mean only slightly dissapointed with FL paint jobs) the figures on the website look great but in the flesh the production figures painted finish are not that great. Or not as great as FL would have us believe. I would prefer to collect FL to K&C from a diversity and accuracy of scale perspective expensive for level of painting can be my only minor gripe. That said painting is an slight improvement on other naps I own but not what its is bulled up to be. Unfortunately.

Welcome fair Robin. That is interesting, from the 50 or so I have so far, the actual figures have looked better than the pictures on the site. I certainly agree on the sculpting and diversity however.

 

[petebuster1]

The K&C figures look large and clumsy compared to FL and the FL figures are superior sculpts, I am slightly ( And I mean only slightly dissapointed with FL paint jobs) the figures on the website look great but in the flesh the production figures painted finish are not that great. Or not as great as FL would have us believe. I would prefer to collect FL to K&C from a diversity and accuracy of scale perspective expensive for level of painting can be my only minor gripe. That said painting is an slight improvement on other naps I own but not what its is bulled up to be. Unfortunately.

I have seen better but then your looking at £90 + a figure rather than £40 and they are the top quality russian figures. Imo yes they are more expensive but the painting quality is far superior to any other manufacturer that produces in fairly large numbers of a specific period,certainly far better than K&C.
I dont like the phrase toy soldier but in comaparison they make K&C's look exactly that.I have 29 so far and cant fault the painting at all and they look far more realistic,accurate,better poses and imo a much better scale than anything else on the market.
I also think they look as good in the flesh as in the pics,did you get a dud one by any chance?

 

[King's Man]

The FL painting is amazing consentient. Every figure is beautifully painted to the highest standards. I have never been disappointed.

King's Man

 

[OzDigger]

First Legion are around 54 mm and K & C figures are at least 60 mm and above so its little wonder that the FL figures will look finer but to me the K & C versions look more realistic and visually pleasing. I guess as in most things in life it comes down to each persons individual taste. With the unmounted figures you really need to make a choice, either FL or K & C because they don't mix well together, at least imo. Of course there is always the option to display them on different shelves

 

[petebuster1]

First Legion are around 54 mm and K & C figures are at least 60 mm and above so its little wonder that the FL figures will look finer but to me the K & C versions look more realistic and visually pleasing. I guess as in most things in life it comes down to each persons individual taste. With the unmounted figures you really need to make a choice, either FL or K & C because they don't mix well together, at least imo. Of course there is always the option to display them on different shelves

Well yes each to their own,though i agree i think you have pick one or the other unless you happen to have plenty of cash,though i'm not sure how you can think K&C's are more realistic????????? i like K&C but in terms of realism they are inferior to FL in painting quality(some poorly painted features on K&C figures),accuracy, oversized features (hands,rifles,muskets too thick and too short with the naps,)some parts too shiny and unrealistic, not features i would describe as being more realistic.
I pressume you've never seen FL figures?

 

[Fusilier]

The way I look at it, K & C looks more like what I would expect from a high quality toy soldier manufacturer. Which is just what they are supposed to be. First Legion looks more like what I have seen from scale model makers. The painting is more subdued and detail oriented. Also, and it has been mentioned before, K & C's figures look more 'chunky', while First Legion's are better proportioned.

At the same time, while First Legion is more per figure in cost, you also get better sculpting. For example, look at the fact that First Legion sculpts the canteen strap when the strap runs from the figure body to the canteen itself. K & C just paints the canteen strap on the body and attaches the canteen to the figure. Which is fine, it is just whether that matters to you or not, and consequently, what you want to pay for.

Noah

 

[petebuster1]

The way I look at it, K & C looks more like what I would expect from a high quality toy soldier manufacturer. Which is just what they are supposed to be. First Legion looks more like what I have seen from scale model makers. The painting is more subdued and detail oriented. Also, and it has been mentioned before, K & C's figures look more 'chunky', while First Legion's are better proportioned.

At the same time, while First Legion is more per figure in cost, you also get better sculpting. For example, look at the fact that First Legion sculpts the canteen strap when the strap runs from the figure body to the canteen itself. K & C just paints the canteen strap on the body and attaches the canteen to the figure. Which is fine, it is just whether that matters to you or not, and consequently, what you want to pay for.

Noah

Yes all down to personal choice, pay a bit more for better quality or less for lesser quality,you get what you pay for.
Also depends what each individual wants for or from their figures

 

[OzDigger]

Well yes each to their own,though i agree i think you have pick one or the other unless you happen to have plenty of cash,though i'm not sure how you can think K&C's are more realistic????????? i like K&C but in terms of realism they are inferior to FL in painting quality(some poorly painted features on K&C figures),accuracy, oversized features (hands,rifles,muskets too thick and too short with the naps,) not features i would describe as being more realistic.
I pressume you've never seen FL figures?

I only collect WWII figures and mix K & C, Figarti and Honour Bound products in my collection. I don't have any Napoleonic figures but I recently had an opportunity to handle, inspect and compare K & C Nap figures and Cavalry to First Legion versions.

I don't know enough about the relative sizes of the weapons of the time to form an opinion on correct equipment sizes but the heads and hands of both products were within natural proportions. Of course the K & C figures had larger hands, heads and bodies than the FL figures, but that is because the K&C figures were LARGER.

When I looked at the figures up close I noted that the FL figures had a bit more detail than the K & C figures. However, when I resumed a more normal viewing distance (two to three feet) the detail difference was hardly noticeable. The K & C display was much more colorful and attractive whereas the FL display was washed out looking and rather bland.

And before you brand me as some kind of biased K & C collector. I can assure you that I am not backward in making critical comments about K & C products when I feel it necessary, and I'm sure Andy from K & C could confirm this if given the opportunity

At the end of the day each collector will choose what style they prefer. Some collectors will prefer the more faded look of the FL figures with a bit more detail and some will prefer the more vivid colors of the K & C product.

 

[King's Man]

To each his/her own.

King's Man

 

[Spitfrnd]

I have no desire to criticize K&C and my remarks here are offered simply in response to certain observations with which I do not agree, as they apply to the Napoleonic ranges.

As has been observed and discussed by many, supporters and critics alike, the heads and hands of K & C figures are large relative to their height and bodies and the weapons are proportionate to the hands. That has been justified by the company and its supporters as an artistic choice but it is a fact. K&C bodies are also generally acknowledged to very well fed. Whether this is good or bad is up to the collector.

It is true that the detail between the FL figures and the K & C figures is less obvious with increasing distance. To me it is obvious beyond a normal three foot viewing distance. It is also true that the colors of K & C figures appear more intense than First Legion colors. Whether this is more attractive or a virtue or not is also largely subjective but there is little doubt that the First Legion colors seem more representative of real cloth and dies, real wood and metal and real leather, especially after it has been in the field. They hardly look washed out or bland unless one thinks that the reality of those materials is bland. Perhaps it is better to say that K&C colors look like they have been polished (nearly to a gloss) for a parade and First Legion colors look like they have been on campaign. Again, which one prefers is a matter of their choice

 

[OzDigger]

I have no desire to criticize K&C and my remarks here are offered simply in response to certain observations with which I do not agree, as they apply to the Napoleonic ranges.

As has been observed and discussed by many, supporters and critics alike, the heads and hands of K & C figures are large relative to their height and bodies and the weapons are proportionate to the hands. That has been justified by the company and its supporters as an artistic choice but it is a fact. K&C bodies are also generally acknowledged to very well fed. Whether this is good or bad is up to the collector.

It is true that the detail between the FL figures and the K & C figures is less obvious with increasing distance. To me it is obvious beyond a normal three foot viewing distance. It is also true that the colors of K & C figures appear more intense than First Legion colors. Whether this is more attractive or a virtue or not is also largely subjective but there is little doubt that the First Legion colors seem more representative of real cloth and dies, real wood and metal and real leather, especially after it has been in the field. They hardly look washed out or bland unless one thinks that the reality of those materials is bland. Perhaps it is better to say that K&C colors look like they have been polished (nearly to a gloss) for a parade and First Legion colors look like they have been on campaign. Again, which one prefers is a matter of their choice

After reading the above I have just had another look at my hundreds of K & C WWII figures, and they all look like well proportioned and handsome dudes, with no big heads or large hands.

Consequently I will deny your "it is a fact" statement, it's just a difference of opinion between us, but that's not a first as you well know

 

[Harrytheheid]

I'll wait to judge for myself when I purchase the Samurai range.

Did you get any of the Samurai range yet IXEC..??
If so, then what do you think of them..??

I reckon SAM002 is almost one of the best painted figures in my entire collection.
They're a bit different in sculpting style from the East of India Samurai range, as you'd expect, but I think the EoI figures compare well with FL despite the relative age of the EoI figures.

I can hardly wait for the next FL Samurai releases though.

Cheers
Harry

 

[IXEC]

No not yet, Harry.

Maybe In 3 or 4 weeks.


Cheers

 

[Spitfrnd]

It would seem some here missed the great "hands" discussion.
http://www.treefrogtreasures.com/forum/showthread.php?t=12600&highlight=hands&page=5
If that is not helpful, perhaps they could contact Louis or Rick.

 

[OzDigger]

The "hands discussion", which involved about four people (not "many" in my opinion) indicated that the heads and hands of some early K & C figures were made slightly larger so the model figure would appear to have more realist proportions. If that's still the case, then clearly the method works well as all my K & C figures appear to have properly proportioned heads and hands.

I understand a similar scale trick has to be used when painting scale model vehicles. If you spray a model car with the same paint used on a real car it will appear to be a different shade. Apparently all due to changes in the perspective of the human eye.

 

[Spitfrnd]

For those that understand, no explanation is necessary; for those who do not, no explanation is possible.

Cognitive dissonance my old friend
I have come to talk to you again
Because a vision slowly creeping
Left its seeds while I was sleeping
And the vision that was planted in my brain
Still remains
Within the sound of silence.

 

[jazzeum]

For those that understand, no explanation is necessary; for those who do not, no explanation is possible.

Cognitive dissonance my old friend
I have come to talk to you again
Because a vision slowly creeping
Left its seeds while I was sleeping
And the vision that was planted in my brain
Still remains
Within the sound of silence.

Cue in Simon and Garfunkel

 

[Spitfrnd]

Cue in Simon and Garfunkel

Indeed, few better.