Yes I saw him run into the ref and duck down at one point...But I can't blame him for not wanting to run into Ray Lewis....Its not good for one's health:wink2:.....Also Brad makes a good point he has nothing to prove at this point and does not want to leave the game a cripple.
Nfl 2012 season!!!! (1 Viewer)
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Yes I saw him run into the ref and duck down at one point...But I can't blame him for not wanting to run into Ray Lewis....Its not good for one's health:wink2:.....Also Brad makes a good point he has nothing to prove at this point and does not want to leave the game a cripple.
You and me both buddy.....my tri days are over for the most part....The older I get the faster I was.{sm4}
Warrior
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At one point, he wanted to be known as the greatest of all time, he won the off season workout warrior award several times; since he met his wife, he's changed his tune, which is fine.
We all have our priorities, Tom's got his, good for him.
Unitas will always be #1, Montana #2....................
If Bert Jones (Colts QB) was not so hell bent to keep trying to runover linebackers...he would have definitely been a HOF quarterback and "may"?? have broken Unitas records....One of the strongest arms I have ever seen... bar none...Similar to Elway and Favre.
Come on, youse guys. Brady is one of the top 2 Qb's currently on the field in skill, and #1 if counting career acomplishments. 3 SB wins is nothing to sneeze at. Brady may be the enemy, but he scares me every time he is on the field. -- Al
Bert had a rocket. It is too bad he couldn't stay healthy. He should have lasted longer than 9 seasons. If he had, maybe the Colts would still be in Baltimore, where they belong. :wink2: -- Al
Brad, I think that's part of the reason, Baltimore just wouldn't give Irsay what he wanted and attempted to go the route of eminent domain on Irsay to keep the team in Baltimore. Irsay then bolted before the courts interferred. I was just speculating that had Jones stayed healthy, and the Colts therefore continued to field a competitive team, it might not have led Irasy to panic and leave Baltimore like he did. -- Al
Louis Badolato
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I understand Unitas # 1, but why Montana # 2? Because of his 4 titles? What about Otto Graham, who played 10 seasons in the NFL, took his team to 9 championship games and won 7 NFL titles? He was 114-20 in the regular season, 9-3 in the playoffs, and still holds the NFL career record for the most yards per pass attempt, playing at a time when the rules favored defense. Why does nobody ever mention him as the best of all time? For my money, his accomplishments blow every other QB's away, but you never hear him discussed as among the best.
Good points, Louis. IMO, Graham is overlooked because of the perception that he was mearly a cog (although an important cog) in the machine-like Cleveland team that Paul Brown had built. Graham was a low-key personality who did his job in a highly efficient but quiet manner and was kind of put in the shadow by Paul Brown's personality. Graham SHOULD be in any conversation about all-time great Qbs. -- Al
jazzeum
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Al,
Sometimes you never know with these owners. The Dodgers moved when they were still relatively good (although the team was decaying) and the Browns moved to Baltimore when they were having a good season (before Modell's announcement).
I don't think performance figures into it as much as we'd like to think.
Louis Badolato
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The "cog in the machine" point is well taken, but can't the same argument be made with regard to Montana? Once he left, the 49ers won another Superbowl with Steve Young, who threw more touchdown passes to Jerry Rice than Montana did, in the same "West Coast Offense" system created by Bill Walsh, which was years ahead of its time.
I think the real reason is that he played in Cleveland, not a high profile City, for a franchise which hasn't won anything since 1964. Plus, he played before a lot of the pundits on TV naming the "best ever" were even born.
The 'cog' point could be made for Montana and certainly for Bart Starr of Lombardi's machine in Green Bay. Starr is the perfect example of a good Qb being in the right situation to become a big winner. Starr was not a spectacular Qb (his career passing numbers are surprisingly pedestrian), but he was an excellent Qb to plug into Lombardi's machine and run it the way it needed to run. It is often not realized that Starr never threw more than 16 Td passes or for more than 2438 yards in any season of his career. All he did was win, like Graham. Low-key, under the radar personalities on teams with larger than life head coach's who built and controlled every aspect of operations. The point about Graham and the time distance from his accomplishments is also a good one. I fear what was accomplished by many of the earlier players is long forgotten by most, pundits and fans alike. -- Al
Very true....Good points about Bart Starr and Otto Graham....But regarding Brady it has clearly been shown that he can be stopped with a strong pass rush. He does not like to be hit...... Given too much time to throw he and Welker are a deadly combination. As far as pure passing talent and toughness Terry Bradshaw had 4 superbowl wins.... But he also had the steal curtain which did not hurt his winning percentage....bottom line: one man does not a team make.eg Dan Marino
Combat
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Hasn't the "Puppy Bowl" run its course? I see this thing on all day long on Super Bowl Sunday. It doesn't seem to have any purpose except to fill time with cute dogs running around a doggy-sized football stadium. Who watches this sort of thing for hours on end? Maybe they should put some antler spray on them and liven things up this year.
Bradshaw is another Qb whose lifetime passing numbers are not an indication of his importance and success. He had some big years and some down years and ended up with 2 more Td passes than interceptions lifetime. Not impressive. But his post-season performances rank amongst the best all-time. He has a 14-5 lifetime post-season record and, as you pointed out, 4 SB wins. He didn't win pretty but he won and in the end that is his measure of greatness. Marino is the perfect example of not being able to do it all yourself. He is the best passer I have ever seen, yet never was able to win the big one. He was 8-10 post-season. His teams were never quite good enough. Too bad as he was a lot of fun to watch. -- Al
sammy719
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With numbers like Otto G. had I understand you point Louis, no doubt he deserves to be up there with the best of them, and only 10 years in the league...Sammy
Warrior
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Montana is #2 because he's 4-0 in the Super Bowl and prior to Brady winning vs the Texans, he had the most playoff wins with 16.
Montana never soiled himself in the playoffs like Brady did in the 2008 and 2012 Super Bowls or in the AFCCG this year.
Since the Patriots won the Super Bowl in 2005, Brady is 7-7 in his last 14 playoff games including two Super Bowl losses and a 2-2 record in the AFCCG.
Montana is and always will be a better QB IMO.
And sorry, I am not familiar with Otto Graham, did his family invent the cracker?
jazzeum
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You're joking, right?
Louis Badolato
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You are a very funny man, my friend . . . did his family invent the cracker . . . I'm still laughing about that one.
But as great as Montana was, and I am not trying to take anything away from him -- I still think the only mistake Giants GM George Young ever made in the draft was taking Phil Simms over Montana, whom I desperately wanted the Giants to draft after his performance in the 1979 Cotton Bowl -- but to my recollection, he also got the snot beaten out of himself a few times in the playoffs, physically (Giants 1986 Divisional Round and 1990 NFC Championship Game) and on the scoreboard (Giants 1985 17-3 and 1986 49-3; Vikings 1987 36-24; Buffalo 1993 30-13). With the exception of two losses to Baltimore (2009 Divisional Round 33-14 and 2013 AFC Championship Game 28-13) for the most part Tom Brady's playoff losses are by 4 points or less. And I don't think Tom Brady every had as good a team around him as Joe Montana did.