jazzeum
Four Star General
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One error in my post, which doesn't make sense. The last word in the first paragraph should have said "American."
One error in my post, which doesn't make sense. The last word in the first paragraph should have said "American."
Gideon
Command Sergeant Major
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Yeah!, I see your point. But let me Find a different way of explaining it. Lets say You have Gold in your possesion, you like seeing it, you like holding it. It has this shine that you love. Now, Gold lets say becomes abundant, it becomes as common as a common Rock. If you are an Investor, You will throw it away, like a common rock. You will be upset as *#!&.
But, if you are a collector. Not upset. Because you still love looking at it, You feel happy holding it, And You still like/love that shine. Then, You are a collector.even though, You have something as common as a common rock.
A true collector loves what he has, and Does not attach anything to what he has as a monetary investment plain and simple .
I place a value on what I own. Whether I've paid a lot for it or not.
When the time comes to sell something, I have still enjoyed having, inspecting, displaying, dare I say "playing" with it, etc.
I don't merely throw anything away as you describe. Very few do.
Get over your labels, please. There lots of different people on this board with different ways of collecting, buying, selling, trading, etc.
There are 1700 members on this forum. I am pretty sure you could get 1700 different definitions to what a "collector" is and as many definitions as to how they value their collection and feel about their hobby. We should just let all this go and enjoy our hobby as we see fit. -- Al
thebritfarmer
Moderator
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I quite agree and the sarcastic comments grow tiresome too !!
Njja
1st Lieutenant
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Reading over the last 3 pages I failed to see any sarcasm simply the exchange of ideas.
Did I miss something?
theBaron
Major
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- 10,351
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Reading over the last 3 pages I failed to see any sarcasm simply the exchange of ideas.
Did I miss something?
Well, I did smart off that someone should appoint a toy soldier czar to set prices, back towards the beginning of the thread. Early on, there was a definite "levelling" tone, if you will, whose logical end would be a redistribution of figures to all, according to each collector's need, and which implied that manufacturers make enough money, so they should offer their wares at lower prices.
But as I said, I was just smartin' off.
Prost!
Brad
Cyber Field Marshall
Sergeant Major
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Interesting thread. Like it or not there is no better thermometer for the desirability of our collectibles than Ebay. Ebay is a great proxy for the monetary value K&C collectors put on their pieces in the secondary market. There really is no arguing it. Some things are more valuable than others and collectors will pay up for the items that are felt to be more collectible. What I find most interesting isn't arguing the merits of who is a true collector or who isn't in it for the right reasons but what value certain pieces can attain. I must say over the years I have been continually amazed. Some pieces I think are not so great end up being bid up and others I think are gold get discounted, it really is hit and miss so speculating could be hazardous to your financial health.
ecuriel
Corporal
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Sorry, I've cornered the market on those. It's going to cost you dearly.
kogu
2nd Lieutenant
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Good one, George. I'm still holding onto a box full of "pet rocks" for resale when the price for rocks goes back up.
-- AlIf a seller asks for more than 50% above retail cost for "RETIRED" K/C items...Boycott them...(The concept of "RETIRED" is a flamming joke anyway)....and yes I believe shill-bidding goes on more than most people think on e-bay......With a difficult economy few people have money to burn.....Ridiculous Prices are just that....No need to get taken.....It has become a buyers market.....GOOD FOR COLLECTORS.....BAD NEWS... for the Horders and Speculators.....Also keep in mind that other manufacturers like Figarti and First Legion are producing better products....New items are being produced constantly....NO NEED TO BE TAKEN on overpriced retired K/C items that are not even up to current standards
Cyber Field Marshall
Sergeant Major
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Don't get taken.....They are only toys....If you want to make money get a real job.....For those of us who work hard for our money..."we will not pay ridiculous prices".....I emphatically state.....BOYCOTT THEM......Do not play this fool's game any longer.....Believe it or not you can live without these items.........and yes the next generation will not be that interested in toy trains nor toy soldiers....there will definitely be a decrease in interest in this hobby....The speculators and horders do little to help the future of the hobby.
I'm not so sure our hobby is going to slowly die out because there will be fewer collectors in the future. True when I was a kid everyone had a few toy soldiers. Now ofcourse very few kids do however the interest in history is still there. Witness all the history majors in school and the popularity of specialty T.V. channels. Maybe not every neighbour has toy soldiers or plays soldier in our neighbourhoods however there are way more people in the world so in aggregate I don't think the numbers of collectors will decrease, they might even rise. People more than ever in other parts of the world that were not traditionally toy soldier markets are now starting to have discretionary incomes and are entering the market, this is a really exciting development. I really believe the internet has saved our hobby by linking us together despite our geographies to keep interest alive.
I think the biggest danger to the hobby is the exponential price increases we are witnessing. Case in point, a few years ago the industry leader sold a tank for around $100, now they push $200-300! A group of four soldiers was under $100, now each one is $33! All this in a few years whereas before it was stable for over a decade. Something has to give. If anything it backs up my previous point that more people are in the hobby and driving demand up and therefore prices. O.K. my crystal ball is clouding over, I can't see the future anymore!
Spitfrnd
Banned
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This is an odd thread but it seems to be of interest so what's the harm? For that matter, not that I've seen any here but what's wrong with a little sarcasm; sometimes I think we take this all too seriously.
Iron Brigade
Command Sergeant Major
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Dear Tom:
I would have to agree with you at least with regards to older King & Country retired sets. No doubt the poor overall economy has reduced prices some what this past year or so for resale of retired K&C sets, etc. But many older retired K&C sets still sell with large profits. As for those people who think that in the cases where some K&C sets or others sell on eBay for such huge profits that it is "criminal". Remember that you are not forced to buy anything that you think costs too much. Plus, K&C and other makers are always coming out with many new sets at normal retail prices for collectors to purchase. I have financed many new K&C sets by selling old retired K&C sets. I have many times, but not always made profits. Those collectors who buy extra sets for resale only later are still taking a chance relative to later profits.
Best regards, Gary 4/3/2010
tdubel
Major
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This is a little harsh. Only you can decide what is best for you, your opinion may not be best for others. As to who is the best, again all personal preference. Kind of like what's on tv, if you dont like it, dont buy it. Me, I put a value on stuff I can't get easily, so I am willing to pay b/c I like it. That is my collecting trait, I am a completist, I like having rare things that not many others have, but that's me.
Also, let's revisit history here, some of the old K&C pieces had high price tags, $384 for wooden tanks that now sell in the 1500 to 2000 range depending on the piece, why? B/c there were very few made, and collectors value them highly. NO one involved in these transactions is in it for profit, they are simply selling their collections and new collectors are buying them.
Let's take the Normandy Village, retail was $50 or so, now sell over 200 per piece. It is an in demand item b/c they are facades that work well in bookshelf displays, small dios. The potential NEW ones will be full bldgs, therefore a different type of collection, so the old ones may be worth more to someone b/c of this issue.
To simply state that don't pay over 50% of retail and Boycott is ridiculous. This is a free market at work, a small audience, yes, but its a market. The value is what the value is the day an item sells.
TD
tdubel
Major
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ITs a beautiful day when an unreconstructed Southern man and a Iron Brigade Yank can agree!
TD
Warrior
Lieutenant General
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I'll armwrestle you for it; on second thought, forget it as you'd just rip my arm out of the socket............
marco55
Brigadier General
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I think some of the people complaining is because of being frustrated of not being able to afford the high prices some pieces command.The more affluent dosen't have this problem.I believe in the free market but I also understand the frustration of those who can't afford these high prices and really want a piece for their collection.
Mark
Mark
Phantom Warrior
Major
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I believe in the free market. If demand pushes the price of an old figure up to 10x it's retail price - so be it. If people want to spend the money - that's fine with me. I would love one of the K&C backlot buildings, and could probably get the one I want from a fellow collector for $1000. But that is way beyond what I could afford.
But I don't begrudge the collectors who can afford it nor do I think it is unfair to me that I can't. There are many things in life I can't get, and there are hundreds of figures I want and can afford.
Nor do I think it wrong to attend a Show, receive a show piece figure, and sell it for good money on ebay. In order to get the piece, it had to be earned by attending the show and isn't depriving someone else of the show piece.
The only strong objection I have is when a newly released item is in short supply and people buy some with only the intention to immediately resell at a high price. That may actually take the item from being purchased by a collector, and while not wrong, I have an opinion of people like that.
Terry
But I don't begrudge the collectors who can afford it nor do I think it is unfair to me that I can't. There are many things in life I can't get, and there are hundreds of figures I want and can afford.
Nor do I think it wrong to attend a Show, receive a show piece figure, and sell it for good money on ebay. In order to get the piece, it had to be earned by attending the show and isn't depriving someone else of the show piece.
The only strong objection I have is when a newly released item is in short supply and people buy some with only the intention to immediately resell at a high price. That may actually take the item from being purchased by a collector, and while not wrong, I have an opinion of people like that.
Terry