Tariffs - The Elephant in the Room (3 Viewers)

[Jumper]

Many American businesses and normal citizens are moving out of the US many of which are settling in Ireland, Italy and Portugal. Some have actually moved to these Islands. FL and Britains must start considering opening up shop in Europe to distribute and sell all over the EU.

 

[sfarrelly]

Many American businesses and normal citizens are moving out of the US many of which are settling in Ireland, Italy and Portugal. Some have actually moved to these Islands. FL and Britains must start considering opening up shop in Europe to distribute and sell all over the EU.

Thats all very well but tarrfif's are coming between the Europe and USA too so that wont work.

Best solution is use the UK. We have no tarriff's from China and none with the USA so far, as a long as we get a free trade deal with the USA over the line which I think will happen.

 

[Obee]

People really need a crash course as to how tariffs actually work.

WE as importers are getting whacked, it's moronic and idiotic.

Yes, but that wat the majority of US voters wanted, isn't that democracy???

John

 

[Jumper]

Thats all very well but tarrfif's are coming between the Europe and USA too so that wont work.

Best solution is use the UK. We have no tarriff's from China and none with the USA so far, as a long as we get a free trade deal with the USA over the line which I think will happen.

Currently when buying from E Bay or any other US Supplier we pay between 60 to 80 Dollars postage plus US Taxes and then on arrival we have to pay duty and another 18% VAT on the total amount. So a model costing 400 Dollars will cost us more then 200 Dollars in additional costs.

I would honestly like to buy the new first legion Elefant at 430 Dollars, but the additional tariffs and taxes plus postage makes the model extraordinarily prohibitive for us in the EU. With these additional tariffs it’s going to be outrightly no go for me.

The only way to make such models less expensive for us in the EU is to have FL or Britain take up shop in any EU country and import directly their products from China straight to their EU Shop - then distribute to EU Countries from there.

Unfortunately setting up shop in the UK will not solve the problem due to BREXIT. Infact many companies in the UK co-located in the EU to prevent the side effects brought about by BREXIT since they relied on the much larger EU Market to operate.

This world has become so so ridiculous - 30/40 years ago globalization was the big thing - globalization was on everyone tongue. Now everything has been reversed and I do not blame the politicians for this - i blame the GREEDY CORPORATIONS - they brought this and we have to pay the price whilst they get richer and richer.

They left the west for China and other Asian countries to tap cheap Labour - even child labor and in some cases even slaves to increase their profits. Eventually all these nations grew whilst China become a super economy.


The situation is even worse now since DT is being seen as an unreliable/unstable international partner and ally and many countries will be extremely cautious doing business with the US and they will be tempted to move elsewhere or someone else takes over the leadership of the free world. This will have severe consequences on the US and the Dollar. But that another topic.

 

[Jumper]

First Legion and Britain could also solve this issue by making their products available to the EU and elsewhere from China, Hong Kong.

Postage is also much cheaper from China.

 

[Panzer ace]

People really need a crash course as to how tariffs actually work.

As Matt pointed out, it's not a "hard" 20%, the tariff is paid by the importer at a 20% rate on the declared invoice value; since as an importer of toy soldiers I buy at wholesale/a discount, it's not 20%, it's lower than that.

But it's still a number that stings.

There is no plan/idea as to how this will be handled by toy soldier importers, we are all independent business owners and we each have to decide what's the best way to address this.

IMO, the manufacturers and the importers need to work together to try to figure this out, we as importers need an open dialog with the manufacturers to try to figure out how to handle this.

Not to get political, but anyone with an 8th grade civics class understanding of how tariffs work knows they are not a good idea and the point behind it is misguided.

China as a country does not pay a cent in tariffs, nor do the manufacturers, it's the IMPORTER in the US who pays the tariff; if the goal of this is to punish China, they are missing the target, WE as importers are getting whacked, it's moronic and idiotic.

The hope is cooler heads prevail here and this blanket, across the board tariff on goods from China gets rescinded, but I'm not going to hold my breath on that.

As a full time dealer since 1997, I've weathered the economic impact of the horrific events of 9/11, the housing crash of 2008 and the economic impact of COVID; this is another bump in the road that will have to be navigated is all.

George:

Huge tip of the cap for providing an informed and honest perspective.

-Jason

 

[Jumper]

Yes, but that wat the majority of US voters wanted, isn't that democracy???

John

Not all voters usually vote for the same reason. So please don’t blame this on the voters.

 

[Finlome]

So guys, as you know effective March 4th, there will be 20% tariffs on all products coming out of China, where basically all toy soldiers are made. While I do NOT want this discussion to devolve into politics at all, as that's not the point, I'm very curious to hear what effect this may have on the large US collector base out there. Previously, there was that $800 USD exception with no tax, that's gone now. We are among just a few MFR's that primarily warehouse and ship from the USA. But with 20% Tariffs, it's unlikely we will continue to do so, particularly as more than half our customer base isn't even in the USA.

So what I'm wondering is are you all concerned about buying power and increased costs? Do you feel that MFR's like us or dealers should just try to absorb the costs, which realistically probably isn't 100% possible?

Again, please, not politics. That's irrelevant. We are where we are, doesn't matter how or why we got here. And while it could all just go away with a new trade deal, which i do find a realistic possibility, let's pretend it won't.

Share your thoughts on how this may impact your collecting habits and if it's something you're concerned about.



PS - NO POLITICS.

Reroute via Singapore, it’s a tax free city or to EU.

 

[Finlome]

No FL or Britain's mate

Send via singapore, I do that and pay zero tax duties on receipt in EU lol

 

[mestell]

Yes, but that wat the majority of US voters wanted, isn't that democracy???
John

Not all voters usually vote for the same reason. So please don’t blame this on the voters.

The election results was not a mandate nor was it won by a majority. Both candidates received less than 50% of the votes cast/counted. The election was won by a plurality not by a majority. It is estimated that out of the total eligible voters, 36% didn't even vote. This would indicate that more people didn't vote than people who voted for either candidate.

Mike

 

[Warrior]

Yes, but that wat the majority of US voters wanted, isn't that democracy???

John

Americans voted in majority having no clue how tariffs actually work.

And again, trying to keep politics out of it, but the alternative would have been MUCH worse, so pick your poison as they say.

 

[Warrior]

Currently when buying from E Bay or any other US Supplier we pay between 60 to 80 Dollars postage plus US Taxes and then on arrival we have to pay duty and another 18% VAT on the total amount. So a model costing 400 Dollars will cost us more then 200 Dollars in additional costs.

I would honestly like to buy the new first legion Elefant at 430 Dollars, but the additional tariffs and taxes plus postage makes the model extraordinarily prohibitive for us in the EU. With these additional tariffs it’s going to be outrightly no go for me.

The only way to make such models less expensive for us in the EU is to have FL or Britain take up shop in any EU country and import directly their products from China straight to their EU Shop - then distribute to EU Countries from there.

Unfortunately setting up shop in the UK will not solve the problem due to BREXIT. Infact many companies in the UK co-located in the EU to prevent the side effects brought about by BREXIT since they relied on the much larger EU Market to operate.

This world has become so so ridiculous - 30/40 years ago globalization was the big thing - globalization was on everyone tongue. Now everything has been reversed and I do not blame the politicians for this - i blame the GREEDY CORPORATIONS - they brought this and we have to pay the price whilst they get richer and richer.

They left the west for China and other Asian countries to tap cheap Labour - even child labor and in some cases even slaves to increase their profits. Eventually all these nations grew whilst China become a super economy.

Now the US sees China as a threat but I ask the US - who made China such a strong super economy ? Who ?

The situation is even worse now since DT is being seen as an unreliable/unstable international partner and ally and many countries will be extremely cautious doing business with the US and they will be tempted to move elsewhere or someone else takes over the leadership of the free world. This will have severe consequences on the US and the Dollar. But that another topic.

Yup, corporate greed sums it up well.

When i was a kid growing up in the 60's/70's, almost everything was made in the USA; great quality, affordable prices................but that wasn't enough, greed kicked in, a cheap labor source was found in China, so off the manufacturing went, profits skyrocketed.

And now we're screwed, not to mention, the quality has tanked on most goods, specifically TV's, computers, phones and white goods, products that used to last forever crap out after 3 to 5 years.

"Bringing manufacturing back to the US" is a non starter; paying an American a living wage to assemble such items would make prices skyrocket.

So now thanks to tariffs, prices will go way, way up and we'll go into a recession. Whether the importer pays them solely or they get passed on to the consumer, it's a lose/lose proposition.

 

[FirstLegion]

So as an international buyer from Treefrog etc, we will be paying an extra 20%??

If you buy from someone such as TF or FL directly from our US Warehouse, yes, i would think on some level there could be some effect. However, we see no reason to import products to the USA to pay Tariffs on and then ship around the world. Time for a second non-us based distribution center. My feeling based on my loose thoughts of how we'll proceed is that non-US buyers will be the winners.

 

[Jumper]

So i guess the no politics rule of this thread has flown out the window.

But the thread remained civil and there has been a lot of understanding. Discussing tariffs will certainly nowadays have a political offshoot at one point or another. But so far everyone has been civil and mature.

 

[fmethorst]

And now we're screwed, not to mention, the quality has tanked on most goods, specifically TV's, computers, phones and white goods, products that used to last forever crap out after 3 to 5 years.

This is by design more than where things are manufactured. Manufacturers don't make money on products that last "forever". You used to be able to get spare parts for things too but that has largely disappeared.

 

[Gebhard]

Hope this isn't considered political but unfortunately, the USA is broke we are so far in debt and the spending is so far out of control something has to change.

Like most European countries as well we actually used to make just about everything in house.

I don't think it takes a genius to understand why most goods are now being made elsewhere and why companies from around the world set up shop there.

That's wonderful for those cashing in including us consumers by buying at cheaper cost.

To be fair we have to expect at some point this has to change.

It's unfair for these countries to have it both ways, they want to sell to the world with free trade but hit the rest of the world's goods with taxes and tariffs that price our home-made products as rare luxury imports from the west insuring, they are way too expensive for their citizens to afford and enjoy.

And so, it goes Hopefully I'll still be able to afford the luxuries like imported Bier, Chocolate and maybe that list will now have to grow to include expensive imported goods and toy soldiers made in China. (that sounds funny for a change)

Hey maybe someone will open up shop here or in the west if prices go up too much.

Like they say necessity breeds invention, who knows maybe companies and factories will also no longer feel it a necessity to only sell to the west from abroad and find it a necessity to produce there as well.

Time will tell.

The short answer is we will all have to deal with it best we can, and I plan on doing just that.

 

[Hunter Rose]

Tariffs or not, if First Legion makes some mid-late war SUMMER Heer and SS German tank riders, I'll buy them!

 

[wayne556517]

If you buy from someone such as TF or FL directly from our US Warehouse, yes, i would think on some level there could be some effect. However, we see no reason to import products to the USA to pay Tariffs on and then ship around the world. Time for a second non-us based distribution center. My feeling based on my loose thoughts of how we'll proceed is that non-US buyers will be the winners.

Got room in the garage mate to store and ship out products.

 

[Finlome]

If you buy from someone such as TF or FL directly from our US Warehouse, yes, i would think on some level there could be some effect. However, we see no reason to import products to the USA to pay Tariffs on and then ship around the world. Time for a second non-us based distribution center. My feeling based on my loose thoughts of how we'll proceed is that non-US buyers will be the winners.

Great news… Europe First

I’d ship via Singapore, to US and separately despatch straight to the Free world from china with zero tariffs.

 

[Finlome]

This is by design more than where things are manufactured. Manufacturers don't make money on products that last "forever". You used to be able to get spare parts for things too but that has largely disappeared.

Well no body in Europe buys their crap here. We source from Italy or France for high quality items for the home for example. Ditto cars etc