What are the Forum members reading (4 Viewers)

[OzDigger]

Brad, did you finish Patriot Battles yet? From what you said it seemed the author was into political viewpoints rather than pure military factors.

Well, you might still want to look at it, in your local bookstore, and decide for yourself. I'm only a short way into it, but I'm slowed by my decision to make notes as I go. But it certainly is not a book along the lines of Christopher Duffy's excellent books on the armies of Frederick the Great or Maria Theresa; I expected something like those books, based on the title, and on this blurb on the back cover:

"Michael Stephenson's Patriot Battles is a comprehensive and richly detailed study of the military aspects of the War of Independence, and a fascinating look at the nuts and bolts of eighteenth-century combat"

Imagine how disappointed I was, instead of reading about how a battallion was composed, or why neither side used cavalry that much, I found passages like this:

"One of the leading historians of the War of Independence has called the comparison with the Vietnam war, for example, "overwrought," and there is an understandable instinct to insulate the sanctity of the great war of national liberation from any association with some of the more "awkward" periods of American history. But the comparisons are illuminating because colonial wars share a basic architecture that arises when an occupying power far from the mother country tries to suppress a popular uprising. Also, viewing the War of Independence through the lens of other imperialist wars, particulary America's involvement in Vietnam and Iraq, helps rescue it from the Disney World of history to which it has been consigned." (Patriot Wars, Introduction, p. xix)

Apart from the fact that I don't expect to read the word "Vietnam" in a work on the Revolution, I disagree completely with the characterization of the War for Independence as a war of national liberation. From my reading of English, British and early American history, it was really a civil war, in fact, a continuation of conflicts that sparked the English Civil War, and carried forward to the 18th century. We were not occupied, we were British. Washington, Franklin, Hamilton, Hancock, they all saw themselves as citizens of a British world empire. (I also disagree that the Vietnam war can be characterized as a colonial war, at least, once the French were defeated (in fact, they never should have been allowed back after the Japanese were defeated). It was a civil war, exacerbated by the wider worldwide conflict between the Communists and the West.)

On the next page, Stephenson characterizes the Continental army as an all-volunteer force, like our contemporary Army, and he suggests that those who enlist only do so because of "economic hardship and the chance of betterment". Then he castigates both colonial society and modern American society for a lack of full mobilization and participation in each respective cause:

"The Humvee in the shopping mall is a safer option than the under-armored Humvee in Iraq, and flag-waving in the gated community does not require a bullet-proof vest. Certainly, any idea of sharing the burden more equitably was as politically unacceptable in eighteenth-century as in twenty-first century America." (p. xxi)

Um, where are the color tables of regimental facings?

Oh, then there's this gem, from Chapter 1, "A Choaky Mouthful". After discussing the ethnic background of the soldiers (heavy on Scots, Irish and German immigrants), Stephenson writes this about Von Heer's Provost Corps:

"In a somewhat more sinister example (italics mine-Brad) of the role of Germans in the Continental forces, the Marechaussee Corps, under the Prussian veteran Captain Bartholomew Von Heer ("von" shouldn't be capitalized-this guy was an editor for the Military Book Club?!-Brad), was formed on 27 May 1778 (sic). It was to act as Washington's mounted military police, sometimes being placed behind troops going into battle to prevent desertion, and also to assist the provost marshall in the grisly business of military executions." (p. 30).

"Sinister" Germans?! C'mon! I can picture Otto Prerminger playing Heer in the movie. What is sinister about the provost corps? (Well, if you're in the Army, you probably have a creative answer to that.) This is just crap. Every army had, and has, military police, and just because these were German immigrants, doesn't make them "sinister".

I may just have to get through a little more of this nonsense, to get to some really useful information. But you can decide for yourself. At least it was only sixteen bucks.

Seriously, the biogrpahical blurb on the back cover notes that Stephenson is the "former editor of the Military Book Club and the editor of National Geographic's Battlegrounds: Geography and the History of Warfare. He lives in New York City." Former editor-probably got fired.

Great, now I'm all het up again about how disappointing this book has been!

 

[uksubs]

Just got the latest minichamps King tiger & as its from 503 tank battalion I'm reading German tank Battalion 503

 

[Harrytheheid]

I seem to remeber yuour great ancestro Harry "Anderson" Flashman being in similar predicaments with teh local lasses all over teh world. He aslo had to stoically put up with it I suppose.

Aye, its a tough life - but someone has to live it Damian.
H

 

[theBaron]

Brad, did you finish Patriot Battles yet? From what you said it seemed the author was into political viewpoints rather than pure military factors.

Hi, Digger, not yet, it was so irritating to get through the first chapter that I lost interest. I do intend to complete it, because I'm hoping I'll get to some actual details about day-to-day life in the Continental Army. But in the meantime, I'm working through Boortz' "The FairTax", and I've also read Shep Paine's "How to Build Dioramas", and am almost finished with Thomas Graham's "Aurora Model Kits".

Plus I'm still going through my Thoma anthology. It includes excerpts from his two autobiographical novels, "Lausbubengeschichten" ("Rascal Stories") and "Tante Friede".

But not to worry-I'll give a full book report on "Patriot Battles" when I finish it, especially whether it's worthy of a recommendation.

Prost!
Brad

 

[OzDigger]

Hi, Digger, not yet, it was so irritating to get through the first chapter that I lost interest. I do intend to complete it, because I'm hoping I'll get to some actual details about day-to-day life in the Continental Army. But in the meantime, I'm working through Boortz' "The FairTax", and I've also read Shep Paine's "How to Build Dioramas", and am almost finished with Thomas Graham's "Aurora Model Kits".

Plus I'm still going through my Thoma anthology. It includes excerpts from his two autobiographical novels, "Lausbubengeschichten" ("Rascal Stories") and "Tante Friede".

But not to worry-I'll give a full book report on "Patriot Battles" when I finish it, especially whether it's worthy of a recommendation.

Prost!
Brad

Brad, I'm looking forward to that book report, but if the author is that irritating, why bother to finish his book, surely there must be less irritating books on the subject

 

[Harrytheheid]

I seem to remeber yuour great ancestro Harry "Anderson" Flashman being in similar predicaments with teh local lasses all over teh world. He aslo had to stoically put up with it I suppose.

Hey Damian,
Do you remember that great old Rod Stewart song? Something like "Tom Truabert's Blues", wasn't it?
H

 

[theBaron]

Brad, I'm looking forward to that book report, but if the author is that irritating, why bother to finish his book, surely there must be less irritating books on the subject

Well, I'm trying to be as fair as possible, I don't feel I can condemn the book, if I don't finish it. Who knows, the author might still redeem himself.

 

[Ken & Ericka Osen/H&A Studio]

Hello All,
Well it seems I cannot read just one book at a time. I usually have 3 or 4 going at once. Right now I am reading Flames Across the Border by Pierre Berton, rereading Up Front by Bill Mauldin (a WWII Classic if there ever was one!), Victorian Working Women by Richard Hiley and Lobcouse and Spotted Dog, a companion recipe book to the Aubrey/Maturin novels by Patrick O'Brian.
I just finished rereading the first of the Flashman books, which are wonderful, but I have to say that my favourite G.M.Fraser book is The General Danced at Dawn. It is the tale of a Highland regiment post WWII, very funny and well worth reading! But then having grown up around a highland regiment, I am slightly biased.
All the Best,
Ericka

PS- Peter if you enjoyed The life of Billy Yank/Johnny Reb, I would recommend Hardtack & Coffee or the Unwritten Story of Army Life by John D. Billings first published in 1888. It is a wonderful book to read!

 

[damian]

Hey Damian,
Do you remember that great old Rod Stewart song? Something like "Tom Truabert's Blues", wasn't it?
H

Hate to quibble Harry but I think it is a Tom Waits song. ALthough Rod did a great version of it.
Get hold of Tom Waits' Swordfishtrombone or Rain Dogs you won't regret it

 

[nasirkasmani]

nice to see the H back in this marsh with us.

Read David Irving's Hitler war, and have to say its excellent stuff.

upon reading the book, i think he's been rather badly misquoted. He never did deny the Holocaust happened, in fact, there were many well detailed instances in the book of the appalling mistreatment and mass murder of Jews and other undesirables.

what got him in the hot soup was that he claimed Hitler did not personally directed the liquidation, rather the unscrupulous henchmen around him who acted like their warlords in their own domain. In this case, Himmler and the SS.

For example, for the night of the long knives, Hitler's list were seven SA member, and when Rohm, decided against committing suicide, the list became eight.

However, without Hitler's pre knowledge, Goering and Himmler added a few on that list and settled some old scores. the list became 82 casualties.

The book potrayed Hitler as an opportunistic, evil and ruthless man - orders to kill commandos, paratroopers, commissars, etc.

But it also portrayed him as easily misinformed and diverted by his closest henchmen, primarily Goring,Bormann,and Himmler.

Not the dominant and all powerful Fuhrer as everybody thought.

 

[Ken & Ericka Osen/H&A Studio]

Hate to quibble Harry but I think it is a Tom Waits song. ALthough Rod did a great version of it.
Get hold of Tom Waits' Swordfishtrombone or Rain Dogs you won't regret it

"A Soldiers Things" on Swordfishtrombone never fails to bring tears to my eyes. Very good albums indeed!
Ericka

 

[Louis Badolato]

Hello All,
Well it seems I cannot read just one book at a time. I usually have 3 or 4 going at once. Right now I am reading Flames Across the Border by Pierre Berton, rereading Up Front by Bill Mauldin (a WWII Classic if there ever was one!), Victorian Working Women by Richard Hiley and Lobcouse and Spotted Dog, a companion recipe book to the Aubrey/Maturin novels by Patrick O'Brian.
I just finished rereading the first of the Flashman books, which are wonderful, but I have to say that my favourite G.M.Fraser book is The General Danced at Dawn. It is the tale of a Highland regiment post WWII, very funny and well worth reading! But then having grown up around a highland regiment, I am slightly biased.
All the Best,
Ericka

PS- Peter if you enjoyed The life of Billy Yank/Johnny Reb, I would recommend Hardtack & Coffee or the Unwritten Story of Army Life by John D. Billings first published in 1888. It is a wonderful book to read!

The General Danced at Dawn is my favorite book of all time, bar none. Have you read the sequals MacAuslan in the Rough and The Shiekh and the Dustbin? I love Dand MacNeil (one of my all time favorite characters), along with Wee Wullie, MacAuslan (Old private Piltdown), Captain Erroll, the Colonel, Forbes ("Heinnie"), but especially Sergeant Major MacDonald ("Six and a half feet of kilted splendor"). I have read all three books at least 15 times. Excellent choice, ken!

 

[Footman]

World War Z - An Oral History of the Zombie Wars by Max Brooks (Mel Brooks son who also wrote or still writes for SNL). He wrote a pretty funny and entertaining book 2-3 years ago called "The Complete Zombie Survival Guide".
In WWZ, the US Army from squares in the plains of the midwest to fight the dead like tha British at Waterloo. Most of the the Army gets wiped out in the 'Battle of Yonkers' where there are more reporters and cameramen than soldiers. The Russians launch headon unorganized attacks like WWII with similar results. China erupts in civil war, there is a creepy scene where a Chinese nuclear sub is hiding on the bottom of the ocean and the sailors can hear the scratching of the dead on the metal hull outside. Once you pick the book up, it is hard to stop reading.

 

[bromhead]

"Tirpitz" and essays on the Defensive fortifications of the Phillipines,1920-42

 

[lancer]

Just read a good one titled "Doomed At The Start: American Pursuit Pilots in the Phillippines, 1941-42". Written by William Bartsch and published by Texas A&M Press in 1992. This is a very readable account of the early air war in the defense of Bataan etc. Got some good photos of P-26, P-35, and P-40's that were the mainstays of the Army Air Corps at the time. Great accounts of little known air battles. -- lancer

 

[Harrytheheid]

Hate to quibble Harry but I think it is a Tom Waits song. ALthough Rod did a great version of it.
Get hold of Tom Waits' Swordfishtrombone or Rain Dogs you won't regret it

I know it's a Tom Waits song - I just reckoned more people would be aware of the RS version - which I just luv ta death - especially when he breaks into THAT national anthem.
Yeah, I have some of Mr Waits stuff on my computer at home; haven't listened to him in yonks.
H

 

[Rob]

I know it's a Tom Waits song - I just reckoned more people would be aware of the RS version - which I just luv ta death - especially when he breaks into THAT national anthem.
Yeah, I have some of Mr Waits stuff on my computer at home; haven't listened to him in yonks.
H

Really like Rods classic stuff,was a real backdrop to my childhood in the seventies.But he really has lost it these days with all these crap cover versions.So many artists and Bands start the old cover version route in the twilight of their careers,give me 'Maggie' or 'You Wear it well' anyday.

Rob

 

[Captain]

I'm reading two at the moment; "Lord Hornblower" Getting close to finally finishing the whole series and, I just started "Death Traps"; a first hand account of being in an ordnance battalion that had to recover and refurb Shermans from Normandy through the end.

 

[lancer]

"Death Traps" is a great book. Lots of info not usually revealed. -- lancer

 

[trooper]

" The Gettysburg Companion", a thick volume which is surely THE one volume work on the battle. Complete orders of battle, equipment, weapons, uniforms, personal accounts, the battle itself day by day with maps showing dispositions and movements. An excellent work for anyone keen on the ACW.