A Sad Day in American History (2 Viewers)

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tdubel said:
Best way to sum this up , is a terrible 2020 for more reasons than I care to type culminated a real low point. Hopefully it is onward and upward on a lot of fronts, strong leadership, strong laws, strong democracy, strong Vaccine and whole lot of positive communication. Oh and a repeal of the State/Local tax limitation would be welcome to those of us in higher taxing jurisdictions........................:)

Keep it light and positive, only way to get through this garbage. I am looking forward to a weekend of sorting toy soldiers, retreating to childhood and letting the grown up worries sit for a bit!

TD
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There’s an old saying, it’s darkest before the dawn. Let’s hope dawn is not that far away.
 
jazzeum said:
The fallacy in your argument is that you are equating what happened after George Floyd’s death and Jacob Blake’s shooting with what happened here. We all decry wanton looting but Wednesday was an organized effort to bring down the government by right wing fascist elements who have been plotting yesterday on the dark web for awhile while the looting we saw in the summer was not on the same scale. It was looting plain and simple. Wednesday was an attempt to stop the results of an election.

They are simply not the same. One was treason and sedition. The other was wanton looting, which isn’t acceptable.
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Brad...

I don't care what the cause was...
rioting is rioting...as looting is looting and as vandalism is vandalism...

that was a federal building in Portland this summer that was being sieged and attacked by an organized effort...
an extremely violent effort...many people were injured...way more than yesterday...

that federal building was part of our government...
I was really disappointed when the Portland police and federal officers arrested these rioters...looters and vandals...
and then they were basically pardoned by the mayor...

I can only hope that an effort to prosecute these Capital Hill vigilantes will receive a harsher outcome than the ones in Portland...
but fair is fair...
they all should be and should have been prosecuted...
 
mikemiller1955 said:
Brad...

I don't care what the cause was...
rioting is rioting...as looting is looting and as vandalism is vandalism...

that was a federal building in Portland this summer that was being sieged and attacked by an organized effort...
an extremely violent effort...many people were injured...way more than yesterday...

that federal building was part of our government...
I was really disappointed when the Portland police and federal officers arrested these rioters...looters and vandals...
and then they were basically pardoned by the mayor...

I can only hope that an effort to prosecute these Capital Hill vigilantes will receive a harsher outcome than the ones in Portland...
but fair is fair...
they all should be and should have been prosecuted...
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What happened in the summer is one thing and we can discuss that separately if you wish but what happened Wednesday is quite another. Don’t put them on the same level. It was an insurrection, an attempt to overthrow the government, incited by the person in charge of the government! People were killed. An officer died trying to protect the government, one of our branches of our government. The Congress was stormed and I hate to think what would have happened had they captured a Democratic congressman or woman. Just consider what happened to two Republican senators. Romney, on the way to Washington, and he flies coach, was harassed and subjected to calls of “traitor” and so forth. Lindsay Graham, on leaving Washington yesterday, was equally vilified. If you say I’m angry, you’re darn right. I’m d@mn mad that this fascist scum incited by Trump and members of Congress brought this assault on our country about.

Well, that’s enough for me in this thread for now.
 
A really important part of history is the heroes who have made it happen. One of these heroes is Officer Brian Sicknick, who was mortally wounded by a fire extinguisher to the head while defending the U.S. Capitol from rioters, a true American patriot: An Iraq War veteran. I just want to express my sincere condolences to his family, and to his fellow Capital Police officers, and thank all of the Capital Police Officers who risked their lives in protecting our Capital this week.
 
Brad...

maybe you missed some of the atrocities committed through the Portland riots...
surrounding the Justice Center and Federal courthouse in Portland...
all depends on what channel you watch...

pipe bombs and weapons were found...
chunks of concrete, fireworks and frozen water battle were hurled at the protectors of their federal building...
violence...looting...arson...damage to property...
there was at least one fatality and 1,000's of people were injured...
pretty unlawful as they tried to storm a government building...

I would of hated to see what these rioters would have done if they captured a Republican politician...

let's be fair...let's treat them all the same...
I wish you held the parties in Portland as responsible for their 130 days of riots...
as you do the rioters at Capital Hill for their attack on a federal building...

I think we should all push aside our Republican or Democratic ideals...
and punish all of these federal building attackers...
 
What I find fascinating is the fact demonstrators on the 6[SUP]th[/SUP] had made no secret of their intensions days, weeks and months before hand and yet the police and security officials are now saying that had little warning. Heck even our own news media down here were reporting about the planned protest action at the senate building days before.

Given what was forecasted to occur and the totally inadequate numbers of police deployed its obvious this was deliberately done to allow things to get out of control.

As for the reasons for that I’ll leave that up to your own imagination.

The people I feel sorry for are the poor cops left hanging in the breeze by their incompetent bosses.
 
Desertkiwi said:
What I find fascinating is the fact demonstrators on the 6[SUP]th[/SUP] had made no secret of their intensions days, weeks and months before hand and yet the police and security officials are now saying that had little warning. Heck even our own news media down here were reporting about the planned protest action at the senate building days before.

Given what was forecasted to occur and the totally inadequate numbers of police deployed its obvious this was deliberately done to allow things to get out of control.

As for the reasons for that I’ll leave that up to your own imagination.

The people I feel sorry for are the poor cops left hanging in the breeze by their incompetent bosses.
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The police being hung out to dry; what else is new in this country.

They do their job and get called out of it.

They stand down as told and get called out for it.

They literally cannot win.

When I was younger, I wanted to follow in my Dad's footsteps and become a Boston Police officer, he was in his early 60's at the time and told me "I'm proud that you want to follow in my footsteps, but I don't want you to, the job has changed so much since I started, I would be worried sick about you during every one of your shifts, I'd never be able to live with myself if something happened to you"..........so that was that and I got into the toy soldier business instead........that was about 26 years ago.

I would have been proud to be a Boston Police officer, but then I never would have met any of you fellas, so there you go...................:wink2:
 
mikemiller1955 said:
George...

you would of been the mayor by now...^&grin
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Biden has tabbed the mayor of Boston to fill a position for him; people are knocking themselves out of the way now trying to be first in line to drive him to the airport...................good riddance..............
 
All,

It is a sad day. People died in our Nations Capital. A cop was killed and four civilians are dead, with more injured and in the hospital. I don't find any of it acceptable. In fact, I reject it. I have rejected all of this nonsense and violence this entire year. I swear this is 2020 plus 8 and not the 2021 we all looked forward too.

How many people have to die? How much suffering will we have to endure as a nation and a world to get past these times? It seems there is no limit to what man is capable of doing. My Uncle who is a vietnam vet once told me "in the history of man we have proven to either build or destroy". He was right then and now.

John from Texas
 
Louis Badolato said:
A really important part of history is the heroes who have made it happen. One of these heroes is Officer Brian Sicknick, who was mortally wounded by a fire extinguisher to the head while defending the U.S. Capitol from rioters, a true American patriot: An Iraq War veteran. I just want to express my sincere condolences to his family, and to his fellow Capital Police officers, and thank all of the Capital Police Officers who risked their lives in protecting our Capital this week.
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Don’t forget the young women who had presence of mind in dire circumstances to secure the electoral ballots. If not for that, the traitorous and seditious coup might have been more damaging. They’re heroes.
 
Warrior said:
The police being hung out to dry; what else is new in this country.

They do their job and get called out of it.

They stand down as told and get called out for it.

They literally cannot win.

When I was younger, I wanted to follow in my Dad's footsteps and become a Boston Police officer, he was in his early 60's at the time and told me "I'm proud that you want to follow in my footsteps, but I don't want you to, the job has changed so much since I started, I would be worried sick about you during every one of your shifts, I'd never be able to live with myself if something happened to you"..........so that was that and I got into the toy soldier business instead........that was about 26 years ago.

I would have been proud to be a Boston Police officer, but then I never would have met any of you fellas, so there you go...................:wink2:
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It’s not true that the police were not ready. Arlington County, DC Metro, the FBI and both MD and VA National Guards were all ready and warning Capitol Police. Capitol Police had jurisdiction and have to request the help of these other organizations. They didn’t until it was too late and then were not ready to coordinate there responses. Everyone else expected this, but the Capitol Police rejected it.

This is why the Chief and both Sgts at Arms were required to resign.
 
I totally reject the idea that this seditious act and the earlier riots are equivalent.

Both are wrong, but this was a direct attempt to to overthrow the government, encouraged by a sitting President. That’s a whole different ballgame.

Also, there are people serving time for some of the violence this summer.
 
jazzeum said:
What happened in the summer is one thing and we can discuss that separately if you wish but what happened Wednesday is quite another. Don’t put them on the same level. It was an insurrection, an attempt to overthrow the government, incited by the person in charge of the government! People were killed. An officer died trying to protect the government, one of our branches of our government. The Congress was stormed and I hate to think what would have happened had they captured a Democratic congressman or woman. Just consider what happened to two Republican senators. Romney, on the way to Washington, and he flies coach, was harassed and subjected to calls of “traitor” and so forth. Lindsay Graham, on leaving Washington yesterday, was equally vilified. If you say I’m angry, you’re darn right. I’m d@mn mad that this fascist scum incited by Trump and members of Congress brought this assault on our country about.

Well, that’s enough for me in this thread for now.
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This is ok and not deleted but my opinion was? Brad has a right to voice his opinion (which I agree to) but I don't? As we have seen on the news tonight big tech is starting their censorship program under the democrats. A lot of people are going to be real sorry in a couple of years of who they picked. I was no Trump lover at all but he exposed the scum of Washington (republicans included.) As far as the attack on the capital there is no excuse for it but it is the "peoples" house not the worthless Congress. They are big and brave going back into the capital that night, well anybody can be brave if you have 100's of police and NG protecting you. This is my last post on here so you won't have to hear my opinion anymore. I said in a earlier post that I don't mind being deleted if it's fair across the board which it isn't. Louis, one thing this could be actually be considered the 3rd civil war as the country was very divided at the time of the revolution. It was so bad many of the Loyalists moved to Canada after the war. I'm curious as how many of us on here would consider the patriots of that time terrorists. Something to ponder. :confused:. As I've enjoyed the forum for over 10 years I've found lately focusing more on non toy soldiers and more towards the political which is not good. As one who speaks his mind I will not be censored. I live in the US not Venezuela or China. One more thing about me, I've been a union rep for almost 30 years and I have always tried to help everyone no matter what they were,race,gender ,religion it doesn't matter to me who you are if you have been wronged. I'm not a fire breathing right winger.
Julie,
I would appreciate being taken off the members list.
I wish everyone and I mean everyone good fortune and be safe.
Mark
 
zblang said:
Any reason you keep clicking on it. So far a gentlemanly discussion. Mods will shut it down if they disagree.
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Absolutely, there is a reason for me to keep clicking on it. Do I need to justify to you what that is? It has always been the practice of this forum that there should be no politics. Why has thay changed? Why were some posts on this thread deleted for reasons being of political in nature while others which are clearly political continue to roll on. I would so love to comment here but I will not. Just like everything else this year people will spew things and turn things how they want and offer their monday morning quarterback opinions as fact. Unless you are coming with actual research and valid facts then spare me the high and almighty opinions. All I have to say is god rest officer Sicknicks soul. He paid the ultimate sacrifice protecting the Constitution of the United States. Make no mistake though he wasnt the only officer protecting the constitution. To suggest the riots during the summer were not a well organized thought out plan unlike the DC incident is just naive. The incidents during the summer were direct attacks on economy, infrastructure and government.

I will be more then happy to have a civil private discussion with you on how the acts during the summer were just as ****ing as the horrendous incident in D.C. and that ALL parties should be held responsible for their actions.
 
Warrior said:
The police being hung out to dry; what else is new in this country.

They do their job and get called out of it.

They stand down as told and get called out for it.

They literally cannot win.

When I was younger, I wanted to follow in my Dad's footsteps and become a Boston Police officer, he was in his early 60's at the time and told me "I'm proud that you want to follow in my footsteps, but I don't want you to, the job has changed so much since I started, I would be worried sick about you during every one of your shifts, I'd never be able to live with myself if something happened to you"..........so that was that and I got into the toy soldier business instead........that was about 26 years ago.

I would have been proud to be a Boston Police officer, but then I never would have met any of you fellas, so there you go...................:wink2:
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I would certainly concur with your Dad’s thinking. A wise man. I'm sure you would have made a great cop, but the hobby would be lesser for it.

While being a deeply rewarding profession in which you get to see the very best and worse in society while helping others, I’m finding I’m having to look over my shoulder far more these days. Management seem more concerned about political correctness and image than supporting the frontline when they most need it.

Leaving so few officers to defend the senate building was done deliberately for political purposes and they took a hammering and lost one of their own for their efforts and now also coping all the blame. How shallow is that.
 
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