Anyone recieved FJs yet?? (4 Viewers)

[sammy719]

Well my "spin" on this issue is there looks to be some size difference with the FJ soldier and the SS soldier that Joe posted, with that being said, I will go along the lines of what Mitch said and agree not all toy soldiers have to be exactly the same size, and the new FJs and my SS will look fine in my Normandy dio, to me once again the scale theory is way over blown as it usually whether its First Legion, Figarti, etc... Not to sound arrogant but I have 2-3 dios covered by magazines and other hobby sites on the Internet and seen by a lot of collectors/readers also friends and family and not once has anyone ever said.. "Hey Sammy, that one soldier seems to be a little to big/small".... I take little stock in what others think should be the gospel (scale size) and enjoy my collection for what it is..a hobby...Sammy

p.s. Alex, let me know when your selling the FJs off at the 15% discount, I'll take some of that action.

 

[Vezzolf]

Sammy, Scale is important....The big question is which direction should we exspect with future releases in FL WWII????....One of the main reasons I and many collect FL is because they are historically accurate, beautifully painted, sculpted figures and.... consistent in scale....Scale counts....I think the new FJ's are better painted and sculpted figures then the FL Waffen SS....I personally like the size of the FJ's...The SS Waffen are too large and not done as well IMO......First Legion (Grey) Stalingrad are FL at it's best for WWII.....If we don't care about consistency we will get in-consistency.....The Waffen SS and the FJ's will look great in your dio if you don't place them right next to each other.....I favor the FJ's they are overall better.

 

[Firebat]

Well my "spin" on this issue is there looks to be some size difference with the FJ soldier and the SS soldier that Joe posted, with that being said, I will go along the lines of what Mitch said and agree not all toy soldiers have to be exactly the same size, and the new FJs and my SS will look fine in my Normandy dio, to me once again the scale theory is way over blown as it usually whether its First Legion, Figarti, etc... Not to sound arrogant but I have 2-3 dios covered by magazines and other hobby sites on the Internet and seen by a lot of collectors/readers also friends and family and not once has anyone ever said.. "Hey Sammy, that one soldier seems to be a little to big/small".... I take little stock in what others think should be the gospel (scale size) and enjoy my collection for what it is..a hobby...Sammy

p.s. Alex, let me know when your selling the FJs off at the 15% discount, I'll take some of that action.

Sammy if you have followed any of my posts you would know I am a big FL fan, with that said, I also hold the manufacturers accountable. We are paying top dollar and they need to do the job right. We are always forced to juggle things around, mix and blend, and yes we can make it work, but we shouldn't have to work so hard.

Dont be so loyal to a manufacturer that it makes you blind.

FL is as good as it gets and I doubt if I will part with the FJ's, because they are that good. I will have to do the usual work around when doing a scene with them... so what else is new.

It is a bit disappointing though.

If the size discrepancy is OK with you, that is great, but it is not OK for me and many like me. I have a modelers eye and that can be a curse at times.

 

[sammy719]

Sammy, Scale is important....The big question is which direction should we exspect with future releases in FL WWII????....One of the main reasons I and many collect FL is because they are historically accurate, beautifully painted, sculpted figures and.... consistent in scale....Scale counts....I think the new FJ's are better painted and sculpted figures then the FL Waffen SS....I personally like the size of the FJ's...The SS Waffen are too large and not done as well IMO......First Legion (Grey) Stalingrad are FL at it's best for WWII.....If we don't care about consistency we will get in-consistency.....The Waffen SS and the FJ's will look great in your dio if you don't place them right next to each other.....I favor the FJ's they are overall better.

Hey Frank if you think I'm going to get into a scale war argument/discussion you are sadly mistaken, I said my two cents worth on the topic and time for me to move on, I will leave the scale size decisions to Matt/Constantine and the scultptors that work for First Legion, that's thier job, if I don't like it then I won't buy it, that simple.
But if I'm remembering correctly Frank, I never heard or read any issues of you having with the SS Range, now they are to big? not done well? (which I could not disagree with you more if I tried, if anything the SS is the best range) of course IMHO that is, so now that's my 3 cents on this topic and since I'm saving for the FJs I better stop while I can, just hoping this doesn't mean First Legion doesn't rule anymore?...Sammy

 

[sammy719]

Sammy if you have followed any of my posts you would know I am a big FL fan, with that said, I also hold the manufacturers accountable. We are paying top dollar and they need to do the job right. We are always forced to juggle things around, mix and blend, and yes we can make it work, but we shouldn't have to work so hard.

Dont be so loyal to a manufacturer that it makes you blind.

FL is as good as it gets and I doubt if I will part with the FJ's, because they are that good. I will have to do the usual work around when doing a scene with them... so what else is new.

It is a bit disappointing though.

If the size discrepancy is OK with you, that is great, but it is not OK for me and many like me. I have a modelers eye and that can be a curse at times.

Alex, please read previous post...Sammy

 

[Vezzolf]

Hey Frank if you think I'm going to get into a scale war argument/discussion you are sadly mistaken, I said my two cents worth on the topic and time for me to move on, I will leave the scale size decisions to Matt/Constantine and the scultptors that work for First Legion, that's thier job, if I don't like it then I won't buy it, that simple.
But if I'm remembering correctly Frank, I never heard or read any issues of you having with the SS Range, now they are to big? not done well? (which I could not disagree with you more if I tried, if anything the SS is the best range) of course IMHO that is, so now that's my 3 cents on this topic and since I'm saving for the FJs I better stop while I can, just hoping this doesn't mean First Legion doesn't rule anymore?...Sammy

Hey Buddy, I'm not trying to get you into a scale war arguement/discussion...Do whatever you want... it doesn't concern me at all......When you place the FJ's next to your Waffen maybe you will see what I mean...... maybe not....It's all good.....First Legion Rules^&grin...STILL^&grin..... STILL better then anything else being made out there today in the TS world....and I want them to stay that way. That's why I care about scale consistency....Latter.

 

[Firebat]

I think we are done here {sm4}


Good job men :salute::

I will let you all know if we come up with anything interesting in the BGA discussion which is ongoing. This topic will definitely take a few days.

 

[sammy719]

Sammy I jumped right back into WW2. Rome is still my favorite and it will always come first but I have been really missing my WW2 collection. I picked up all the FJs, all the SS and got my US airborne back. I got most of these sets today the rest came in last week.

Thanks again Joe for posting your photos, as indeed all of your sets look great (including the tank) also glad you have the SS, Paras, FJs next to each other, and just to show no bias your archer sets look killer as well!!!

just a quick note, this is not a scale thread, please do not hi jack it to make it one, please feel free to start your own thread on any scale issues, thanks...Sammy

 

[Hunter Rose]

I'm gonna throw the BS flag on this one. I think we're making mountains out of molehills on this one.

The most important issue is equipment size, as that is static, has precise measurments in real life, and does not change. It appears the rifles, shovels, etc. between all the FL German figures are the same for the most part. People in real life are tall skinny, fat, slender, and have big heads and gaunt heads. A little height difference to me just adds to the sense of realism. KC, TGM, Figarti, etc. all have figures the exact same height. Line up 20 figures and I doubt you'll see any difference in height. This ain't how it is in the real world. Some may like this uniformity in soldier size, but that is a personal preference, not necessarily a defect in the figure. As long as the equipment is the same size, I have no issue with a little size variation.

Sure the SS figure is a few millimeters taller than the FJ figure, but so what? The size discrepancy is well within the range of size differences between humans.

Those extreme closeups and comparison lines drawn give a false impression of inaccuracy where I'm not yet convinced any exists. I see nothing wrong with that first picture you took with the FJ blended in with the other figures, including the Russian you claim is gigantic. That's how soldiers look in the wild.

Here's some pics to show what I'm talking about, were these real life WW2 Germans out of scale too? :salute::

 

[Vezzolf]

When you actually have the FL Waffen and FJ's figures in your hands AND right next to each other you will understand and "see the descrepency" in size that is EVIDENT....Only then will it be clear...Until then Good Luck. I personally hope that FL will get this problem rectified with the WWII line. It would be sad indeed if this is ignored....Still the FJ's uniforms and poses are beautifully done.

 

[Firebat]

Hunter


Great pics and you make a good point.....but to my eye they don't work with the SS and US Paras in person........variation in figures is realistic........but in this case I believe it is too much of a stretch



I hope you are planning on getting them, because I respect your knowledge and opinion....

 

[Gebhard]

Also worth noting is the difference in the thickness of the base on the Russian figure which seems to somehow gone totally un noted by the "experts"

 

[Hunter Rose]

Not a big proponent of the scale issue but here is another pic.

One thing First Legion definitely got right on these new FJ figures is the size relationship of the MP-44 Sturmgewehr. It was way too small on the previous SS Officer and prone SS Sniper. The Sturmgewehr is a very large assault rifle in real life. The FJ officer looks spot on to me.

 

[Hunter Rose]

Thanks for the picture. A although there is a difference in height there is compatibility in terms of the anatomical features and the equipment and weapons.

That for me, anyway, is very important and, it is something that I have stated for a while when talking about scale of figures and the numerous and confusing ways figures are often measured to indicate scale. I don't think these height issues to be on the face important as I want my figures to be different heights etc as that indicates reality and, for me is more important than trying to ensure every figure is exactly the same height. That is unrealistic in any picture etc where every antagonist is the same height, build etc.

I noticed the difference in size when I got the SS but, again the fact that they still married up in terms of what I mentioned means its not as important as it would be if you could not mix weapons and equipment.
Mitch

Mitch,

Spot on and I could not agree with you more. I missed your post the first time and think I just repeated exactly what you said in mine above. Sorry about that/being repetitious.

 

[Peter Reuss]

That's a lot of drama and anxiety that could have quickly been solved by posting a picture of two compatible figures. Once that happened, people were able to have their own opinions.

I had the sense that these were being sent to a secret lab that would once and for all give 'proof.'

The only proof is in the eye of the beholder. If you like them, buy them. If you don't like them, then have your 15% off sale.

I AM a toy soldier dealer...and I just want people to do what makes them happy!

 

[Phantom Warrior]

To my eyes, the FL WWII figures are within the variation of human sizes. Here is a photo of a K&C figure next to an FL figure. That is what a difference in scale looks like. It's clearly not just a big person standing next to a small person.

Terry

 

[Warrior]

I had the sense that these were being sent to a secret lab that would once and for all give 'proof.'

The only proof is in the eye of the beholder. If you like them, buy them. If you don't like them, then have your 15% off sale.

Does all this talk about shrinkage have anything to do with the Seinfeld episode where George went in the pool?

And where is this lab run by some secret society anyway, do they wear white smocks or butchers outfits while conducting all of these secret meetings, is there some sort of handshake you have to know to get involved?

And what's this 15% off sale everyone is talking about trying to get in on like a game of poker; I really need to get on that internet thingy, the whole information super highway, is that anywhere near route 95?

 

[Mitch]

Come on Gebs! I mentioned base variation last night. Base experts rule!!
Mitch

Also worth noting is the difference in the thickness of the base on the Russian figure which seems to somehow gone totally un noted by the "experts"

 

[Vezzolf]

That's a lot of drama and anxiety that could have quickly been solved by posting a picture of two compatible figures. Once that happened, people were able to have their own opinions.

I had the sense that these were being sent to a secret lab that would once and for all give 'proof.'

The only proof is in the eye of the beholder. If you like them, buy them. If you don't like them, then have your 15% off sale.

I AM a toy soldier dealer...and I just want people to do what makes them happy!

Agree Peter, When the customer is happy the dealer is happy:wink2:....happy happy joy joy.... I am happy with my purchase despite the shrinkage.... those FJ's are EXCELLENT.....I am not selling them.{sm4}

 

[Firebat]

I am happy with mine......I am just using them in a different diorama scenario.

But I feel good that the "Secret Society" has given the collector / modeler sound information on this and other products to assist them in making purchases they spend their hard

earned money on. This is a hobby that is basically internet based, so you don't have the products in your hands and they may not be what you expected when you receive them.

I am making no case against the FJ's or telling anyone not to buy them, I am just telling you about them. Initially I was taken back and contemplated selling them if they didn't work out for me.

( That was the case for me where I wanted to use the FJ's in a particular scene, now I can't, but they are so excellent I will use them in another way )


On another topic I could give you such a clear example of treachery, by someone who threw shots indirectly at me on this thread, ( Not Sammy ). But I will let it go.

Again to avoid threads like this I do this stuff away from here, if you want to look in you can, but of course you don't have to , and it works out fine.

We have a huge discussion going without any problem, and we are all learning from each other.

I really shouldn't worry about mentioning the BGA Forum here, because it has a very narrow technical scope and does not compete with this forum at all. It actually is not really for most who participate here. That is why I am somewhat "Secretive" about it so no feathers get ruffled.