Critiquing or mocking a set you don't like? (2 Viewers)

[BigDenny]

Here's my take on the matter.

This hobby is full of large and boisterous personalities. I work at a shop that deals in military miniatures so I've gotten to meet many of these characters first-hand. From where I stand, the people are what make up this fine hobby and make it enjoyable, even more than the soldiers and AFV we collect...

That being said, there will always be discord in the hobby, as well there should be. When a figure costs $28 a pop and an AFV costs easily $250, we should be able to expect a high level of accuracy and customer service from the manufacturers. If there is something wrong with a set, by all means bring this to the dealer's attention. I doubt that something as trivial as the wrong shade of grey on a K&C warbird will deter many collectors, but something such as drooping tank barrels might.

However, there has to be a limit. When a discussion denigrates to mud slinging, name-calling, and other useless petty arguments, that's when its time to shut it down. We're here as a privilege; and we need to respect the wishes of other forum members and the moderators. King & Country and the other manufacturers do a superb job and they deserve props when deserved, polite discussion of possible errors/quality control when needed, but most of all a respite from undeserved personal attacks.

Just my two cents.

Thanks and Regards,
Mike

 

[Bayern]

Rob...

I guess I just don't either see this ramming or, undertand where your coming from. This other peoples threads is confusing. Most of the initial critique comes from the initial photos that you post regarding dispatches. Now, you and others may want to discuss the releases but, its the first opportunity many, well, everyone on the whole, gets to see them. reaction will be from yes, great stuff to well, I am not sure nothing for me etc etc. Some will highlight issues they see straight away. In the last few dispatches a number of people have said this. I note, a couple who made comments purely aimed at annoying K&C collectors etc.

Threads then ultimately spawn from these releases which contain the rivet counters (A negative term that has been used on the whole derogatively against those with historical knowledge but, happily now to be moderated against!!) and those who may not like the set. I still don't know where it becomes annoying or, irritating. Is it the number of negative threads or whats being said or, just by who it is being said? These would end across the board if manufacturers were better at their research so, it may be we, or some, lash out in the wrong direction.

I would venture that the barrel issue, spitfire issue and the Yalta are all now irritating to a number but, have not really needed any moderation in the tone and comments that have been applied. Many have had their say in them multiple times often repeating the same arguments but, no problem.

What threads recently have meant a forum announcement on the K&C section not, I might add, in the general section or, forum issues where it should really have been, caused this reaction?? Its not like it has not been going on for multiple years on this forum in predominantly the two areas I highlighted. You being on from day one can not disagree with that.

I hear ramming down throats and ad nauseum but, don't see it. I think even I was rather positive in the barrel and Yalta threads considering and, I admit I am not enamoured with the fact the first time we get a brit spit, nice as it is, its not, exactly how it should be in terms of paint and, decals but, far from it being rammed down peoples throats it really hardly was allowed a discussion.

These arguments are as old as the forum but, its never clear what is annoying those who say it is. The fun issue was also exactly the same. people moaning about the loss of fun on the forum and saying it was down to this and that but, this and that were ever present and worse before.

I am all for a balanced debate about whats in front of us I just think its knee jerk as a reaction and does not fix an issue by moderating as its always wrong to moderate someone because others find it irritating what they are saying. Thats not moderation its censorship. it also negates the fact that they have something to say.

Now we seem to have any negative comments will be moderated to avoid irritation to people. What about the people who don't like the set for whatever reason, detail etc who have to listen to people saying its excellent all day long could that not also be construed as irritating? I know lots of people who PM me that are irritated by the large bold letters huge horrah's and all that stuff thats constantly placed on the forum some, very established members do we moderate that and, then where does it end? To make a fair, tolerant and happy forum all must be fair tolerant and happy.

Just my views
Mitch

well, if the rah rah issue is to be a moderated slogan (which has been used on here for many many years) then, I would hope equally all the stuff that surrounds those who raise historical and, detail issues with manufacturers products will be afforded similar moderation and support??? I read with interest the slamming down peoples throats but, in the recent threads where problems have been highlighted the barrel drooping issue, the spitifire colourway and markings and, the yuck or yalta set there seemed to be nobody in any of them moaning that issues were being rammed down their throats. These three threads seemed to contain the same comments and issues that are always raised when people see things that are wrong or, see sculpts that are poor in their own opinion.

Perhaps someone could enlighten me as to what slamming down throats equates to as this, whether one likes it or not looks another way to reduce any critique of King and country. There seems little need for moderation in CS, Figarti or TG sections where members are able to mention problems and discuss rationally these issues and, rarely have I seen the need for mod intervention in relation to detail et al. That is plainly a fact which, cannot be disputed. It does seem the only problem areas are K&C and FL and maybe some of the members themselves are a lot of the problem in how they react to anything other than what a great set I must buy that?? Perhaps, all members should look in these mythical mirrors we hear so much about. Nobody on here is whiter than white or, holier than thou but, when these issues come up they often play the hurt and scream blue murder. Others may just not see it that way and, should be allowed to discuss the reasons without the fear of group mauling (I use that lightly!!) or, moderation.

I have said and many who are posting their delight at this clarification? have agreed that when someone just comes in and tries to wind people up in threads its easy to see but, if you have valid concerns then they should be tolerated by those people who seem unable to keep calm when someone says I don't particularly like that soldier of X or that tank.

I think after viewing the history of this forum its shutting the stable gate after the horse has bolted and do feel a heavy hand will be brought to bear unecessarily on a number of posters who raise any issue. In long drawn threads like the barrel issue how many posts are allowed as that numbered many before someone says this is irritating me I am going to flag it??

people will see this as a good thing to allow the ''fun'' to come back but, at £250 upwards for a tank or aircraft and, the readliy accepted view that people want better detail and more accurate AFV's I hope this does not sway to far to stiffle the discussion that many want before they choose to part with their hard earned cash. Time will tell, so they say.
Mitch

As Rob says..leave the forum for a day and wow...what happens. Actually I think it is good to then return and see new things. Not that I am saying this is one of them.

I will try to be short on this as I was really not intending to reply at all. In my short three months as a member I have watched some things happen to this forum lately that is making it less appealing to be a part of it. Yeah I know...good...... go away Ludwig.
The interesting thing on this thread is I actually agree with members that I have butted heads with more then others.
I feel that there is preferential treatment to many of the senior members as far as posting something that would normally be moderated to a newer member or a member that does not go with the normal flow. I watch things go on and on by some and when another new, less favored member posts that it is suddenly moderated and posts deleted. You attempt a defense of your position against the assailant and boom..it is deleted with the aggressor....but only when that aggressor has lost ground and been put in his place rightfully. Perhaps if the posts were left from the one protecting him or her self maybe the brow beaters would stop. But that does not happen. The norm on the KC forum seems to attempt to keep the new from becoming an entity.
This has become a place where you can only say good things about a piece. Anything bad will be quickly moderated and removed as the can do no wrong group blasts it and the moderators with PM's. Now we see there is even a new law from the Sheriff on it.
Mitch and I have butted heads a time or two.....I respect and agree with his two posts and that is why I have replied with them. I agree that those that do not like the endless hoorays should be treated the same as those that do. The point about a thread being brought up that was before.....there are new members weekly who do not know that and their threads were entertained previously.
Why can those that do not like a criticizing thread stay away from it if they do not like it? Read it and do not post like the FAQ already had in it. Why do those that do not like the high praising threads have to refrain from posting. I dislike the can do no wrong attitude. The lengths some will go to defend a situation that has obvious defect amazes me. It is as if free tanks and soldiers are being distributed to some. Where are mine!!!!!:wink2:
Now to a serious matter....it is time for me to suffer the children so to speak and it is off to church we go.

Ludwig

 

[sammy719]

I do agree that some people on this forum can appear proprietorial and to be honest Mitch you are beginning to sound like such a person. The majority of us have far greater things to occupy our immediate thoughts than toy soldiers and their relative cost and indeed accuracy.But let us not lose sight that it is a livelihood for others and as such, yes, they should listen to the customer but there comes a point, which passed some time ago in your case, when criticism becomes something more personal. Along with freedom of speech we also posess freedom of choice. If you don't like something then don't buy it. From now on my choice is to bypass your verbose diatribes. Your fifteen minutes on here is up as far as I am concerned.

100 % agree with you Isandlwana, Mitch your pot shots at First Legion (little guys/web feet) etc..are nothing but a pot shot at a company that you no longer collect, if you think that isn't mocking then I don't know what is, you may call it a inside joke or critiquing but I do not, and that's just one of many, I'm not getting into a post that will be deleted so I will stop there, if Peters/Shannons forum rules are to much for you to abide, well maybe it's time for a change for you my good mate...Sammy

 

[Rob]

Rob...

I guess I just don't either see this ramming or, undertand where your coming from. This other peoples threads is confusing. Most of the initial critique comes from the initial photos that you post regarding dispatches. Now, you and others may want to discuss the releases but, its the first opportunity many, well, everyone on the whole, gets to see them. reaction will be from yes, great stuff to well, I am not sure nothing for me etc etc. Some will highlight issues they see straight away. In the last few dispatches a number of people have said this. I note, a couple who made comments purely aimed at annoying K&C collectors etc.

Threads then ultimately spawn from these releases which contain the rivet counters (A negative term that has been used on the whole derogatively against those with historical knowledge but, happily now to be moderated against!!) and those who may not like the set. I still don't know where it becomes annoying or, irritating. Is it the number of negative threads or whats being said or, just by who it is being said? These would end across the board if manufacturers were better at their research so, it may be we, or some, lash out in the wrong direction.

I would venture that the barrel issue, spitfire issue and the Yalta are all now irritating to a number but, have not really needed any moderation in the tone and comments that have been applied. Many have had their say in them multiple times often repeating the same arguments but, no problem.

What threads recently have meant a forum announcement on the K&C section not, I might add, in the general section or, forum issues where it should really have been, caused this reaction?? Its not like it has not been going on for multiple years on this forum in predominantly the two areas I highlighted. You being on from day one can not disagree with that.

I hear ramming down throats and ad nauseum but, don't see it. I think even I was rather positive in the barrel and Yalta threads considering and, I admit I am not enamoured with the fact the first time we get a brit spit, nice as it is, its not, exactly how it should be in terms of paint and, decals but, far from it being rammed down peoples throats it really hardly was allowed a discussion.

These arguments are as old as the forum but, its never clear what is annoying those who say it is. The fun issue was also exactly the same. people moaning about the loss of fun on the forum and saying it was down to this and that but, this and that were ever present and worse before.

I am all for a balanced debate about whats in front of us I just think its knee jerk as a reaction and does not fix an issue by moderating as its always wrong to moderate someone because others find it irritating what they are saying. Thats not moderation its censorship. it also negates the fact that they have something to say.

Now we seem to have any negative comments will be moderated to avoid irritation to people. What about the people who don't like the set for whatever reason, detail etc who have to listen to people saying its excellent all day long could that not also be construed as irritating? I know lots of people who PM me that are irritated by the large bold letters huge horrah's and all that stuff thats constantly placed on the forum some, very established members do we moderate that and, then where does it end? To make a fair, tolerant and happy forum all must be fair tolerant and happy.

Just my views
Mitch

Mitch,

First of all I'm not talking about Dispatches at all. That as you say is what the threads are for, opinions of all colours, positive and negative and I am very happy with that indeed. No. I'm talking about a thread someone might start after dispatches. Let me give you an example. When the Typhoon was released some liked it some didn't and said so in Dispatches. Then some of us posted our own threads describing how we liked it and were looking ofrward to getting it. From that moment we had posts that were just that god awful peck peck pecking at the fun of the discussion, not enough they'd said it in dispatches, not enough they'd said it in the new thread once, no over and over again, until you think for gods sake show some consideration for someone other than yourself and take it somewhere else. You've kind of made my point re the Yalta , Grey Spitfire threads. THESE were started by folks not happy with the sets, that's their own threads, and they have been shown respect and tolerance and no one is trying to spoil them with baiting or deliberate spoiling. Did you see me ra ra ing on these threads Mitch ? Seriously, did you?? No you didn't because I have respect for other views and do not try and shout people down.

What is annoying to those who say it is? Now no doubt you will say to me (perhaps not suggesting I'm lying but trying to completely deny my argument is real) that you don't see this, but let me for one moment as a long term member explain. If you were to visit the bar at the London show you would hear at least three or four of the guys, all long term members actually tell you why they either no longer post or rarely post, not ' drifting away' Mitch, not ' another hobby'. no they are truly sick of the pedantic, pathetic attempts to spoil the enjoyment of others with the god awful provocation that goes on, yes its happened for years but it doesn't mean its acceptable or that it gets less annoying. Take Mr Tony Neville, not only one of the nicest guys in this hobby and one of the very foremost K&C suppliers , but also a regular poster for many years.He's not drifted away Mitch, he's told me many times he can't stand the endless arguments and deletions. Don't you think it must be a real issue Mitch when a leading supplier is put off posting on a product he supplies???

I'm guessing your ' big bold letters ' remark was aimed at me because I used them in the Dispatches thread this month. I think you maybe muddying the waters here a little because it can't really be connected to the argument, this was a one off (not over and over again)use in my own thread but not pertaining to or trying to bait anyone at all, merely celebrating.

You mentioned 'Rivet counters' as a negative term, but the term 'gang/group of little ra ra's ' was used the other day and that surely can't be seen as anything but negative.

We will have to agree to disagree Mitch, but we are both adults mate, we know when someone is trying to wind up other members out of envy or spite because others are enjoying the discussion, we've all seen it and to believe it does not happen is a tad naive.

I fully support the decision on this new policy and hope we can all work together to ensure the respect shown to those with points to raise such as the other day is shown to those who simply want to have a chat and shout out how much they love the product.

Rob

 

[Phantom Warrior]

Very good point about respecting others opinions and not harping on a flaw or opposing opinion.

And you know I'm a rivet counter - so just what did you mean ^&grin

Terry

 

[Rob]

As Rob says..leave the forum for a day and wow...what happens. Actually I think it is good to then return and see new things. Not that I am saying this is one of them.

I will try to be short on this as I was really not intending to reply at all. In my short three months as a member I have watched some things happen to this forum lately that is making it less appealing to be a part of it. Yeah I know...good...... go away Ludwig.
The interesting thing on this thread is I actually agree with members that I have butted heads with more then others.
I feel that there is preferential treatment to many of the senior members as far as posting something that would normally be moderated to a newer member or a member that does not go with the normal flow. I watch things go on and on by some and when another new, less favored member posts that it is suddenly moderated and posts deleted. You attempt a defense of your position against the assailant and boom..it is deleted with the aggressor....but only when that aggressor has lost ground and been put in his place rightfully. Perhaps if the posts were left from the one protecting him or her self maybe the brow beaters would stop. But that does not happen. The norm on the KC forum seems to attempt to keep the new from becoming an entity.
This has become a place where you can only say good things about a piece. Anything bad will be quickly moderated and removed as the can do no wrong group blasts it and the moderators with PM's. Now we see there is even a new law from the Sheriff on it.
Mitch and I have butted heads a time or two.....I respect and agree with his two posts and that is why I have replied with them. I agree that those that do not like the endless hoorays should be treated the same as those that do. The point about a thread being brought up that was before.....there are new members weekly who do not know that and their threads were entertained previously.
Why can those that do not like a criticizing thread stay away from it if they do not like it? Read it and do not post like the FAQ already had in it. Why do those that do not like the high praising threads have to refrain from posting. I dislike the can do no wrong attitude. The lengths some will go to defend a situation that has obvious defect amazes me. It is as if free tanks and soldiers are being distributed to some. Where are mine!!!!!:wink2:
Now to a serious matter....it is time for me to suffer the children so to speak and it is off to church we go.

Ludwig

Here is the point Ludwig. Nobody minds at all if you start a thread with that purpose, did you see me baiting you in your threads in which you say you are not happy? No you didn't I even voted in your poll but left no bating remark, so I say again why can you not show respect for those who are happy with the product and are celebrating it, why can YOU not post on those threads? Whats good for the Goose my friend , whats good for the Goose.

Ludwig, you are a good person, open , friendly and honest, its quite refreshing indeed. But I have to ask you this. Have you REALLY just implied that you think established members are shown leniency and new members not, I'm not going to go into details but think back to an early post of yours my friend, BELIEVE ME you were shown INCREDIBLE leniency, you may well have been banned for a long time, but the mods and owners showed massive restraint because you were new.

Nobody and I mean nobody gets away with crossing the line here, we should all show respect for other users.

Best regards Ludwig

Rob

 

[Wraith]

Errrr....yeah, that kind of sums it up quite nicely.

Mitch,

First of all I'm not talking about Dispatches at all. That as you say is what the threads are for, opinions of all colours, positive and negative and I am very happy with that indeed. No. I'm talking about a thread someone might start after dispatches. Let me give you an example. When the Typhoon was released some liked it some didn't and said so in Dispatches. Then some of us posted our own threads describing how we liked it and were looking ofrward to getting it. From that moment we had posts that were just that god awful peck peck pecking at the fun of the discussion, not enough they'd said it in dispatches, not enough they'd said it in the new thread once, no over and over again, until you think for gods sake show some consideration for someone other than yourself and take it somewhere else. You've kind of made my point re the Yalta , Grey Spitfire threads. THESE were started by folks not happy with the sets, that's their own threads, and they have been shown respect and tolerance and no one is trying to spoil them with baiting or deliberate spoiling. Did you see me ra ra ing on these threads Mitch ? Seriously, did you?? No you didn't because I have respect for other views and do not try and shout people down.

What is annoying to those who say it is? Now no doubt you will say to me (perhaps not suggesting I'm lying but trying to completely deny my argument is real) that you don't see this, but let me for one moment as a long term member explain. If you were to visit the bar at the London show you would hear at least three or four of the guys, all long term members actually tell you why they either no longer post or rarely post, not ' drifting away' Mitch, not ' another hobby'. no they are truly sick of the pedantic, pathetic attempts to spoil the enjoyment of others with the god awful provocation that goes on, yes its happened for years but it doesn't mean its acceptable or that it gets less annoying. Take Mr Tony Neville, not only one of the nicest guys in this hobby and one of the very foremost K&C suppliers , but also a regular poster for many years.He's not drifted away Mitch, he's told me many times he can't stand the endless arguments and deletions. Don't you think it must be a real issue Mitch when a leading supplier is put off posting on a product he supplies???

I'm guessing your ' big bold letters ' remark was aimed at me because I used them in the Dispatches thread this month. I think you maybe muddying the waters here a little because it can't really be connected to the argument, this was a one off (not over and over again)use in my own thread but not pertaining to or trying to bait anyone at all, merely celebrating.

You mentioned 'Rivet counters' as a negative term, but the term 'gang/group of little ra ra's ' was used the other day and that surely can't be seen as anything but negative.

We will have to agree to disagree Mitch, but we are both adults mate, we know when someone is trying to wind up other members out of envy or spite because others are enjoying the discussion, we've all seen it and to believe it does not happen is a tad naive.

I fully support the decision on this new policy and hope we can all work together to ensure the respect shown to those with points to raise such as the other day is shown to those who simply want to have a chat and shout out how much they love the product.

Rob

 

[nysoldiers]

Entertainment and information......that's all I want from the forum. If I want controversy and politics I watch the news or debate with my opinionated colleagues.
There are always those individuals who like to get a "rise" or as our UK friends like to say "wind someone up". But we should be smart enough to identify them and not give them the satisfaction of an argument we can never win!
Personally I use humor to neutralize all the adversarial people I encounter in life. I treat them as characters in a sitcom. We have enough really serious issues in life to contend with and I am not going to let a hobby or interest get me upset. That is the opposite of what it is supposed to do for me.......relaxation and enjoyment!
Everyone take a deep breath and just ignore or trivialize the people and comments that bother you.

 

[Rob]

Very good point about respecting others opinions and not harping on a flaw or opposing opinion.

And you know I'm a rivet counter - so just what did you mean ^&grin

Terry

Just for the record, I've never used the term in a derogatory way, I mean it as in people who do study the nuts and bolts of something.

Rob

 

[sammy719]

Here is the point Ludwig. Nobody minds at all if you start a thread with that purpose, did you see me baiting you in your threads in which you say you are not happy? No you didn't, so I say again why can you not show respect for those who are happy with the product and are celebrating it, why can YOU not post on those threads? Whats good for the Goose my friend , whats good for the Goose.

Ludwig, you are a good person, open , friendly and honest, its quite refreshing indeed. But I have to ask you this. Have you REALLY just implied that you think established members are shown leniency and new members not, I'm not going to go into details but think back to an early post of yours my friend, BELIEVE ME you were shown INCREDIBLE leniency, you may well have been banned for a long time, but the mods and owners showed massive restraint because you were new.

Nobody and I mean nobody gets away with crossing the line here, we should all show respect for other users.

Best regards Ludwig

Rob

Rob, I'm just gonna call you butter today cause your on a roll!!!...Sammy

 

[Wraith]

Just for the record, I've never used the term in a derogatory way, I mean it as in people who do study the nuts and bolts of something.

Rob

Wouldn't that be a nuts and bolts counter? Not wishing to be picky or anything....

 

[Rob]

Wouldn't that be a nuts and bolts counter? Not wishing to be picky or anything....

Whats with you posting , I just told Mitch you've had enough of us all and have gone to live in Barbados!

Rob

(Bring lots of cash in December my friend I have a thirst to quench and first drinky on you!:wink2

 

[Phantom Warrior]

Wouldn't that be a nuts and bolts counter? Not wishing to be picky or anything....

He must be thinking of the British arnour in use before the Canadians showed up with Shermans, Stagounds and Kangaroos. ^&grin^&grin

Terry

 

[Mitch]

Rob...

Nothing was aimed at you about big bold lettering in fact nothing in my posts was I was qualifying remarks that long term posters have also made to me about things that irritate them. No names were mentioned. You do sound though Rob somewhat like you did in the fun part when it was raised as if these are new issues to the forum and, its simple to see by back reading they are not. I am surprised at the outcry when people moan about things today that the memory fails to remind them it has always been and, often has been very much worse, than anything put in recent threads.

Even Brad has just mentioned his experiences as a moderator and said in a couple of months we will probably be at the same points raised. It happens and will happen again. Its not individuals its a collective problem and issue. You often post a thread after dispatches who is buying this or that. People who are not will post that and, often explain why. It may be that they are not happy with the look colour or detail even price but, thats a valid point to make in the thread started. If others support their points are we saying they cannot reaffirm or further validate their opinion?

I don't think you can really expect a thread you start like that not to get negative comments but, again, I can't see how they can anger or irritate as its what is expected. I have seen in my time on here many people shouted down by certain sections of this forum in ways which really are rather shameful. of which many senior members have actively participated. people actively shot down and ridiculed for making comments about sets so, my point was that its a two way street where nobody really has clean hands.

My concerns were that it will be used as a stick to negate valid discussion about what is released by whoever. You talk about negative comments and things like that well, two posts in this thread are very personal but, are allowed to remain rah rah is as bad as rivet counters and, some of the other things that are applied to each supposed group. Again its down to everyone to change this tone not just the mods with the threat of sanctions

I don't think I have changed my tone since I joined where people are deliberately having a go then fine act against them but, restricting dialogue because it offends ones choosen manufacturers products is censorship to keep a group happy I cannot understand. I have spoken out many times when that has happened and we have spoken many times about posters its been aimed at
Mitch

Mitch,

First of all I'm not talking about Dispatches at all. That as you say is what the threads are for, opinions of all colours, positive and negative and I am very happy with that indeed. No. I'm talking about a thread someone might start after dispatches. Let me give you an example. When the Typhoon was released some liked it some didn't and said so in Dispatches. Then some of us posted our own threads describing how we liked it and were looking ofrward to getting it. From that moment we had posts that were just that god awful peck peck pecking at the fun of the discussion, not enough they'd said it in dispatches, not enough they'd said it in the new thread once, no over and over again, until you think for gods sake show some consideration for someone other than yourself and take it somewhere else. You've kind of made my point re the Yalta , Grey Spitfire threads. THESE were started by folks not happy with the sets, that's their own threads, and they have been shown respect and tolerance and no one is trying to spoil them with baiting or deliberate spoiling. Did you see me ra ra ing on these threads Mitch ? Seriously, did you?? No you didn't because I have respect for other views and do not try and shout people down.

What is annoying to those who say it is? Now no doubt you will say to me (perhaps not suggesting I'm lying but trying to completely deny my argument is real) that you don't see this, but let me for one moment as a long term member explain. If you were to visit the bar at the London show you would hear at least three or four of the guys, all long term members actually tell you why they either no longer post or rarely post, not ' drifting away' Mitch, not ' another hobby'. no they are truly sick of the pedantic, pathetic attempts to spoil the enjoyment of others with the god awful provocation that goes on, yes its happened for years but it doesn't mean its acceptable or that it gets less annoying. Take Mr Tony Neville, not only one of the nicest guys in this hobby and one of the very foremost K&C suppliers , but also a regular poster for many years.He's not drifted away Mitch, he's told me many times he can't stand the endless arguments and deletions. Don't you think it must be a real issue Mitch when a leading supplier is put off posting on a product he supplies???

I'm guessing your ' big bold letters ' remark was aimed at me because I used them in the Dispatches thread this month. I think you maybe muddying the waters here a little because it can't really be connected to the argument, this was a one off (not over and over again)use in my own thread but not pertaining to or trying to bait anyone at all, merely celebrating.

You mentioned 'Rivet counters' as a negative term, but the term 'gang/group of little ra ra's ' was used the other day and that surely can't be seen as anything but negative.

We will have to agree to disagree Mitch, but we are both adults mate, we know when someone is trying to wind up other members out of envy or spite because others are enjoying the discussion, we've all seen it and to believe it does not happen is a tad naive.

I fully support the decision on this new policy and hope we can all work together to ensure the respect shown to those with points to raise such as the other day is shown to those who simply want to have a chat and shout out how much they love the product.

Rob

 

[Wraith]

Whats with you posting , I just told Mitch you've had enough of us all and have gone to live in Barbados!

Rob

(Bring lots of cash in December my friend I have a thirst to quench and first drinky on you!:wink2

Apparently, drunk sots aren't good for the tourist trade, so got turned around at customs.

First drink on me? Which is different from any other show how exactly?

 

[Phantom Warrior]

Whats with you posting , I just told Mitch you've had enough of us all and have gone to live in Barbados!

Rob

Shirley Wraith can post without expecting the Spanish Inquisition> Everyone has a right to post. {sm3}{sm4}

Terry

 

[Rob]

Mitch,

I would like this to be known by all on the forum whether they be ra ra's or na na's or pa pa's or grandpa's:wink2: Anyone can say anything in my Dispatches threads, its me just doing a service for the good folk here and all opinions always welcome.

I too would not want healthy discussion crushed or put down, nobody wants that. We should be free to do as we please and you made a good point about Ludwigs poll and Neil's Spitfire thread, these did not descend into bitterness.

I can only sum it up best as I did at start of this thread, freedom of speech whilst showing courtesy to others and possibly occasional personal restraint is whats needed.

But as you and Brad have said, no doubt this will be one of those boomerang threads.

Cheers

Rob

Rob...

Nothing was aimed at you about big bold lettering in fact nothing in my posts was I was qualifying remarks that long term posters have also made to me about things that irritate them. No names were mentioned. You do sound though Rob somewhat like you did in the fun part when it was raised as if these are new issues to the forum and, its simple to see by back reading they are not. I am surprised at the outcry when people moan about things today that the memory fails to remind them it has always been and, often has been very much worse, than anything put in recent threads.

Even Brad has just mentioned his experiences as a moderator and said in a couple of months we will probably be at the same points raised. It happens and will happen again. Its not individuals its a collective problem and issue. You often post a thread after dispatches who is buying this or that. People who are not will post that and, often explain why. It may be that they are not happy with the look colour or detail even price but, thats a valid point to make in the thread started. If others support their points are we saying they cannot reaffirm or further validate their opinion?

I don't think you can really expect a thread you start like that not to get negative comments but, again, I can't see how they can anger or irritate as its what is expected. I have seen in my time on here many people shouted down by certain sections of this forum in ways which really are rather shameful. of which many senior members have actively participated. people actively shot down and ridiculed for making comments about sets so, my point was that its a two way street where nobody really has clean hands.

My concerns were that it will be used as a stick to negate valid discussion about what is released by whoever. You talk about negative comments and things like that well, two posts in this thread are very personal but, are allowed to remain rah rah is as bad as rivet counters and, some of the other things that are applied to each supposed group. Again its down to everyone to change this tone not just the mods with the threat of sanctions

I don't think I have changed my tone since I joined where people are deliberately having a go then fine act against them but, restricting dialogue because it offends ones choosen manufacturers products is censorship to keep a group happy I cannot understand. I have spoken out many times when that has happened and we have spoken many times about posters its been aimed at
Mitch

 

[notascoldasbastogne]

100 % agree with you Isandlwana, Mitch your pot shots at First Legion (little guys/web feet) etc..are nothing but a pot shot at a company that you no longer collect, if you think that isn't mocking then I don't know what is, you may call it a inside joke or critiquing but I do not, and that's just one of many, I'm not getting into a post that will be deleted so I will stop there, if Peters/Shannons forum rules are to much for you to abide, well maybe it's time for a change for you my good mate...Sammy

Yeah did you see how fast he re-sold them. That's because FL are HOT!!! and getting HOTTER!!!!
An excellent excellent product :salute::

 

[Mitch]

Neil..

It was because of the great prices not what they were. At those prices anything would have shot out the door. I can now buy some as you hot items that you guys will not like!!!
Mitch

Yeah did you see how fast he re-sold them. That's because FL are HOT!!! and getting HOTTER!!!!
An excellent excellent product :salute::

 

[notascoldasbastogne]

Neil..

It was because of the great prices not what they were. At those prices anything would have shot out the door. I can now buy some as you hot items that you guys will not like!!!
Mitch

Mitch,

I shall re-qoute your reply,You re-sold some Awsome set's at a good price. And trust me you made some collector very HAPPY!!!! :salute::