RUSSIAN hunter. (1 Viewer)

[Mastercom10]

I flashed back about six years when I read the above scale confusion and discussion on what "tru 1/30" scale really is.

Personally, I've never understood the controversy, since it's just simple math.

The short answer: Yes, all those "small" WW2 First Legion figures pictured above are the most accurately sized representations of 1/30 scale humans.

Using data from OurWorldinData.org, average height of a German and an American born in 1920 (so 19 years old at the start of WW2) was right at 173cm or 5'8" tall. Remember that there is a wide variation in human height, so plenty of soldiers were shorter or taller, but the average was 173cm or 1730mm.

1730mm / 30 = 57.7mm

Those two standing First Legion winter SS figures in Mastercom's picture from post #18 above measure right at 58mm tall. The weapons and equipment is also scaled accurately for 1/30 measurements.

So, yes, those "small" First Legion figures are an accurate representation of the average soldier in WW2 with accurately scaled equipment and weapons. They also match up perfectly with true 1/30 scale tanks/vehicles like the vast majority of First Legion's tanks and all of JJDs tanks, which is why I'm always advocating for this "smaller" First Legion figure size, since it's not "small" at all in reality.

These are very comprehensive and interesting explanations.
So OK, WWII First legion range (except Waffen SS) is true 1:30 scale.
But, even if I am totally agree that there are smaller and taller soldiers, what about bigger FL ranges such napoleonic for example : 1:28 scale ?.
And so that would mean that all other brands (except some War Park items) are off scale in regard of "true" 1:30, with "huge" figures in 1:28 to 1:25 scale (for the bigger as King and Country).

 

[Hunter Rose]

v

So OK, WWII First legion range (except Waffen SS) is true 1:30 scale.

The First Legion Waffen SS are sculpted taller, but they're still true 1/30 in my opinion. They just represent taller soldiers.

People get way too hung up on figures being the exact same height. More important to me is that the limbs and torsos are the same relative thickness, the heads are within normal human size differences, and the weapons/equipment is all the same if that was the case in reality. Note that German helmets and helmet liners came in different sizes, so German helmets do not need to be identical in size.

Here's some other pics of the Waffen SS next to the FJs. Note that the weapons and equipment are the same size, the arms and legs are the same thickness, and the heads and torsos are close in size. The size differences are well within the normal human range.

The slight size difference is no worse than the difference between the large and small Panzer crew in the historic pics below.

And so that would mean that all other brands (except some War Park items) are off scale in regard of "true" 1:30, with "huge" figures in 1:28 to 1:25 scale (for the bigger as King and Country).

Yes, the other brands WW2 figures are a little larger in scale, and probably more accurately described as 1/29 or 1/28. The other manufacturers usually compensate by making their tanks/vehicles slightly larger (War Park, TGM, K&C), so everything looks fine.

It's really not a big deal in my opinion, as you can mix and match plenty of stuff from the different manufacturers and it looks great together.

These slight size differences are not unique to our hobby. These same discussions happen all the time in the 1/35 modeling world too.

 

[Mastercom10]

v


The First Legion Waffen SS are sculpted taller, but they're still true 1/30 in my opinion. They just represent taller soldiers.

People get way too hung up on figures being the exact same height. More important to me is that the limbs and torsos are the same relative thickness, the heads are within normal human size differences, and the weapons/equipment is all the same if that was the case in reality. Note that German helmets and helmet liners came in different sizes, so German helmets do not need to be identical in size.

Here's some other pics of the Waffen SS next to the FJs. Note that the weapons and equipment are the same size, the arms and legs are the same thickness, and the heads and torsos are close in size. The size differences are well within the normal human range.

The slight size difference is no worse than the difference between the large and small Panzer crew in the historic pics below.



View attachment 344862View attachment 344863View attachment 344864View attachment 344865View attachment 344866View attachment 344867View attachment 344868

View attachment 344870



Yes, the other brands WW2 figures are a little larger in scale, and probably more accurately described as 1/29 or 1/28. The other manufacturers usually compensate by making their tanks/vehicles slightly larger (War Park, TGM, K&C), so everything looks fine.

It's really not a big deal in my opinion, as you can mix and match plenty of stuff from the different manufacturers and it looks great together.

These slight size differences are not unique to our hobby. These same discussions happen all the time in the 1/35 modeling world too.

Thanks Hunter Rose, very constructive discussion.

 

[Hunter Rose]

Thanks Hunter Rose, very constructive discussion.

You're quite welcome. I always enjoy discussing the hobby.

 

[Panzer ace]

Thanks Hunter Rose, very constructive discussion.

As an everyday collector I enjoyed the back and forth in this thread.

It was very informative.

 

[wayne556517]

So after all that anyone want to buy him

 

[FirstLegion]

17 years on and the scale discussion is alive and well as ever. Too funny, can't believe people still talk about this when we've released 500 different sets in our WWII range. I think by now we are a known quantity.

 

[OzDigger]

So after all that anyone want to buy him

Nope, to small for accurate 1:30 displays.

 

[tryfon]

Its not about the size of actual German soldiers in real life, FL WW2 figures are smallers than the other FL ranges such as the Romans / Celts , and as picture provided above by Mastercom, its about blending in with other brands as well
the FL Romans/Celts I have fabulous , and blend well with other brands. all the best Trevor

 

[BrianW]

Its not about the size of actual German soldiers in real life, FL WW2 figures are smallers than the other FL ranges such as the Romans / Celts , and as picture provided above by Mastercom, its about blending in with other brands as well
the FL Romans/Celts I have fabulous , and blend well with other brands. all the best Trevor

Hi Trevor, I display my First Legion WW2 figures with War Park, WBritain, John Jenkins, Xuan Hau, Old Northwest Trading Company and, even some Eagle Designs (in the background to pad out a display) overall, I'm happy with the results. At the end of the day, we all mix and match (if at all) in ways which pleases our own eye, after all, each of us is aiming to achieve differing results with our collections. Wishing you and all fellow members of this fantastic forum a happy, healthy and peaceful New Year.

 

[OzDigger]

Hi Trevor, I display my First Legion WW2 figures with War Park, WBritain, John Jenkins, Xuan Hau, Old Northwest Trading Company and, even some Eagle Designs (in the background to pad out a display) overall, I'm happy with the results. At the end of the day, we all mix and match (if at all) in ways which pleases our own eye, after all, each of us is aiming to achieve differing results with our collections. Wishing you and all fellow members of this fantastic forum a happy, healthy and peaceful New Year.

Yep, we all collect what we like. I don't like to pay big money for small size 1:30 scale figures that fall apart.

 

[Panzer ace]

Yep, we all collect what we like. I don't like to pay big money for small size 1:30 scale figures that fall apart.

Not taking sides in the scale debate etc., and I respect your posts, however what do you mean by “fall apart”?

 

[Gebhard]

Not taking sides in the scale debate etc., and I respect your posts, however what do you mean by “fall apart”?

I'm not sure how long you've been collecting FL but Matt " Oz Digger" has one less FL figure or product then Wayne which means if your bad in math he owns absolutely none.

He has been a long-time troll of all things First Legion so respecting his post when it comes to FL is not really the way to go and by doing so you've already taking the bait.

Its best to just laugh, ignore and move on. But I must say it is funny to see after all these years he is still holding fast.

Happy New Year

 

[OzDigger]

I'm not sure how long you've been collecting FL but Matt " Oz Digger" has one less FL figure or product then Wayne which means if your bad in math he owns absolutely none.

He has been a long-time troll of all things First Legion so respecting his post when it comes to FL is not really the way to go and by doing so you've already taking the bait.

Its best to just laugh, ignore and move on. But I must say it is funny to see after all these years he is still holding fast.

Happy New Year

Unlike yourself, I have no allegiance to any brand, I'm only interested in the truth. In fact I've posted more negative comments about King & Country than any other brand, mainly because they have produced far more Toy Soldiers than other TS companies in recent years.

Further more your 'information' is even less reliable than your judgement. I had a cabinet full of First Legion figures ranging from Samurai to WW2, and I know several forum members that have many more.

The variation in size amongst First Legion ranges is well known as are the problems with breakages because of overuse of resin parts together with fractures due to metal alloy problems etc. This is exacerbated by First Legion tending to display figures in dramatic posses, such as horses on one leg.

 

[Gebhard]

Unlike yourself, I have no allegiance to any brand, I'm only interested in the truth. In fact I've posted more negative comments about King & Country than any other brand, mainly because they have produced far more Toy Soldiers than other TS companies in recent years.

Further more your 'information' is even less reliable than your judgement. I had a cabinet full of First Legion figures ranging from Samurai to WW2, and I know several forum members that have many more.

The variation in size amongst First Legion ranges is well known as are the problems with breakages because of overuse of resin parts together with fractures due to metal alloy problems etc. This is exacerbated by First Legion tending to display figures in dramatic posses, such as horses on one leg.

Oddly enough no one mentioned K&C but you, freudian slip, flash backs or maybe that is the real problem.


Thanks for not disappointing... key words are "had a cabinet full" and that is Hilarious in its own right as well as proving my math correct.

I have no allegiance to any manufacture but buy what I like. I do have many more FL figures then other brands because frankly I like them especially their Napoleonics, Ladesknechts, Franco Prussian and Seven years' war and a few WWI and II items. Many going back to 2008 and oddly enough I've never really had any of the problems you mention.

I'm not going to get into it with you again frankly because I just don't care and I'm beyond tired of your trolling BS which is well documented going back to FL's beginning.

But please feel free to tell anyone who will listen all your opinions about all those FL figures you have oops had.

 

[OzDigger]

Oddly enough no one mentioned K&C but you, freudian slip, flash backs or maybe that is the real problem.


Thanks for not disappointing... key words are "had a cabinet full" and that is Hilarious in its own right as well as proving my math correct.

I have no allegiance to any manufacture but buy what I like. I do have many more FL figures then other brands because frankly I like them especially their Napoleonics, Ladesknechts, Franco Prussian and Seven years' war and a few WWI and II items. Many going back to 2008 and oddly enough I've never really had any of the problems you mention.

I'm not going to get into it with you again frankly because I just don't care and I'm beyond tired of your trolling BS which is well documented going back to FL's beginning.

But please feel free to tell anyone who will listen all your opinions about all those FL figures you have oops had.

Despite your continued lies I did have a separate cabinet for my First Legion collection that included a Normandy Tiger tank, since sold on ebay together with other FL sets, the remainder I dispossed of via trades with my local dealer, since deceased. I only have one FL set left, being the Normandy Machine Gun Team, I'm open to offers on that set as it's been difficult to sell on ebay, not sure why as it looks ok to me. I had to display First Legion items on their own because they were to small to combine with the other brands, which is the main reason I stopped collecting First Legion, their delicate build and high retail cost was also an issue.

Like you I personally didn't have any figures fall apart due to metal issues, however I know of several well known Aussie members on this forum that experienced that serious problem. However, I did have damage issues with most of my Mounted FL sets, especially the Samurais, by accidently breaking their delicate resin reigns, saddle tassels etc whenever I handled them. Mainly my fault as I sometimes forgot to pick them up by the bases, which is the only safe way to handle these sets imo.

Despite your assertions, you have a long history on this forum (and others) of vehemently defending First Legion whenever someone posts an issue with the brand. If you can't handle serious TS discussions, I suggest you remain quiet in Maryland.

 

[Gebhard]

I suggest you remain quiet in Maryland.

Oh what a tuff guy I'm guessing that's another not so hidden threat from down under .

I'm sure there are a lot of very cool collectors down under but for some strange reasons there has since First Legions inception been a few here and on other TS forums over the years who have said the most asinine things about First Legion which of course provokes several FL collectors of sound mind myself included into responding to these petty, silly and all around ridiculously asinine comments.

But be man enough to admit it that really is the purpose after all right.

I've heard different versions of this **** since 2008, so forgive me if I've run out of patience for it. GOD knows how many threads have been shut down dating back to the days of my old buddy Harry the heid and Terry we are talking 17 years +now but sadly it still continues.

We've heard it all before figures too small, tanks too light it goes on and on and round and round you guys really have to find something better to do. It really is a petty and childish way to behave for such tuff guys. I say tuff guys only because your comments always seem to end the same way with threatening rhetoric which is even more sadly pathetic.


Anyway, Happy New Year

 

[OzDigger]

Oh what a tuff guy I'm guessing that's another not so hidden threat from down under .

I'm sure there are a lot of very cool collectors down under but for some strange reasons there has since First Legions inception been a few here and on other TS forums over the years who have said the most asinine things about First Legion which of course provokes several FL collectors of sound mind myself included into responding to these petty, silly and all around ridiculously asinine comments.

But be man enough to admit it that really is the purpose after all right.

I've heard different versions of this **** since 2008, so forgive me if I've run out of patience for it. GOD knows how many threads have been shut down dating back to the days of my old buddy Harry the heid and Terry we are talking 17 years +now but sadly it still continues.

We've heard it all before figures too small, tanks too light it goes on and on and round and round you guys really have to find something better to do. It really is a petty and childish way to behave for such tuff guys. I say tuff guys only because your comments always seem to end the same way with threatening rhetoric which is even more sadly pathetic.


Anyway, Happy New Year

Ha Ha, you thought that last line was a threat, there must be some sensitive types in Maryland. You are the one that said you're weren't going to get into anymore discussions about the well known problems with First Legion, yet here you are again, and again, and again.

If other peoples comments upset you that much, why do you keep coming back, just let it go.

Shhh be quite, everything will be ok, it's just Toy Soldiers

 

[Gebhard]

Ha Ha, you thought that last line was a threat, there must be some sensitive types in Maryland.

Now that's funny who knows maybe one day we can have a beer or two and talk all about it.



Real concerns from real FL collectors have always been addressed by Matt and discussed by forum members but yes, I'll admit I'm done with the trolls from down under must be old age no time for BS.

 

[OzDigger]

Here are some photos side by side.
Generally, WWII FL are noticeably smaller than Britain stuff.
I added also an example in the same Normandy range with Waffen SS and german Fallschirmjäger.View attachment 344330View attachment 344331View attachment 344332View attachment 344333View attachment 344334View attachment 344335View attachment 344336View attachment 344337

Thank you for posting these comparison photos, First Legion WW2 figures are certainly smaller than most other brands, their smaller size makes it problematic to display them with other Figures, Tanks & Vehicles made by other Brands.