Sherman is coming (1 Viewer)

[spartan71]

I would love to see maybe a Sherman Calliope, or logs attached to it like the one in Brat Pitt's movie. And after the Sherman's been done. Half-Tracks would be extremely cool.

 

[uksubs]

I would love to see maybe a Sherman Calliope, or logs attached to it like the one in Brat Pitt's movie. And after the Sherman's been done. Half-Tracks would be extremely cool.

Sherman Calliope did not see action in Normandy and with figarti already made one which has not sold out doubt Fl would make one

 

[uksubs]

How about the entire line too darn expensive compared to anyone else.?..How about vehicles made out of lightweight plastic resin kind of stuff..? How about rubber tracks on their armor..? Someone had to finally say it...! Michael

Troll baiting post ?

 

[Mitch]

Price and worth is down to the individual collector we are free and mature enough to have an opinion about it. It could equally be said some other manufacturers products are over priced and under detailed. That is an opinion.

I would like to hear why people think they are over priced. Why is the light weight plastic resin an issue?

Why is weight an issue? Surely everyone knows that weight does not equate to value or detail. I don't for myself see the correlation in weight.

I have said a lot about the FL WWII range. IMO they are not overpriced for what you get. The samurai and crusades which I have been collecting for a number of years are superb.

As I have asked a number of times you seem happy to critique scale, colour etc of TCS and that is fine but, you seem unable to hear K&C critiqued. Perhaps, you could explain the difference in why that is the case.
Mitch

P.S. (note to mods) there is nothing personal here just a mature response to valid points.

How about the entire line too darn expensive compared to anyone else.?..How about vehicles made out of lightweight plastic resin kind of stuff..? How about rubber tracks on their armor..? Someone had to finally say it...! Michael

 

[Mitch]

Not sure I would want a Sherman variant like this. I would rather have seen a Firefly but, understand why FL has chosen the bog standard Sherman to release. More interested in the coming German armour and as more of an eastern front fan what comes in the west is more secondary of interest to me.

Having said that I will still probably end up getting one and moving on some of the other standard shermans I have
Mitch

Sherman Calliope did not see action in Normandy and with figarti already made one which has not sold out doubt Fl would make one

 

[Andanna]

Another question is whether at least two different numbers will be offered. But as these tanks are produced in batches I assume, I am not sure this is affordable.

 

[Phantom Warrior]

Another question is whether at least two different numbers will be offered. But as these tanks are produced in batches I assume, I am not sure this is affordable.

Who says they are going to have numbers let alone different numbers. For realism they would need different registration numbers beginning with a 30 (not a 40 as in the prototype) and variations in the bumper code on the front and rear of the tank. And some of the first landed tanks in Normandy had large yellow buzz numbers on the turrets. And many Shermans had names starting with the letter of the company like Blockbuster in company B. That could be 8 modifications per tank as opposed to just 2 modifications on a German tank.

As for rubber treads on the model - the real Shermans had rubber track pads. {sm4}

Terry

 

[sammy719]

How about the entire line too darn expensive compared to anyone else.?..How about vehicles made out of lightweight plastic resin kind of stuff..? How about rubber tracks on their armor..? Someone had to finally say it...! Michael

What about it?? as a great poet once said..."just stick to what you can afford"...Sammy

 

[binder001]

re: the Sherman. Personally, I think the "basic" M4 is a good starting point. Depending on how FL produces their vehicles these could be produced in batches with variations. As Terry pointed out the first two armored divisions into Normandy (2nd Armored and 3rd Armored) had yellow "buzz numbers" or "call numbers" with the company lettter and the tank's number. The seperate tank battalions didn't often have the numbers or such, but the 70th Tank Battalion used red number with white outlines on D-Day (Utah Beach) on a number of their tanks. Some 70th TB tanks also had the battalion's cartoon mascot painted in the side. As the Normandy campaign went on the numbers were often over painted, so one might see dark OD splotches on the turret. About the time of Operation Cobra the 12th Army Group specificed that tanks should receive a pattern overspray of black paint. With the US Army spread out through Normandy and with many units in contact with the enemy a lot of tanks didn't get painted for Opn Cobra, so period photos show tanks with buzz numbers, plain OD tanks, tanks with painted out stars or numbers and some tanks with black paint over the OD, plus the 7th Armored Division seems to have maintained the full white star markings through the breakout period from viewing British Pathe movie films). That provides several paint schemes just for M4s during the Normandy campaign. One can also add in the hedgerow "choppers" or "rhinos" (several versions) on the nose of some tanks and some units started adding sand bags to the front of the tanks about then. That means the basic M4 can have several variations in color or accessories. Add in the fact that some British units received M4s in addition to their other models, and some of those M4s were converted to "Firefly" 17-pounder tanks. That shows that First Legion chose a good basic model to start with (IMHO). They can produce other variants as sales allow or customers request.

Again, I'm not sure how FL produces their vehicles, but some of the basic M4 components could also be used to produce the M4A1 with its distinctive cast hull. These were the second most common Sherman in US service in Normandy. The running gear could also be applicable to an M4 with 105mm howitzer. These "assault gun" tanks had just started production in the spring of 1944 and some units didn't receive theirs until they were already committed to combat. The other major US Sherman variant in Normandy was the M4A1 76mm Wet Stowage that reached the 2nd and 3rd Armored Divisions in mid-to-late July (but these have been made by Collector's Showcase and Honour Bound).

Gary B.

 

[maddadicus]

Troll baiting post ?

A member noted that no one ever had issues with F/L and I responded somewhat flippant, that these are all legit past problems with those on the fence about F/L products. Why does a lightweight resin/plastic tank with plastic tracks cost more than metal or polystone offerings from any other mfg.? Is absolute accuracy worth $100.00 plus extra? It is a proper question to ask about. Michael

 

[sammy719]

A member noted that no one ever had issues with F/L and I responded somewhat flippant, that these are all legit past problems with those on the fence about F/L products. Why does a lightweight resin/plastic tank with plastic tracks cost more than metal or polystone offerings from any other mfg.? Is absolute accuracy worth $100.00 plus extra? It is a proper question to ask about. Michael

Is the 100.00 worth accuracy you asked?? sure is...Sammy

 

[sammy719]

A member noted that no one ever had issues with F/L and I responded somewhat flippant, that these are all legit past problems with those on the fence about F/L products. Why does a lightweight resin/plastic tank with plastic tracks cost more than metal or polystone offerings from any other mfg.? Is absolute accuracy worth $100.00 plus extra? It is a proper question to ask about. Michael

Dude, your trying to stir up ol dust that settled lonnnngg ago, the forum has for the most part moved on from the old days of K&C vs. FL which is suerly a good thing, but every now and then someone has to stir the pot just for a refesher course, it's very fair to say you do not like FL product, right? you don't collect FL product right?, but do like to make sarcastic remarks on FL product, right?? I'll answer that one for you..yup!! enjoy the forum, and your collection and let others do the same...Sammy

 

[uksubs]

A member noted that no one ever had issues with F/L and I responded somewhat flippant, that these are all legit past problems with those on the fence about F/L products. Why does a lightweight resin/plastic tank with plastic tracks cost more than metal or polystone offerings from any other mfg.? Is absolute accuracy worth $100.00 plus extra? It is a proper question to ask about. Michael

Michael to be honest mate the whole hobby is over priced across the board mate not just fl so as Andy say buy what you like and we're lucky there so much choice

 

[Phantom Warrior]

There's a lot of good info on Shermans in this thread. Too bad it will be lost amid the clutter of costs, resins, polystone and everything else not related to a soon to be released model of a Sherman. This time we get a bunch of info on Shermans in Normandy before the model is released and rather than discuss a new topic it's the same old ****e.

Terry

 

[sammy719]

re: the Sherman. Personally, I think the "basic" M4 is a good starting point. Depending on how FL produces their vehicles these could be produced in batches with variations. As Terry pointed out the first two armored divisions into Normandy (2nd Armored and 3rd Armored) had yellow "buzz numbers" or "call numbers" with the company lettter and the tank's number. The seperate tank battalions didn't often have the numbers or such, but the 70th Tank Battalion used red number with white outlines on D-Day (Utah Beach) on a number of their tanks. Some 70th TB tanks also had the battalion's cartoon mascot painted in the side. As the Normandy campaign went on the numbers were often over painted, so one might see dark OD splotches on the turret. About the time of Operation Cobra the 12th Army Group specificed that tanks should receive a pattern overspray of black paint. With the US Army spread out through Normandy and with many units in contact with the enemy a lot of tanks didn't get painted for Opn Cobra, so period photos show tanks with buzz numbers, plain OD tanks, tanks with painted out stars or numbers and some tanks with black paint over the OD, plus the 7th Armored Division seems to have maintained the full white star markings through the breakout period from viewing British Pathe movie films). That provides several paint schemes just for M4s during the Normandy campaign. One can also add in the hedgerow "choppers" or "rhinos" (several versions) on the nose of some tanks and some units started adding sand bags to the front of the tanks about then. That means the basic M4 can have several variations in color or accessories. Add in the fact that some British units received M4s in addition to their other models, and some of those M4s were converted to "Firefly" 17-pounder tanks. That shows that First Legion chose a good basic model to start with (IMHO). They can produce other variants as sales allow or customers request.

Again, I'm not sure how FL produces their vehicles, but some of the basic M4 components could also be used to produce the M4A1 with its distinctive cast hull. These were the second most common Sherman in US service in Normandy. The running gear could also be applicable to an M4 with 105mm howitzer. These "assault gun" tanks had just started production in the spring of 1944 and some units didn't receive theirs until they were already committed to combat. The other major US Sherman variant in Normandy was the M4A1 76mm Wet Stowage that reached the 2nd and 3rd Armored Divisions in mid-to-late July (but these have been made by Collector's Showcase and Honour Bound).

Gary B.

thanks Gary on this review, as Terry said alot of great information here and gladed you took the time to give us all some real feedback on what looks to be an outstanding tank...Sammy

 

[6th Wisconsin]

Well, personally, I love K&C and First Legion and a bunch of other manufacturers. Certain things appeal to me more than others, and that is what I buy. It is great to have variety! It does create tough choices for us who are not so brand loyal though. Look at all the companies producing WWI French now. Tough choices, but there are much worse problems in life!! I do appreciate most of the honest criticism from our knowledgeable members though. I am not terribly concerned with most minor errors, but some do affect my choices.

 

[wadepat]

Gentle Friends,

Mitch has been excused from further conversation on this thread.

Warmest personal regards,

Pat

 

[Panzer ace]

I think starting with a "basic" Sherman as their first piece of allied armor is a good idea. It is one of the most recognizable tanks of the war.

 

[Vezzolf]

Michael to be honest mate the whole hobby is over priced across the board mate not just FL

Yes the entire hobby is over-priced....NO DOUBT....and....VERY TRUE......Regarding the Question: Is the accuracy worth $100+ extra for an AFV....Maybe yes...MAYBE NOT.....Maybe we will have to decide "how much" we will buy and simply limit our purchases:wink2:.....The real question is Quality vs Quantity...I personally think $50 extra would be a more then fair mark up for historically accurate AFV's:wink2:...That said I certainly would not want to purchase "toy like", poorly made, and historically inaccurate products for a just a few dollars less......So I will buy VERY CAREFULLY....before I part with my hard earned money.

 

[Jack]

I have never run a business so I have next to no knowledge of market forces but if everything by everyone is overpriced, does that mean the company prepared to price their product appropriately would then automatically corner the market? Where is that company?