1st Legion's New Stug (1 Viewer)

[Steven Chong]

... I just find it interesting that you just spent $300 on a vehicle and had very little positive to say about it short of "Ultimately, I bought it because I liked the look of it." Hey, I guess that's what its all about in the end and buying it speaks volumes.

With all due respect, please reread my posts as I find your comments continually ignore or misstate my comments. I pointed out many features of the new Stug and specificially mentioned the winterketten as a reason for purchasing your Stug. Besides, "buying it speaks volumes." I am sorry my comments lack words like "best" or "finest," but any review of my more serious posts will show that I do not post gushing statements about any products.

...I find it even more interesting that you have over 100 of our Napoleonic figures, a considerable investment, and I don't think you've ever once stated anything on this forum about collecting our figures or participated in really any First Legion discussion at all. Nothing wrong with this of course, I just find it interesting ...

Your repeated use of the phrase "I [just] find it interesting" strongly suggests you believe my original post in this thread to have a nefarious purpose, which I find insulting. Understand that except for some purchases of rare or special sets, I do not post any comments on what I buy. A majority of my serious posts (as oppposed to posts that joke with friends on the forum) are reports on talks at various shows and feeble attempts to answer questions or provide some insight. If you ask George, you will find that I purchased the first Stug that he sold. As stated in my original post, several collectors and I discussed the 1st Legion Stug and had various opinions. My purpose for starting this thread was to try to explain the basis of Tom's (tdubel) comments on another manufacturer's thread -- much of which was deleted as I drafted this thread. I had hoped to provide the various opinions so collectors could make their own purchasing decisions. Again, if you talk with George, you will find that some collectors (potential customers?) are asking about the weight of the Stug and its materials. Understand that I was not put off by the weight of the Stug and purchased one -- "... buying it speaks volumes."

Finally, I explained the reason why I posted the number of 1st Legion figures I currently own in the first post, so I find the negative insinuation given to someone who has not previously posted in this thread to be offensive. If you do not wish any contrary opinions regarding your products and feel the need to impinge the motives behind any such comment, I will accomodate you and cease to post in your company's thread.

 

[wayne556517]

WOW ive missed something here very heated,you gotta love it..............

 

[spartan71]

This has been a lively debate. Pros vs cons. I was planning to buy the stug, But after reading this thread.I am a little hesitant now. With 1st legion not having any dealers, makes it harder to gauge, If it is a must buy.
So gentlemen, IF you are posting an opinion, Please do it. because of the piece. Not because You are loyal to one manufacturer or two. Every single piece's opinion, has to be based on the piece itself. not because of on who makes it. because overall it should just be all in the heading of " toy soldiers", regardless of/on who makes it".
I trust in every thread that I read, that it is impartial. And pretty much gauge some things because of it. so please be aware of your opinions, on how it is going to affect, the rest of us on decisions making.

 

[SteveDavid]

Steven,

knowing Matt a bit, I think that he was not having a go at your post directly.

As I said I like the depth of your review, even though I might not agree to all of it.

But what I think is the case here, Matt must feel a bit like Lance Armstrong; different day, same **** ( and I don't refer to you !! ). This Stug has raised more comments than any other vehicle on this Forum 3 months before its release! First people say: enough figures, show us your vehicles. Then the vehicle gets killed because it is expensive for some, then this idiotic discussion about size... And I could get on and on...

I can understand that the new kid on the block like someone said is irritating as it brings undeniable quality to the table that many people were waiting for! But then people should give it a break at some point. FL exists since less than 2 years and deserve credit for what they are doing. And this is what you pointed out in your post.

People should apply the same standards of scrutinyvto all manufacturers offerings or just post where their heart beats. Who cares whether I don't like
K&C's products? Noone. So therefore I don't post under the K&C threads that I don't like them by listing 100 reasons why not.

 

[FirstLegion]

With all due respect, please reread my posts as I find your comments continually ignore or misstate my comments. I pointed out many features of the new Stug and specificially mentioned the winterketten as a reason for purchasing your Stug. Besides, "buying it speaks volumes." I am sorry my comments lack words like "best" or "finest," but any review of my more serious posts will show that I do not post gushing statements about any products.



Your repeated use of the phrase "I [just] find it interesting" strongly suggests you believe my original post in this thread to have a nefarious purpose, which I find insulting. Understand that except for some purchases of rare or special sets, I do not post any comments on what I buy. A majority of my serious posts (as oppposed to posts that joke with friends on the forum) are reports on talks at various shows and feeble attempts to answer questions or provide some insight. If you ask George, you will find that I purchased the first Stug that he sold. As stated in my original post, several collectors and I discussed the 1st Legion Stug and had various opinions. My purpose for starting this thread was to try to explain the basis of Tom's (tdubel) comments on another manufacturer's thread -- much of which was deleted as I drafted this thread. I had hoped to provide the various opinions so collectors could make their own purchasing decisions. Again, if you talk with George, you will find that some collectors (potential customers?) are asking about the weight of the Stug and its materials. Understand that I was not put off by the weight of the Stug and purchased one -- "... buying it speaks volumes."

Finally, I explained the reason why I posted the number of 1st Legion figures I currently own in the first post, so I find the negative insinuation given to someone who has not previously posted in this thread to be offensive. If you do not wish any contrary opinions regarding your products and feel the need to impinge the motives behind any such comment, I will accomodate you and cease to post in your company's thread.

I think you're misreading me entirely Steven. If I have offended you, it certainly wasn't on purpose. It would be pretty counterproductive to do so. So that wasn't my intent at all and my comments about "finding it interesting" aren't to suggest that you were being "nefarious" in some way. I'm sorry you took it that way, as that is not what I meant at all. In fact, most of what I was specifically thinking of has little to nothing to do with you at all Steven.

In the end, I'm probably misreading you and you're misreading me and I definitely shouldn't make inferences as there is the possibility that they will be construed the wrong way, which is what has happened here. I'll take the hit on that, but just know that at no point did I mean to be offensive towards you personally. If you want to discuss this further, feel free to PM me.

Regards,

Matt

 

[Rob]

Since I've been on this forum I don't think I've ever read/received so many good and bad reviews of one vehicle!.Opinion seems to be split right down the middle on this,can't wait to see it for myself in London.Am I right in thinking its available in both a Grey and Yellowish colour?

Rob

 

[SteveDavid]

@Steven Chong

Steven, I have actually a question for you, especially after re-reading your original post over and over again.

Having seen the Stug in person and with all the "criticisms" that you have laid out, why did you actually buy it? It is for sure not cheap and is according to your review not perfect...so why? Is it because of the winterketten? Or because it looks good? Or because of both? Or because of...

You know this is what do not really get out of your post. You are the first one buying it because you SAW it - all of us bought/ordered it just seeing it from the photos. Yet I lack the enthusiasm...

What excited you about it to the point buying it and encouraging others, who have not seen it in person, to buy it?

Would appreciate your comments on this...

Thanks in advance.

 

[damian]

For Heaven's sake.
Buy don't buy
Like don't like
Whatever..

 

[Andanna]

I have ordered by StuG blindly from George and I am very happy with it. The detail is unsurpassed and the coloring and weathering are spot on. I think the question whether the StuG goes with FL figures in scale has been sufficiently covered.

The FL StuG is not "shot up" with broken tracks or holes in its side. But it is equipment that went through some hot dusty months in Russia in 1942 - just without incurring major damage. It is not a diecast model.

I strongly believe that pictures say more than a thousand words. I may hence refer to Carlos' excellent pictures here:

http://www.treefrogtreasures.com/forum/showthread.php?t=16527

I have taken these and I am happy to take more upon request:

And yes, you need readers or a magnifying glass to appreciate all the details. I would therefore recommend the StuG to individuals who enjoy a thoroughly researched, detail oriented vehicle and plan to treat it as an individual treasure. First Legion is aggressively moving into the "connoisseur" level - including this vehicle. I think it comes very close to an individually built and painted vehicle.

I was very impressed by the Figarti vehicles in Chicago. I think they get close to what Matt and his team have achieved. Figarti does an excellent job and I really enjoy the selection of vehicles and the all-over look. I am also certain they are as quality control oriented as Matt is.

Having said that, I think overall, the First Legion product is of excellent quality with unmatched detail and is for $300, including the two tankers, a very good bargain.

 

[SteveDavid]

Andanna,

that's what I mean! This is a convincing impartial assessment of why you put 300$ bucks on the table!

FL is very realistic and I am glad it is being recognised by others!

Thank you.

 

[Eazy]

Five pages of back and forth, back and forth and not ONE single photo from anybody that actually has it.

Come on guys!

Like Rob said earlier it will be good to see this in the flesh in London and make our own minds up.

 

[tdubel]

To Steve David, The Breaker, etc.

Ok, the forum is for people's opinions, reviews, etc. They are not always going to be what you agree with, they are not always what I agree with. It is each person's preference. I viewed the Stug in person, I analyzed it and decided it was not a direction I was going to go in. That doesn't mean its not good for someone else? I really never understand the need to defend any manufacturer, they more than anyone understand that not everybody is going to buy every release? Its a big hobby with lots of choice, that is a good thing. I am happy for everyone who finds something they like.

When I mention adding fuel to the fire, it is kind of comical that it really does.

And, I am by no means picking on FL, I believe I have a history of commenting that the Naps are some of the finest figures I have seen in some time. Just because the WW2 stuff is my preference doesn't mean they are not good and for someone else??

Again, I find it unfortunate that there are some who make there responses personal just because someone else doesn't prefer what they do.

TD

 

[Phantom Warrior]

To Steve David, The Breaker, etc.

Ok, the forum is for people's opinions, reviews, etc. They are not always going to be what you agree with, they are not always what I agree with. It is each person's preference. I viewed the Stug in person, I analyzed it and decided it was not a direction I was going to go in. That doesn't mean its not good for someone else? I really never understand the need to defend any manufacturer, they more than anyone understand that not everybody is going to buy every release? Its a big hobby with lots of choice, that is a good thing. I am happy for everyone who finds something they like.

When I mention adding fuel to the fire, it is kind of comical that it really does.

And, I am by no means picking on FL, I believe I have a history of commenting that the Naps are some of the finest figures I have seen in some time. Just because the WW2 stuff is my preference doesn't mean they are not good and for someone else??

Again, I find it unfortunate that there are some who make there responses personal just because someone else doesn't prefer what they do.

TD

Sorry Tom, but we apparently don't know ALL of the posters here well enough to say whether they take things personal or not. And I guess can't tell from the tone of the post either.

Terry

 

[tdubel]

Sorry Tom, but we apparently don't know ALL of the posters here well enough to say whether they take things personal or not. And I guess can't tell from the tone of the post either.

Terry

I agree, my post was more of an explanation and to state all sides. Again, I think we are back to the buy what you like and be happy about it theory. I do like the fact that opinions are expressed as they provide insight on products whether you agree or not. I have bought many a product that got reviews both good and bad and when I get the product, I find it interesting that even if I didn't like an opinion, I can see where it came from upon inspection of the product.

I think tone is a hard thing to convey via written communication. I can assure all on the board who don't know me, I kind of state things the way I see it, black and white, never any malice in my tone. I don't get upset if you don't agree with me, I respect your opinion, however, I do not really appreciate the personal digs as they are unnecessary. This is a fun hobby, what makes it neat is the differing products and opinions.

TD

 

[SteveDavid]

If you had done what you wrote in your last post, nobody would have jumped in. But the way you wrote and the way you made your point about plastics is in complete opposite to the toned down version of it, is something which I find extremely comical.

As the Breaker said we don't need patronising mails and I personally don't see the point that someone posts under a manufacturer thread why he doesn't buy a certain product...I don't care and it adds nothing.

 

[tdubel]

If you had done what you wrote in your last post, nobody would have jumped in. But the way you wrote and the way you made your point about plastics is in complete opposite to the toned down version of it, is something which I find extremely comical.

As the Breaker said we don't need patronising mails and I personally don't see the point that someone posts under a manufacturer thread why he doesn't buy a certain product...I don't care and it adds nothing.

Nice tone

There was nothing patronising about it. I buy ALL products including FL, I like you have a right to express my opinion, that is what the board is about. I believe differing opinions add a lot of value, yet you wish to suppress anything that is not yours? As you quote, it adds nothing? I believe it does and so do most on the board from what I have surmised over the years.

TD

 

[jazzeum]

Steve,

I think you need to tone it down. My suggestion is that if you have some points that you wish to take make to other posters that you do it via pm.

This back and forth is getting embarassing and this thread is about one step from cyberspace oblivion.

 

[Rob]

Brad,did you see the Stug in Chicago,tempted?.

Rob

 

[Wraith]

this thread is about one step from cyberspace oblivion.

Cool. Does the screen fill with pretty explosions n' stuff? Is it better than Star Wars?

 

[debrito]

Brad,did you see the Stug in Chicago,tempted?.

Rob

Rob, I saw, and touched it and reviewed again and touched AGAIN. It is a wonderful Tank, very accurate with full body crew…WHAT YOU WANT MORE?