K&C's Focke Wolfe wrong type? (5 Viewers)

[Combat]

I do take into consideration historical errors and make decisions whether to buy or not based, in part, on such errors. Many of those have been pointed out on this forum. The Rammjager being the classic example. Others may not care, but some do and I don't see any problem discussing it.

 

[tdubel]

I do take into consideration historical errors and make decisions whether to buy or not based, in part, on such errors. Many of those have been pointed out on this forum. The Rammjager being the classic example. Others may not care, but some do and I don't see any problem discussing it.

Doug,

Regarding the Rammjager, wasn't it decided that it actually was a prototype or combination of prototypes, etc. Andy took artistic license with the story he weaved for the marketing of the item, correct? Or is my memory off on that?

Tom

 

[ecuriel]

Talk about beating a dead horse! Please, someone get the gun out already.
The scene in "Animal House" where the Deltas shout, "It just doesn't matter" would be appropriate now.

 

[Combat]

Doug,

Regarding the Rammjager, wasn't it decided that it actually was a prototype or combination of prototypes, etc. Andy took artistic license with the story he weaved for the marketing of the item, correct? Or is my memory off on that?

Tom

Tom-
I don't want to rehash that long and painful discussion, but to the best of my knowledge the RJ was a complete fabrication. There were some German prototypes that had two wings and were meant to fly, but other than that no real similarities. An example of the combination of vehicles might be the German WWI armored car which appears to be a combo of some allied armored cars. The KC version did not exist in any way, shape or form. It's somewhat inexplicable why KC wouldn't do the actual version.

 

[Beaufighter]

Tom-
I don't want to rehash that long and painful discussion, but to the best of my knowledge the RJ was a complete fabrication. There were some German prototypes that had two wings and were meant to fly, but other than that no real similarities. An example of the combination of vehicles might be the German WWI armored car which appears to be a combo of some allied armored cars. The KC version did not exist in any way, shape or form. It's somewhat inexplicable why KC wouldn't do the actual version.

I respectfully disagree in regards to the "RJ"...

 

[Rob]

Clearly discussions about details such as tail wheels, tracks etc will only be a concern to fussy collectors like me. Other less fussy collectors may be bored about such small details, but they are important to some.

Any arrangement is largely irrelevant, it's the fact that the arrangement was denied that is a concern to me (my last post on the subject).

Oz, sorry my mistake,I am not talking about the details of the issue here and we all want those to be totally accurate and any discussion about them welcomed. The reason I posted was that IXEC apears to be in the middle of this by either purpose or by accident, and what I was saying was does it matter to Joe average what one person thinks or posts when it comes to their purchasing?. If they are happy they will purchase if not they won't, one persons opinion probably would not persuade me either way.

Now I being called a Spy, a Mole, a Undercover Agent....


What can I say......other than, it reminds me..... of a song....


That's life (that's life), that's what all the people say
You're ridin' high in April, shot down in May
But I know I'm gonna change that tune
When I'm back on top, back on top in June

I said that's life (that's life), and as funny as it may seem
Some people get their kicks stompin' on a dream
But I don't let it, let it get me down
'cause this fine old world, it keeps spinnin' around

I've been a puppet, a pauper, a pirate, a poet, a pawn and a king
I've been up and down and over and out and I know one thing
Each time I find myself flat on my face
I pick myself up and get back in the race

That's life (that's life), I tell you I can't deny it
I thought of quitting, baby, but my heart just ain't gonna buy it
And if I didn't think it was worth one single try
I'd jump right on a big bird and then I'd fly

I've been a puppet, a pauper, a pirate, a poet, a pawn and a king
I've been up and down and over and out and I know one thing
Each time I find myself layin' flat on my face
I just pick myself up and get back in the race

That's life (that's life), that's life and I can't deny it
Many times I thought of cuttin' out but my heart won't buy it
But if there's nothin' shakin' come this here July
I'm gonna roll myself up in a big ball a-and die

My life!

NOPE! I didn't call you a mole,spy or agent, I said IF you were would it make a difference to any collecting decision I made and my answer would be a resounding no.

Rob

 

[spartan71]

If someone likes the K&C type. By all means Buy it. If you Like the other type. buy it when it comes out. If you like both types. then buy one and get the other one when it comes out.
But, If you are going to scrutinize, Make it direct, concise. and expect Negative responses. after all you are in the King & Country side. And Make all the RahRah, In the other manufacturer's Threads, please.
I like Pretty much all the Manufacturers, including TG. And this particular thread, Has had Negative opinions. That might hurt them.
So again, the RAHRAH posts In their respective sections, would be great.

 

[Rob]

If someone likes the K&C type. By all means Buy it. If you Like the other type. buy it when it comes out. If you like both types. then buy one and get the other one when it comes out.
But, If you are going to scrutinize, Make it direct, concise. and expect Negative responses. after all you are in the King & Country side. And Make all the RahRah, In the other manufacturer's Threads, please.
I like Pretty much all the Manufacturers, including TG. And this particular thread, Has had Negative opinions. That might hurt them.
So again, the RAHRAH posts In their respective sections, would be great.

I very much agree with this .Its just common respect for others.There is also a world of difference between raising perfectly valid questions and concerns about a product and a blatant RAH RAH post re another producer.

Rob

 

[OzDigger]

If someone likes the K&C type. By all means Buy it. If you Like the other type. buy it when it comes out. If you like both types. then buy one and get the other one when it comes out.
But, If you are going to scrutinize, Make it direct, concise. and expect Negative responses. after all you are in the King & Country side. And Make all the RahRah, In the other manufacturer's Threads, please.
I like Pretty much all the Manufacturers, including TG. And this particular thread, Has had Negative opinions. That might hurt them.
So again, the RAHRAH posts In their respective sections, would be great.

Excellent point and I believe it is a forum rule of sorts.

 

[OzDigger]

Oz, sorry my mistake,I am not talking about the details of the issue here and we all want those to be totally accurate and any discussion about them welcomed. The reason I posted was that IXEC apears to be in the middle of this by either purpose or by accident, and what I was saying was does it matter to Joe average what one person thinks or posts when it comes to their purchasing?. If they are happy they will purchase if not they won't, one persons opinion probably would not persuade me either way.

Rob, I wasn't going to post on this thread anymore, now I feel I was dragged into it again

No worries mate, I did understand what you meant. It's just that sometimes I think I'm wasting my time posting my thoughts based on many years of collecting military miniatures. I read that Louis and Tom have decided to cut back on contributing their points of view and I can understand their stance, but I feel the forum/hobby would be worse off without such experienced opinions.

If you want to know how much Joe average can be influenced I suggest you talk to someone in advertising. Poor Joe thinks it was his decision, but usually it wasn't. Humans are a very social species and they copy actions and behaviour from others without even knowing it. Haven't you ever purchased a model because you thought heaps of collectors were going to buy it and you may miss out? I know I have.

NOPE! I didn't call you a mole,spy or agent, I said IF you were would it make a difference to any collecting decision I made and my answer would be a resounding no.

Rob

I agree with Rob, small companies can use some help with promotions and few really care who does it, including my 'buddy' Ixec. What I do care about is that it's done with facts rather than inuendo and derision of other companies. And of course it doesn't help matters if someone says there is no relationship when there clearly is.

 

[Rob]

I asked for that one didn't I!

Good point about the buying in case you miss out syndrome,hadn't thought of it like that but oh yes I've done that plenty of times.

Rob

 

[Harvey]

I respectfully disagree in regards to the "RJ"...

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It's a Fieseler 103 Fi 103R!!! http://www.wehrmacht-history.com/luftwaffe/missiles/fieseler-fi-103r-v1-flying-bomb.htm

Harvey

 

[Capitolron]

WOW

Great Post Beau !

I never saw this article before - very interesting !

I respectfully disagree in regards to the "RJ"...

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View attachment 44903

 

[Harvey]

WOW

Great Post Beau !

I never saw this article before - very interesting !

Did you ever see that article before? http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...f-Hitler-alive-weird-conspiracy-theories.html

Can't wait for the new "artistic license" series. Adolf, Eva and the Goebbels family at the zoo. Tigers, lions, bears...

Cheers,
Harvey

 

[OzDigger]

I asked for that one didn't I!

Good point about the buying in case you miss out syndrome,hadn't thought of it like that but oh yes I've done that plenty of times.

Rob

You're a good sport Rob.

Btw guys, with the K & C WS100, check the photos of it, it didn't have a rocket pod fitted and it didn't have a jet intake. It was a completely fictitious get back to the drawing board K & C situation. I doubt that you will see the same again from K & C, too much competition these days.

 

[Spitfrnd]

If someone likes the K&C type. By all means Buy it. If you Like the other type. buy it when it comes out. If you like both types. then buy one and get the other one when it comes out.
But, If you are going to scrutinize, Make it direct, concise. and expect Negative responses. after all you are in the King & Country side. And Make all the RahRah, In the other manufacturer's Threads, please.
I like Pretty much all the Manufacturers, including TG. And this particular thread, Has had Negative opinions. That might hurt them.
So again, the RAHRAH posts In their respective sections, would be great.

Indeed that would be great; as long as the negative comments about other manufacturers are also kept to their respective threads. FWIW, I have never bought anything just because someone else bought it; opinions with reasons are the most useful.

 

[Combat]

I respectfully disagree in regards to the "RJ"...

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View attachment 44903

The Germans did have prototypes with similar designs but there were no "Rammjagers" as depicted by KC. Someone else noted the plane you reference is a Fieseler 103 and there are some obvious differences with the RJ - for example compare the location of the engine on the Fiesler.

 

[damian]

Personally I think accuracy issues are a legitimate issue to discuss on this forum. You may personally not be hung up about it but it is still a valid discussion point on a forum dedicated to toy soldiers. So IXEC is quite within his rights to raise issues of accuracy about an up comming model. When the Ramjager came out there were similar debates and there were those who were happy to buy it regardless. The sad thing was that those with the accuracy concerns were shouted down by and large. Many of those posters no longer post and that is a great tragedy. In this case it just happens that two manufacturers are bringing out the same plane. So it is legitimate to compare accuracy issues. It is a bit artificial to say you must keep the two discussions separate.
Just to remind everyone about the accuracy debate over the last three years here goes.

• Ramjager
• WWI German armored car
• Whitewashed panzers for BOB
• Plumes on Russian Napoloenics
• Unit markings
• Elephant at Normandy
• Heydrich's car being the wrong color

I may have missed a few but I think the list provides a reasonable overview of the issues.

 

[OzDigger]

Personally I think accuracy issues are a legitimate issue to discuss on this forum. You may personally not be hung up about it but it is still a valid discussion point on a forum dedicated to toy soldiers. So IXEC is quite within his rights to raise issues of accuracy about an up comming model. When the Ramjager came out there were similar debates and there were those who were happy to buy it regardless. The sad thing was that those with the accuracy concerns were shouted down by and large. Many of those posters no longer post and that is a great tragedy. In this case it just happens that two manufacturers are bringing out the same plane. So it is legitimate to compare accuracy issues. It is a bit artificial to say you must keep the two discussions separate.
Just to remind everyone about the accuracy debate over the last three years here goes.

• Ramjager
• WWI German armored car
• Whitewashed panzers for BOB
• Plumes on Russian Napoloenics
• Unit markings
• Elephant at Normandy
• Heydrich's car being the wrong color

I may have missed a few but I think the list provides a reasonable overview of the issues.

I agree, and I can well remember stating my opinion regarding all the above errors at the time. However, most collectors continue to base their buying decisions on looks rather than accuracy. I hope things change as collectors become more savey, but I'm not holding my breath.

 

[Mitch]

Ozdigger et al....

You raise a valid point about accuracy and collectors wanting to buy regardless of historical errors however, there are those who are probably just getting into history and use figures and AFV's as the affordable step into the fray. I have no problems with people who buy for the asthetic pleasure from some of the sets released but, can also see those who want historical accuracy.

The problem is that even the so called experts have been getting it wrong for several years and, historical facts and entrenched beliefs have be turned on their head and, forensically disputed but, some will still wish to reamain with the entrenched view.

I watch many history channel type programmes and cringe at the so called history experts who input for these when you see say, things on the blitzkrieg and you see them use the wrong pictures or put them in the wrong context. The recent release of the Osprey battles of WWII is a prime example and in one they show a scuttled ship in Tobruk harbour yet, use a picture of the Graff Spee to represent it. Historical error at the highest level is common place and, it should not be any difference in the toy soldier hobby.

Facts from one reference book are different to another articles on the web are the same and, through my own research I have flagged such points to Wikepedia about SS officers so, you take your chance with what you comment upon as, undoubtedly some will have different facts especially, now when more and more factual information is being unearthed from germany Former soviet union and things found in untouched archives etc.

I watch the posters on here asking if they can use ceratin things with ceratin era's and, have to remind everyone that nobody knows everything about history and, that some historical mistakes will be made in the future by all manufacturers and not one I know of has not made some mistake in their history.

At the end of the day if people buy sets which have some historical issue it does not detract from the fact that they will still enjoy the hobby and, thats what it is all about.
Mitch