WW2 Revisionist History (1 Viewer)

Now as long as you guys promise not to tell Ms Jennifer Anniston this,but i must confess my first date with my good lady back in 1892 or there abouts was a trip to see the Wizard of Oz remastered at the cinema!.(My wife loves the film)there i got it off my chest! all these years i've felt i've been keeping something from you guys,now i'm free!!!!:eek:;):D

Rob
 
Rob said:
Now as long as you guys promise not to tell Ms Jennifer Anniston this,but i must confess my first date with my good lady back in 1892 or there abouts was a trip to see the Wizard of Oz remastered at the cinema!.(My wife loves the film)there i got it off my chest! all these years i've felt i've been keeping something from you guys,now i'm free!!!!:eek:;):D

Rob
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Well seeing as Damian let the cat out of the bag and revealed that "The Wizard of Oz" is going to be one of the eagerly awaited new ranges from K&C this year.....

PS. Was 1892 a typo....:rolleyes::rolleyes::D:D

Cheers :)
H
 
Harrytheheid said:
Well seeing as Damian let the cat out of the bag and revealed that "The Wizard of Oz" is going to be one of the eagerly awaited new ranges from K&C this year.....

PS. Was 1892 a typo....:rolleyes::rolleyes::D:D

Cheers :)
H
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No typo Harry,i've aged really well!!!;)

Rob
 
Rob

1892? So it was the silent version you took her to see

Reb
 
jrsteel said:
Tonight on PBS there's a show on PBS in the U.S. called War Of The World. It's made by historian Niall Fergusen. In it he staes the Allies were really no better than the Axis powers because of the bombings of German and Japanese cities. There's also a book out by Pat Buchanan saying that WW2 was not neccesary and that the main villain was Churchill?? In the book he insinuates the Holocaust happened because of the war. There's another book out called Human Smoke that states the same thing. What's with all this revisionist history? I'm sorry, the Allies were the good guys and Germany and Japan were the bad guys and they needed to be defeated. Simple as that. If you want to read a good book about the last year of the Pacific War and if the firebombings of Tokyo and Atom Bombs were neccesary, read "Retribution".
How do you guys feel about WW2 revisionist history? To me it denigrates the sacrifice of all the Allied soldiers who gave up their lives in the war.
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I have read this book (War of the World) and from my recollection it did NOT state that at all. In fact it noted the difference between the allied bombing of civilians and Nazi extermination scheme as this:

While they both killed non combatants the allied bombing campaign would stop the moment the war was over. The Nazi's on the other hand intended to liquidate entire ethnic groups along with other undesirables.

In other words, the purpose of the allied bombing campaign was to end the war, a noble goal.

It also went on to make the distinction that the allied bombing was more or less random while the Nazis targeted specific groups and people.

One can certainly debate the morality and effectiveness of the strategy but as a person born in Essen I certainly have no problem distinguishing the difference.

This initial post and people's response to it really is quite interesting. Why is it people aren't more skeptical by default? Someone said it on TV so it must be true. I saw a couple of times where Brad (Jazzeum) tried to set the record straight and questioned whether peoiple had actually read the material in question. This was promptly ignored.

As for the rest of the discussion in this thread. Trying to portray the world as good and bad, while comforting, isn't honest. The world is most defintely grey. No race or nationality is predisposed to commit evil deeds. The capacity lies within all of us.
 
Frank,
I have not read the book, but i do know the slant of PBS and if they can make Americans and the free world in general look bad, they will do it. If you've seen the show in question, you might have a better perspective book vs. show. As a rule however people over generalize, I was born in Bremerhaven, my grandfather was a welder by trade and spent most the war building U-boats. Not because he was a fanatical nazi but because the firm where he worked was contracted to build them and he had 7 kids at home to feed. But you constantly hear people say the german people got what they deserved, kill them all because they supported Hitler, blah blah blah. The world is very grey. The first thing a goverment does when it goes to war is to "De-humanize" it's enemy, because thats the only way you can deal with the killing of people who under different circumstances might be in your immediate family, once your in that mode it's hard to distiguish anything about your enemy.
Ray
 
...it is like opening a can of worms. Argument such as these in the forum arises when someone argues for the aggressor. The blame is to the leaders and the people that supported the aggression. Innocent people killed in the land of the aggressor as a result of the retaliation of the offended party is the end result of the aggressors policy...therefore the blame is to its leaders and the backers, period.

Unfortunately, there are people in our country ( yes, I am an American first before my blood heritage and love this country for what it stands) who love to blame America first. They need to go out in the world to see and feel how the people in the offended countries still bear the scars of the brutality and carnage of the last world war. These people are forever grateful of the the blood sacrifice American sons and daughters have shed in the name of freedom.

The post-war recovery, we've seen the economic support of the U.S to these aggressor nations. These nations now far-exceeds the economies of the nations they brutalized. So, to the pro WWII supporters of Japan and Germany should just shut up. You cannot undo what happened in the past.

N-P
 
I've read this whole forum and it's really interesting.I think the governments of Japan and Germany got what they deserved but we really have to think of their people as a whole.There were many fanatics in those countries but the people as a whole were probably law biding decent folks.They grew up being proud of their countries like we all are and probably didn't believe or didn't want to believe what was going on.When the truth was found out they were probably too scared to try to do anything for fear of reprisals against themselves and their families.Very few people have the courage to stand up against their government especially in time of war and especially against tolitarian regimes like Japan and Germany.I remember when I was young and the Vietmam war was going strong.The Viet Cong said the CIA did this and they did that.I laughed at them,saying the US would never do what they accused us of but what happen later? I found out they were telling the truth thats what happened.I truly understand the feeling of our elders when they show bitterness towards Japan and Germany.With what they went through and all the loved ones lost they have earned the right to feel any **** way they want.
Mark
 
Folks,

Please no current politics. I think it may be time to close out this thread.
 
noli-poli said:
...it is like opening a can of worms. Argument such as these in the forum arises when someone argues for the aggressor. The blame is to the leaders and the people that supported the aggression. Innocent people killed in the land of the aggressor as a result of the retaliation of the offended party is the end result of the aggressors policy...therefore the blame is to its leaders and the backers, period.

Unfortunately, there are people in our country ( yes, I am an American first before my blood heritage and love this country for what it stands) who love to blame America first. They need to go out in the world to see and feel how the people in the offended countries still bear the scars of the brutality and carnage of the last world war. These people are forever grateful of the the blood sacrifice American sons and daughters have shed in the name of freedom.

The post-war recovery, we've seen the economic support of the U.S to these aggressor nations. These nations now far-exceeds the economies of the nations they brutalized. So, to the pro WWII supporters of Japan and Germany should just shut up. You cannot undo what happened in the past.

N-P
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I've had numerous conversations with a wide range of Chinese, Manchurian and Korean citizens regarding WWII.
The people I've talked to, and I have no reason to believe their views are not typical, simply HATE, with a very real emphasis on that word, the WWII generation of Japanese - Government, Military, Civilians, the lot.
I've heard no evidence of any ill-will toward present day Japan. Only those responsible for WWII and the sickening events that occurred during the Sino-Japanese War prior to 1941 and then up to 1945.

BTW, just for clarification, I tend to regard Manchuria as being somewhat separate from the rest of modern China, even though it's not even called by that name anymore. The people in that general area just seem different somehow.

Regards
H
 
Guys there is only one thing to learn from war, don't have another.

You would think after all mankinds history this lesson would have been learned.

It really doesn't matter who was right, and who was wrong, lives were cut
short and thats all that really matters.

My dad is 87 now, fought all through WWII was wounded and awarded the
Bronze Star. Over the years he has watched war after war follow the one to end all wars.

He believes wars should be fought by the leaders/generals while the soldiers watch.....they would be over in minutes, I think he may have a point.

Njja
 
Njja said:
Guys there is only one thing to learn from war, don't have another.

You would think after all mankinds history this lesson would have been learned.

It really doesn't matter who was right, and who was wrong, lives were cut
short and thats all that really matters.

My dad is 87 now, fought all through WWII was wounded and awarded the
Bronze Star. Over the years he has watched war after war follow the one to end all wars.

He believes wars should be fought by the leaders/generals while the soldiers watch.....they would be over in minutes, I think he may have a point.

Njja
Click to expand...
John,

Well said!
 
damian said:
Is Vietnam considered as current then Brad?
Regards
Damian
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Hope not Damian.
Opening up this particular Pandora's Box offers the prospect of endless further entertainment as they try to justify/unjustify.
In fact, I shall be extremely interested in how the deliberate targeting of civilians during the bombing campaign on Hanoi is discussed. And, indeed, the slaughter of thousands upon thousands of other non-combatants. (Who just happened to be Asians in the wrong place at the wrong time, by the way).
 
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